Re: Coronavirus
 

I don't know if they changed it here in BC, but last I saw BC went more hardcore and said no medical exemptions at all, which did have some doctors in the news making waves, but I don't know if the government backtracked at all, things too fast, too often to keep track of everything.

I found an updated article seems there is some vague possibility of medical exemptions but it didn't actually list any details, as to what the requirements would be, just that a medical exemption might be an option in some cases.

Re: Coronavirus
 

That's not strictly true... there are two 'advised' reasons - but there are many reasons that are not included in those 2.. https://health.gov.on.ca/en/pro/prog...accination.pdf

Re: Coronavirus
 

Yes it seems that we are in a never ending round of new rules to stop this thing in its tracks. Today in BC it was announced that all children from 5 years will be added to the mask mandate for indoors because they are now having to wear them in school it makes sense they say because they aren't vaccinated. So we have now moved the blame game for transmission to all the unvaxxed kids who can't get it anyway because of their age. Prior to this it was young adults who were the bad people because they weren't vaccinating so we came up with passports but kids don't need them yet. We can eat at a coffee shop seated unvaxxed but not in a restaurant seated unvaxxed yet we can be served by an unvaxxed person. We can travel by ferry unvaxxed but not by plane. We can fly to the US but we can't drive???? Currently Israel have stated that all vaccine passports will no longer be valid unless the person has had the third shot.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Apart from examples of healthcare systems being overwhelmed as noted above:

- the cost per ICU C-19 patient is $50K. And they are not paying out of their pockets. Vaccinating you are protecting the taxpayer’s pocket.
- Full ICUs cause lock-downs to prevent healthcare system from being completely overwhelmed. Lockdowns cost businesses workers and, again, the taxpayer. Vaccination prevents all of that.
- I’ve seen studies that for Delta vaccination reduces the risk of passing the virus to a close contact by 10%. More for other variants. Businesses are doing what they can to reduce risk. Seems reasonable.
- On top of that, businesses don’t want to lose lots of their staff for long periods of time or forever. Enforcing vaccination makes business sense.

But we agree that vaccination should have been mandated on a consistent basis, federally and a long time ago. Decision makers are missing a spine.

Re: Coronavirus
 

No sign of relief in Saskatchewan yet.
"Saskatchewan has been forced to cancel 200 surgeries a day as it tries to combat the rising numbers of cases, according to Dr. Hassan Masri, an intensive care specialist who works at Royal University Hospital and St. Paul's Hospital in Saskatoon. We have [had] over 200 surgeries and procedures being cancelled every single day now for the last two weeks," he said in an interview. "So we're talking about almost 3,000 surgeries and procedures that have been cancelled over the span of two weeks."
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saska...ewan-1.6200378
Edit: While this is an opinion piece, it's chock full of good old professional research, results, and data about vaccine effectiveness and how the way it was introduced (getting everyone the first dose as fast as possible and delaying the 2nd shot) seems to be paying off.
"Dr. Danuta Skowronski, a vaccine effectiveness expert and epidemiology lead at the BCCDC whose research laid the groundwork for the decision to hold back second doses based on the "fundamental principles of vaccinology," says the early data is extremely encouraging."
https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/canad...ines-1.6205993

Re: Coronavirus
 

A local brewery has been flooded with messages of support since a nasty customer incident on Friday night:
"A gentleman had made a reservation for what we thought was a table of six," said Heise. "When he arrived, when we asked for proof of vaccination, he showed us … a picture of a middle finger. "
https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6206557
I checked, and sure enough there was still one of these bad boys in the fridge; I'm doing this to show solidarity. ;)

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...ca1629f5e.jpeg

Re: Coronavirus
 

Karen's brother Kevin.

You're a good comrade :D

Re: Coronavirus
 

Christ this third shot hit me hard, I was pretty much wiped out all of yesterday. Chills, temperature, fatigue, blah blah blah. These microchips are hard on the body.
feeling fine now though.

Re: Coronavirus
 

You would think that a 3rd shot wouldn't be needed. Just download it via the microchip.

Re: Coronavirus
 

How was your first 2 in comparison?

But these COVID vaccines are pretty harsh compared to any others I ever had, the moderna was I was not expecting it to be as rough as it was, I thought maybe like flu vaccine a little sore, a little tired, but holy was it so much worse, but only about 12-16 hours of it, then back to normal so not horrible just not pleasent.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The first two shots were Pfizer and weren’t an issue. The 3rd was Moderna and hit me much harder. The nurse gave me a choice of one or the other but said something about the Moderna being more effective against the delta variant so I foolishly opted for that instead.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I think I want to try Pfizer if I ever get a 3rd, Moderna hit me hard like you describe, I swear at one point I was hullacinating during the fever but maybe it was just a lucid dream, world will never know. :rofl:

Re: Coronavirus
 

Sorry you felt so bad but glad you're ok now. And all vaxxed up! :thumbup:

If I'm offered a third jab I'll take whatever's available. People were running around like chooks with their heads cut off about the 'risk' of the AZ vaccine and I didn't buy into that nonsense, so AZ, Pfizer, Moderna - bring it on.

Re: Coronavirus
 

On the issue of how much an ICU patient costs, I can never understand these sorts of things. The staff are employed anyway so, if they weren't treating someone in ICU, they would be treating someone somewhere else. I accept that overtime may be an issue but I cannot imagine that all of the expense is overtime and, yes, I accept that there is a cost to keep the lights on and the temperature controlled.

I am not against vaccination but, if the reductions you have suggested are correct, it would appear that those vaccinated are almost as capable of passing the virus on as those that aren't. Now, if the reduction was the other way around and they only had 10% of the chance that an unvaccinated did, it could be argued that the vaccinated pose way less of a risk to others as a non-vaccinated would.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I went in the Superstore liquor store this morning (don't judge me!) and the clerk politely asked for proof of vaccination and ID. We use an app from gurgle playstore and verify our status then enter the qr code from our account at the saskhealth website... remember to breathe... and it gives you green for go or red for no. I just touch the app on my phone and show him this cert and my driver's license.
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...f952c4aaaa.jpg

Re: Coronavirus
 

Any links to the app available?

Re: Coronavirus
 

This one; I'm not sure about the one marked Verifier, but it is probably part of the same scheme.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...hl=en_US&gl=US

Re: Coronavirus
 

They've been telling us here that we can show anything that proves it - even the original form with the stamps/stickers on or a photo of it. Or the official form available on our 'NB health accounts" along with ID like a medicare card. Bit odd as there's no ID photo on a medicare card.

But it's only needed for non-essential services. Way back last year in the original lockdown, the liquor stores were open along with essential grocery and pharmacy stores, so being essential last year, I thought they would be again this year. If they're not I may need to go myself instead of sending my needle phobic, unvaxxed stepson :(

Re: Coronavirus
 

Where there's a will, there's a way. The card we got when getting the shot works too.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The problem are the ever changing rules and regulations on this and often the logic is very very hard to understand. And even if you ask questions, one still doesn't get an answer.
I am still struggling with the idea that people can apparently visit a sports event ( like hockey arenas ) and sit next to each other, whilst they still require testing even for the vaccinated ones when coming into Canada.
The risk of getting the virus during a sports event is way higher than airline travel.
Also, why is there so much discussion on whether Canadians can now use the land border and drive to the US, whilst flying to the US is apparently allowed? Let alone, why US Americans could come to Canada by car, I don't even want to ask, but that lack of reciprocity was also never explained.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I became aware of this yesterday:
I appreciate that it was made earlier this year but, if the science it is based upon is correct, it's hard to understand why its findings are not being pushed by media. It appears to suggest that, so long as one doesn't suffer any long terms consequences of the infection, one is better placed after being infected than after being vaccinated.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The problem is only that one needs to be vaccinated to travel somewhere.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I accept that. Whether that will remain as the data continues to be collected is another story.

We are constantly being told that the measures are based on science, even when the science contradicts the alleged reasons for the measures.

This made me smile:

https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...c2&oe=618FA840

"People watch the Handmaid's Tale and think, that could never happen. People would not accept it." There are accepting lots at the minute that would have appeared to have been ludicrous a short time ago and no-one appears to be questioning the measures. One wonders what measures will be required when the current ones are shown not to work either.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I watched enough to get the gist. An interesting question.

I found something useful on the NY Times probably paywalled but I was able to access parts.
And then
with other stuff about antibodies dropping to undetectable levels in a third of people who recovered.

I came across this one which appears to back natural immunity over vaccine immunity but there's an extra bit.
Conclusions So even if natural immunity was better than vaccine immunity, both are considered than either one.

Perhaps ideally, we should all be vaccinated, then get covid and have the best of both worlds. ;)

Seriously, though, I'm finding more and different sources that say vaccine is better.

I did find that Natural News (a far-right, anti-vaccination conspiracy theory and fake news website known for promoting alternative medicine, pseudoscience, and far-right extremism) is promoting natural immunity over vaccine immunity among its other claims of the vaccines killing almost a quarter as many of the death by covid figure and how Vitamin D could end Covid. :nod:

That's really all I need to know.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I don't really disagree with anything you have stated and, of course, natural immunity is no good if getting it kills you, as I stated above.

What I would like to see discussed more in the general media, is that there is an alternative to vaccines for some, rather than the current vitriol of "if you are not vaccinated you are a selfish pig" or words to that effect, that are constantly bandied about. If I was elderly and with an underlying condition, I would want the vaccine. If I was 18, I doubt that I would want it. As you are aware, I have had 2 shots. I will not be getting a third shot.

As we know, vaccines have not resolve the issue so the question them becomes: What next?

Re: Coronavirus
 

I think that last part might be more (anti) social media rather than general ;)
I googled "natural immunity vs vaccine" and search results on the first page included NYTimes, NBC, GlobalNews, Washington Post, Fox, Times of India, National Post, Aljazeera, Newsweek, CBC, NPR and a variety of US state and city newspapers, TV, radio stations. And the Calgary Herald.

These are the news based site results as opposed to the others such as medical ones like mayo & bmj, facebook, Reddit, youtube contributions etc

Perhaps the general media feels it's been discussed sufficiently for a conclusion. :unsure:
It may be more accurate to say that the current level of take-up of vaccines have not resolved the issue. Or a combination of current levels together with mask requirements being lifted.

The guy in that video is, no doubt, well meaning but when you read the comments made by people viewing it you can see they are riddled with people who are anything from outright anti-vaxxers, to people with extreme ideas about 'big pharma', through those who like to think they've "done their research" and what Nicki Minaj passed on or uncle Billy who knows about these things and so on....and maybe it's preventing 80% from becoming 90%.

Perhaps the vaccine passport requirements may help. NB is one of those regions reporting an increase in those taking their first jab. :fingerscrossed:

Re: Coronavirus
 

I managed to get the Delta variant the same week I got my 1st shot. The medical person said I was going to have super immunity once I was fully vaxed. 2nd shot happens tomorrow. I went for Pfizer after reading up. Moderna is supposed to be harsher on your body but provide better immunity.

Re: Coronavirus
 

My 2nd shot was Moderna (first dose was Astra Zeneca) and it was 12 hours of the worst experience in a very long time, I don't recall any illness in my adult life ever causing me to feel that horrendous, but flip side my wife got Moderna on the same day, and she only had a sore arm, I had mild reaction to AZ and she had 12 hours of fever and body aches and felt miserable.

Just never know how you will react to a vaccine, and I have no idea how good or long lasting the immunity is with the AZ/mRNA combo long term.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Both my daughter’s shots were Moderna. She was OK with the first, she was a little out of sorts with cold like symptoms after the second. A small price to pay methinks.

Re: Coronavirus
 

2nd shot is definitely doing a number on me. Was planning a last ride out on my motorcycle. Hopefully tomorrow will still be fine and I'll go then.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Air Canada has banned Air Canada flights from Vancouver from October 16 to 29th due to one passenger aboard Air Canada flight AC007, arriving in Hong Kong from Vancouver on Oct. 13 being COVID positive and another passenger on the same flight failed to comply with requirements set by Hong Kong.

https://www.richmond-news.com/local-...-weeks-4521527

Re: Coronavirus
 

Wow that's a hit for Air Canada, i wonder if there will be any further action or fines levied? Someones getting grief over this. :o

Re: Coronavirus
 

But anti-vaxxers are selfish as well as dumb. What is the alternative?

Re: Coronavirus
 

Over 83% of people over 11 yr old are now fully vaccinated in Ontario.

Re: Coronavirus
 

But the point Almost Canadian is trying to make is that not everyone who isn't vaccinated is an anti vaxer.. but they are treated and reviled in the same way, as if they are.

Re: Coronavirus
 

In Newfoundland, the Vaxpass enables those with medical exemptions to get a QR code that still shows green - like those with a vaccination record. That seems like an approach that should go some way to eliminating poor treatment of those that can't get vaccinated, assuming they have a medical exemption of course. From Friday, proof of vaccination is required to get into public spaces - restaurants etc. Interestingly enough, I received an email from my eldests Pathfinders group leader earlier. The church hall that they use for meetings now requires all groups to enforce the vaccine mandate i.e use the vaxpass for 12+. Not a problem for my daughter as she is fully vaccinated. It was a refreshingly positive move from a church though, unlike the Anglian Bishop in Central NL who is lamenting the dilemma that the rules put his church in as it's against Anglican thoelogy apparently to deny services to anyone, even if they are antivaxer loons. Given that most of the recent cases in NL including recent deaths have been linked to church groups, primarily pentecostal ones (The euphemism used is "Socially Connected Groups" in the govt reporting), his views are getting little sympathy. In contrast the local synagogue and Muslim association have embraced the vaccine requirement.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Around here is a stronghold of anti-vax nutters and vaccination rates locally were shocking low until ice hockey started. Children cannot participate in minor league ice hockey unless the parents have proof of vaccination. The prospect of having to spend evenings in close proximity to their children has been enough to get even the swivel eyed loons jabbed. All progress is good progress, I suppose.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Saskatchewan is flying 6 ICU patients to Ontario to try to take some pressure off, but Premier Moe just seems to be a little late in everything; late to ask the feds for help, late to ask the army for help, and just too late in implementing or unwilling to implement most of the things our Chief Medical Health Officer, Dr. Saqib Shahab recommends.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saska...d-19-1.6215188
Revelations that the province asked everyone else for help before going to the feds aren't winning the Premier any prizes, and the leader of the opposition is a physician who has been calling him out at every opportunity. In this solidly Conservative province (currently), the NDP will have their knives out.
The Opposition NDP has charged that the delay is political in nature given the terse relationship between Moe and the federal government.
“For over a month, we’ve been calling on the government to speak to the military, to the federal government, to get every piece of help they’re able to. And instead they’ve refused,” Meili said.
https://thestarphoenix.com/news/sask...v-for-icu-help

Re: Coronavirus
 

Hmmmm Hamilton has a strange way of reporting fatalities. "deaths are included whether or not Covid was determined to be a contributing or underlying cause of death" - it seems if you were in a vehicle accident, had a heart attack or fell off a building - or any other reason, and then tested positive - the death is included in the statistics, despite the reason for death being unrelated... (notes) https://www.hamilton.ca/coronavirus/...es-in-hamilton

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...0c3fc8c4bc.jpg

Re: Coronavirus
 

Just got my booster; now gotta wait 15 minutes to see if I grow horns or a tail.
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...a6e091e56b.jpg