mark donna

well my flight has been cancelled back to england so ive another few days mooching around esuri
ive been for 3 long walks around the site and have many thoughts on were,what,how esuri moves on from here and the main one is there has got to be a point of contact an office were we can be informed when new developments are going to start and more importantly when are started developments going to be finished if you came on to esuri now you would not know were to go to buy an apt/house yet there must be thousands for sale all over the site
i walked past the development were they built the 3 showhouses last year they put the roads in planted the palm trees built the showhouses and then locked it all up (did anyone ever get to have a look in them as they look quite nice from the outside) the sign with the phon number on has 1/2 blown down now.will they ever come back
TASA what is happening with them are they in admin? have they gone bust ?how many people bought off plan? is the a way back or will that development sit there for years
RAGO 2(on the hill) this is the biggest mystery to me which banker gave the go ahead to build all them apts when they hadnt sold the majority of the 1st phase. are they all fitted out or are they just shells? what does the future hold for them
COMMUNNAL AREAS when will they get developed or at least all the rubbish and rocks removed then it might be able to be landscaped
THE BIG HILL AND CAR PARK(by j+ks house) are there any plans for this to be taken down and apartments built there because if there is surely it would be better to be taken down asap and left as the disruption it would cause later would be immense or should we just have a car park in front of a hill.
PLOTS how many plots are ready to move and how many are going to stay with no building in the forseeable future
GOLF(EAST COURSE) who now builds a club house or even a shop ive played golf all over the world and have never come across a course were you are a 20 min walk away to the clubhouse or pro shop no wonder there is very few people playing it
HOTEL is there any plans in the forseeable future for work to restart on the hotel is there anyone going out to perspective buyers to sell the hotel i have tried googling 1/2 built hotel esuri and nothing comes up
the list could go on but i do believe that through having a central office which could be one of the units by lomas and a proffesional person working on our side we might be able to move forward with how we want the development to go this is what i would like to see if we have an EUC it should be to benefit the site not to go into a black hole were we do not see any benefit we need someone we can communicate to and someone who can get our questions answered.

spanish_lawyer

Hello Mark donna!!.

I am going to try to answer some of your questions or doubts.

- TASA: is in banckrupt. Another company more. I only be two companies that continue working. Sea & Sun, which stopped the construction and Frinver (Vista Hermosa) which has finished his promotion and is in sale.

- RAGO 2: If the real estate (MF) asked for a borrowing to the bank, they have used the money until the bank has said: BE ENOUGH!!. When they have not had money, they have left the work without finishing. In Spain, it is very normal (or it was) to buy on plane. The motive is that it is cheaper to buy when the product is not finished yet. In the past, the difference between buying on plane or with the finished product it could suppose a difference of 30-40 %. Again, the persons in charge are the real estate entreprise (MF). They are forced to finish all the works that they have begun. I know that there are many persons in TASA and RAGO that have given money to buy a house and this one to finish. This is a great problem. I, as lawyer, have had many persons' requests that want I solve legally problem them.

- NOVAINDES: Novaindes is the real estate company which constructed three showhouses that your you say. They constructed it (I saw them!!) and later they left them because they did not have clients.

- GOLF(EAST COURSE): I did not have knowledge of the news that you tell in this forum.

- HOTEL: You have reason. The construction is not begun, nor exists plans to begin it. The responsibility of this project is, again, MF.

- COMMERCIAL CENTRE: The project of urbanization indicates that have to exist two commercial centres. There is one, which is to the half. Will MF finish the construction?.

- You say: "i do believe that through having a central office which could be one of the units by lomas and a proffesional person working on our side we might be able to move forward with how we want the development to go this is what i would like to see if we have an EUC it should be to benefit the site not to go into a black hole were we do not see any benefit we need someone we can communicate to and someone who can get our questions answered".

Personally I have less and less hopes in the current members of the EUC. Every time I think that the solution to CE is in the creation of a Residents Association, which presses directly to the Board of the CE and the Town Hall. We are many members of the EUC, I believe necessary that exists only a voice who dialogue with the Board. I believe that it is the unique solution to the current disinformation and to the decentralization that we, all the members of the EUC, have.

SL

spanish_lawyer

Hi Jon-Bxl!!!!!

Firstly, I have a lot envy!!. I was a few days in CE and I had a fantastic social life too. Every day, I work very much, and when I can, and my obligations allow it to me, I am going to Ayamonte to enjoy the life. My dream is to move to living there. I would be happy!!.

After reading your post, I understand that in the future there will be two payments: the first one in June, and the second one in December. Therefore, in June of this new year, there will be another bill.

With regard to MF, I can affirm that IT HAS NOT PAID. The members of the Board say "they will pay". I already have commented on this thread, any payment that MF should do has to be approved by the managers(administrators) of MF. Personally I think: if MF does not pay the Community of all its properties, and it has several sentences of judgments that it forces them to it. Who MF is going to pay voluntarily the quotas CE?. In the next meeting on 5th February, I want that THEY PROVE that MF has paid.

Kind regards,

SL

mark donna

thanks for your comments sl i think you might of misunderstood some of my sentences as my grammar is quite poor
i do not know who is going to build a pro shop/club house for the east course but i do believe without them it will not be able to survive long term i also believe that potentially the east course is by far the best course of the 2 but needs to be promoted far more then it is now.
i do not understand your quote on the hotel as it is 2/3s built my assumption would be that it would now go out to developers around the world as a going concern who
on the commercial centres there are i believe another 5 of the smaller centres to build around the site but i think it is now very clear that esuri will never require this many due to the amount of houses/apts used as holiday homes and not lived in all year round someone needs to decide what to put in their place (gardens,landscaped)
are you saying we should have a residents committee?
i would rather we had a professional body which was part of the euc but we could air our views to as the site progresses it should act more like a development corporation.

EsuriJohn

Both East and West course are operated from the clubhouse that has been opened on the west course.

To the best of my knowledge there was never a proposal to have a completely separate club based on the east course. There was a proposal to use the parts of the temporary clubhouse from the west course and it was moved to the east course car park but never started before Fadesa went into administration and then removed completely.

As for hotels the original plan had 3 hotels one five star and 2 four star. Only one four star was started for Barcelo who were partnered with Fadesa. When Martinsa took Fadesa over they broke up the partnership and Barcelo withdrew and the construction stopped. It seems to me that the hotel at the entrance to the site had reached the point where a hotel operator would take over the shell and fit it out to their requirements. Without Barcelo this is not happening and in the current climate I would say it could be a while before another company such as Hilton or Accor step up to finish the hotel. The other two hotels have never started and just before the administration the signs changed to Aparthotels but nothing has happened.

You are correct that the proposal was for one large commercial center and 5 smaller ones, one of these has been built and one shop opened but it has failed once and needs all of our support to stay open. The large commercial center is again at the fit out stage but Eroski who were the anchor supermarket have withdrawn and like the hotel it is going to be a long haul.

mark donna

i think you are confirming the present situation which i am aware of what i am saying is that if we are going to have an euc part of its job should be promoting the site and having a central office were issues can be raised.

just google quinta do vale (opp esuri)and you will get a proffesional website telling you what they are trying to develop esuri only has estate agent websites which are becoming less and less due to the present climate and i believe the bad press construction has had in spain

i can not believe that the east course will survive without some form of sattelite club and shop why would they build such a huge car park without any facilities its set up just does not work any golfer will tell you that after playing 18 holes in hot temps they just want to plonk their backside at the nearest table and enjoy a drink

we all agree that there are too many commercial areas but starting with the one at the front of la jarra this should be landscaped and made into a grassed area

do you know if the hotel has been marketed to any interested parties i would be very surprised if it has
as i said in my previous post i have no problem in paying the euc if i can see were the money is being spent at the present moment i just see it as a means of keeping a few more gardeners off spains unemployment register.

EsuriJohn

Yes that would appear to be one view.

sagalaut

We call it quality.

mark donna

i call it common sense

sagalaut

And not just the website......

spanish_lawyer

Hello!!

I have read all yours post and I have my opinion about some of the aspects:

- Firstly, one question. Where is the average constructed hotel?. I know very well CE and I haven’t seen this hotel.

- Mark donna, you say “i would rather we had a professional body which was part of the euc but we could air our views to as the site progresses it should act more like a development corporation.”. I answered you: you already have this professional body, it is called a Board of the EUC. You can dialogue with them for e-mail, phone or his offices. You can comment with them on your opinions, your suggestions. It already exists. Since it exists, and according to my opinion, it does not work, I suggested create a Residents Association, in which a members' committee of the EUC are the speakers who dialogue in name of all with the Board. I believe that all of us have a problem: we cannot speak like, with whom to speak, that to say. We should create a representative who informs the EUC of our initiatives and who informs the rest of members of the initiatives of the EUC.

- In the development project is included:

*1.937 detached houses
*4.047 mass housing (grouped housings) - Apartment hotel, pueblo I, pueblo II, Residencial Golf, Apartments La Colina-
* 1 luxury hotel (300 rooms)
* 1 hotel 4*: (300 rooms)
* 1 hotel 3*: (240 rooms)
* 2 commercial centres (one is middle building)
* Golf (is finished because Aymerich, the company management, had finished because MF didn’t to finish doing golf courses)
* Sports space (58.011 m2)
* Schools (103.907 m2)
* Social space (44.205 m2)
* Green space (477.064 m2)
* Roads and parkings (371.010 m2)

- This is the debt that MF has with all of us.

- I do not worry me like, but I want that this project they finish it. Our obligation is to demand that there is fulfilled what we buy.

- With regard to the existing problems in the golf courses, according to my opinion, they are secondary. I believe (it is my opinion) that we have to spend our energy in forcing MF to finish the whole project, not in asking for connections between courses.

- Do not be how much readers of this forum are registered in Ayamonte. The registration (placing on the voting register) is very important. In Spain everything moves for political interests. Actually, I do not have any political interest. Only I want that MF finishes the development project, to force to pay, that the EUC works correctly.

- I am not registered in Ayamonte, but I will not have any problem in doing it if a political party is capable of promising me that it will fulfil these obligations.

- I already have indicated that I know Alberto Fernández, candidate for Mayor for the Partido Popular. I propose that each of us we should write which are our worries with regard to CE, what we expect from CE, how we think that it is possible to solve the current situation. When I have a list of offers, I promise to comment on it with him. I want solutions, I don´t happen anything that to turn to political appointments.

- I hope yours commentaries and opinions.

Regards,


SL.

spanish_lawyer

Regards.

Jon-Bxl

Dear SL

Happy New year and THANK YOU for all the trouble you have gone to - to inform us of the situation and your opinions as well. You have really raised the debate on the firum.

I re-checked with the administrators. They will not comment on MF's ability to pay and say that they will take action against them if they dont pay.

They wont comment on whether MF will lose their voting rights if they dont pay - and will 'look at it at the time'. Hmmmm.

Finally the bill we were sent in December is an ANNUAL bill - and therefore the June and December bills will be approximately that divided by 2 each. So if your December 09 bill was 200 (say for ease) - your June/December 2010 bill will be about 100 Each - of course allow for some inflation/change. Hmmm interesting, this is not bad.... as annoyed as I am with the EUC, this amount is not so bad.

I am happy with the level of contact I am getting from the Administrators - a positive so far. So I have no complaints about them, and appreciste the responses. As lawyers I kind of understand that they wont be drawn on certain subjects... so wouldnt answer my questions on MF's ability to pay and also whether their voting rights will be taken away in case of non-payment. Lets see what happens if MF dont pay in February...

Anyway even though it was VERY wet and rained and stormed all the time, we had a fantastic time there... and were sad to go. I'm glad, SL that you enjoyed it so much and hope you will be able to buy and become a neighbour... also we need a good lawyer in Ayamonte!

Have fun on your visits there in 2010

Jon

Jon-Bxl

Just had a thought.... since MF havent paid the mortgages on many of their properties, is it possible that the majority of the properties have reverted to the banks?

Sure MF have huge outstanding debts for everything they didnt pay before (intercomm, comm, IBI etc). But they transfer to the new owners.

But maybe going forward if they dont have the properties then everything including outstanding debts are actually due from the banks.

IF this is the case there is no point going after MF for the debts. For the other promises for the development - yes, but the debts - I dont know.

Does anybody know roughly what numbers of onsold properties are MF vs the Banks??

Thanks
Jon

EsuriJohn

Great news to have the EUC bill already paid confirmed as an annual bill doesn't seem so bad now.

I understood from one of SL's early posts that he already has a place on CE and loves the place as much as us. What he is wishing for is to be able to live full time on CE and not just for the holidays. For sure I will be standing shoulder to shoulder with him at the re-convened annual meeting in February.

Got a good feeling for the amount of rain Ayamonte has had from my daily weather updates here: -

http://www.weather.com/outlook/trave...opnav_business

but your piccies of the Marisma are amazing to think that normally the arroya is a mere trickle and now the whole area is awash!

From today the forecast is much better and the sun returns lets hope till next winter if and only if the dams are full and the water levels have been restored.