quiltman

Take your point InvinoVeritas, but the main point is that DTTs are specific to the UK and another country. For the Philippines, UK State & Government pensions are specifically EXCLUDED from the DTT, but , if you are registered for tax here you should be able to offset any UK tax paid against that owing to the BIR. Unless you are on a visa that specifically allows the remitting of funds from the UK free of tax - such as the SRRV.Yes, you can get private pensions paid gross , but if your State and/or government pensions take you above the UK tax free limit you will be taxed at source in the UK. Just the State pension means no tax as it's below the tax free limit. The only exceptions are for a couple of countries - USA is one - whereby you can get ALL your UK income tax free as HMRC liase with the US Internal Revenue and therefore know if you are registered for tax there.
Here's the link for the UK/Philippines DTT.
Double Taxation Treaties: territory residents with UK income - Publications - GOV.UK

InVinoVeritas

That's the bit I have a problem with Quiltman, I think Pete's UK state pension should be paid gross. Have a look at this and see if you agree:-

How is my State Pension taxed? | The Pensions Advisory Service

Gazza-d

If you are getting the full state pension plus a good bit of second state pension on top you could creep above the tax threshold.

quiltman

Exactly Gazza-d! My SERPS is more than the State Pension but as it's paid by the DWP they cannot tax it directly. If I only had this as my income, I would have to do a self assessment each year and pay HMRC what I owed. Now, if I was an expat I don't know how HMRC would be able to come after me! If you keep a UK bank account and have your pension paid into it, then HMRC can take what you owe from it - the law changed recently to allow this.Caused a bit of a fuss at the time!
In Vino - If Pete ONLY has the BASIC State Pension then yes, this will be paid gross as it's below the tax free allowance. Any other pension will be added, and if this takes him above the allowance, any tax due taken from his other pension provider. I have PMd Pete with notes on the UK/Philippine tax relationships. Been through it all myself!

InVinoVeritas

There is a similar thread on state pensions on the Malaysia forum which explores this subject in some depth:-

http://britishexpats.com/forum/malay...idents-857249/

Gazza-d

The UK has a reciprical aggreement with the Philippines, it does not have one with Malaysia so you cannot use the malaysia model.

InVinoVeritas

OK, I've had confirmation from a tax specialist friend of mine that UK state pensions CAN be paid gross to a UK national resident in the Philippines. This is what he said:

Normally, any pension payments above individual personal allowances will be taxed at source in the UK but, if you are resident abroad, and you inform HMRC that your pension will be taxed in your country of residence, then HMRC will authorise payment of your pension without deduction of tax.

HMRC require to have the Philippines Tax Identification Number (TIN) in order to grant the approval. You have to go to the BIR and register as a tax payer for them to issue a TIN ID card.

The UK state pension will be taxed at 0% in the Philippines as would any supplementary or private pension. UK Government and non-Government pension (full list here:- INTM343040 - DT claims and applications - Types of income: Pensions and Annuities) will continue to be taxed in the UK.

Hope this helps clarify the situation.

++IVV

Philosophical 11

Thanks all for the additional info. Also to Quiltman for your pm. I reckon it will be academic really because for two reasons: I am going through a separation process and my biggest pension (military) will be split. So the income from my 3 pensions will probably be below the tax threshold. Fortunately, we have house proceeds to be divided so that will be a cushion. Also, I believe to obtain a TIN requires either SRRV or 13a visa. Anyway, I will do some more research when it becames applicable.

Talking about money (makes a change from gf) I answered an advert from a UK company that expats can claim back income tax. No idea what that is about, but I am in the early stages of enquiry. Might be related to the double taxation issue. Will let you know.

Gf seems to have got her on-line gold jewellery business moving. Saw her pick up about 20k in Western Union from a fb customer in Australia. Going to try and get her BPI account on-line to save the money transfer fees. However, she has to get the jewellery to Australia which seems a problem by way of shipping fees and customs. Guess she is flying blind at the moment. But it seems a bit typical....groundwork comes after jumping into the deep end.

No idea if this is unique to her or a Filipina trait. She wants things NOW. I said this morning I will try and organise an on-line account today sometime. Gets back home, switch lap top on and within a couple of minutes she is asking if I have arranged the on-line account. Also, if she is expecting something (clothes normally) with a tracking number, it has to be checked about 10 times a day. If there is any undue delay, she asks (but never gets) me to send angry e,mails to the company concerned. I can remember the Xmas tree going up the minute we got back home from an all day 8 hour return journey shopping trip. I just sat and had a well deserved beer. If she buys a cake recipe, it is started within a nano-second of us getting home. Again, I just have a beer.

Anyway. All is good now. However, lets get Xmas out of the way and see how things hang after the season of good will. Also, the separation process when this "rich foreigner" suddenly becomes a poor foreigner. You never know, she might have made so much money she can help buy this house. Or gone back to Kuwait to earn in excess of 18k per month.

Stokkevn

, be very very careful about companies that claim they can get your tax back, most are just a scam. They operate in one of two ways, they either ask for up front security or other type fee or they get all your info off you, claim any tax back for themselves and then strip your bank account of everything they can get their hands on. Check with Company House and https://companycheck.co.uk/ to see their details before you part with any money or details.

Stokkevn

Contacted my company accountant in the UK regarding Tax refund scams, here is his reply

I am aware of companies who operate in this manner and the scam usually runs like this;-

1. You sign and date the relevant pages of Self Assessment Tax Returns and pass the otherwise blank forms to the agent with info re earnings (e.g P60s).
2. He fills in the forms claiming unbelievable amounts of work related expenses (normally traveling expenses) which are not legally due. This generates a supposed over-payment for each tax year.
3. If you are lucky HMRC will refuse to process a refund without evidence to support these expenses claims.
4. If you are unlucky HMRC will simply process the Returns and pay out. Your Returns will, no doubt, be selected later for enquiry. Once the false expenses claims are discovered you will have to repay the tax refund, with interest and very likely a penalty for the incorrect Returns. The agent will have disappeared off the scene when he's got his 40% cut, leaving you to face the music alone.

quiltman

stokkevn is right. Steer clear of anyone who says they can do it for you. The first thing HMRC want is proof you are registered for tax wherever you are living - you may not pay any, but the point of a double taxation treaty is that you only pay tax once.
Download and read the DT-individual form from HMRC - it's very well explained.That's why they need the form certifying by BIR as they do not have this info , unlike the USA where HMRC & the US IR share information.

Stokkevn

I forgot to add that my accountant said that any reputable accountant in the UK would do this for between £100 and £150.

Philosophical 11

Thanks for the info about tax etc. The company I had contacted have recognised that I have an accountant and suggested I pursue the matter through him.

It is nearly the end of the year and I thought I would post random thoughts, jottings and scribbles. I may have to divide this into separate posts as I often get a pinay sitting on my shoulder if I am too long on the laptop.

I sit on the balcony with a cold beer and watch gf sister in the "cellar" adjoining our house. No idea why it is called a "cellar". She is living rent free with all free amenities...courtesy of me. When we first rented this place and began furnishing it, gf thought it would be a good idea to put some furnishings into the "cellar".....just in case we had visitors. I said no. I can see why she wanted some furnishings there now when her sister moved in shortly. It was just for a temporary period. It has been a long temporary period.

Pinays appear to be gifted with 20/20 vision. And have a degree in "Stating The Obvious"... My gf can spot a foreigner at about 5km. She can also spot dog poo at 50 metres. This is when her degree of "Stating the Obvious" kicks in. I am reminded about half a dozen times not to step in it.

They also have adjustable hearing. She can hold a conversation with her sister at 50 metres but sometimes when I speak to her when sitting together she appears not to hear.

Perception of time is interesting. I would ask for instance when the bus is due. Reply is always that it is coming. However that can take between 5 mins and 2 hours.

Perception of distance is also interesting. I would ask where is ....... She would either point with her chin or hand and say its over there. I have since learnt that "over there" could be 10 metre or 10 kilometres.

Never speak about man on the moon, space travel or satellites etc. They think you are talking about witchcraft and Sorcery.

Perceptions....Now this has been the bane of a few documented problems I have had. Main one I guess is when I rented this house. Being simple minded, my perception was that I was paying 10k to rent this house for my gf and I to live in and her family were welcome guests. Wrong. In fact they thought that nice foreigner had rented a house for them to live in. And I was the welcome guest. This difference of perceptions caused a few pages to be written here and numerous pinay pouts. However, after threatening to shower with her visiting young sister and her brother and father helping themselves to the beer that they thought was meant to be shared. It is established that my perception was correct. I am still pondering about her sister who lives free of charge in the cellar. But I have a plan for that.

If a pinay says she has a headache, then that is fair warning that s..t will soon be hitting the fan. This for me has been due to simple money issues. Such as can you buy my father a house. It is only 750k. Or can you take on his debts....pocket money at 80k. This has resulted in many pages written here and more pinay pouts. So far, no more headaches have been forthcoming. But her father is rather upset that the 50k Xmas bonus from the Government is not being paid this year. He spoke to me about it the day. I just made a sad face. He has just been round this morning chatting to my gf. Never understood what was said. But I heard salient words. 3k...4k ...7k He did not say a cheery good morning as he usually does. Maybe I can expect a pinay headache soon.

Anyway. Gf is lurking in my direction so I shall resume my random thoughts, jottings and scribbles later. Maybe she has a headache.

quiltman

Thanks . Made me smile! Hope you've bought all the relatives lovely ( and expensive) Xmas gifts? you are a kano after all.

Stokkevn

Great insight as usual Don't let the gf catch you or you will both be out on your ear. Mine has the same problem, if it is important, always start the conversation with "Is this your P100 note?"