Philosophical 11

Most true Gazza. I have heard that you can buy a Condo instead. No idea if that is true. Have also heard that there are "ways" around the system. But good advice nonetheless. Thanks

Gazza-d

Yes you can buy a condo but there are conditions, the complex must be at least 60% filipino owned. And no there are no legal ways around ownership of land apart for inheritance, but even then I believe you would need to sell to a filipino with a reasonable length of time. The are many schemes and scams so be aware.

quiltman

The only way "around" it is for a corporation to buy the land. Trouble is the corporation has to have 60% Filipino directors, foreigners can make up the 40%. different set of pitfalls to watch out for. you can buy a condo as legally you never own the land but service charges can be high and they only have an official life of 50 years and are difficult to sell since so many new ones are being built. good luck for the future! Maybe you can find somewhere else to rent locally?

Gazza-d

And exactly why C.A. No. 108 was inacted.

nonthaburi

Phew, I've just been sitting here and I've read through all of this thread, and what a thread it is. Although I'm married to a Thai and not a Pinay I found myself nodding my head or smiling at so many things.

I thought I might share some of my own experiences and ways of doing things that might be relevant. As other people have said, the key to all this is the relationship with the family, and where you fit in, and money is a big part of that.

When I was first with my wife, over ten years ago now, we really didn't have any money at all, and she knew that, so it was a case of if the money is finished we have to borrow. And on one occasion her mother pawned her gold so that we had food. Times were tough, but they have improved a lot as time has gone on.

When we were first together I used to pay for everything as it came up, shopping etc, going out blah blah blah. But one thing my wife always said was that she didn't like having to ask for money all the time. Which was fair enough really as I wouldn't want to do that either. What I didn't know at this point was how cr** my wife was at sticking to a budget. In her words,'If I have money I spend it.'

So I started off by giving her an allowance every month that was to cover everything except alcohol. I paid the rent and all bills. Everything else she paid for, which was good so that she went shopping on her own without me. I'd just pick her up at the checkout.

I knew that the amount was enough for the month but I hadn't reckoned on her inability to budget and normally by around the 20th the money would be gone. she would say how the money wasn't enough, and I would make the point about what everyone else in her family lived on and how we were living on about 5 times (admittedly a western lifestyle) as much, so the money blatantly was enough.

In the end I changed it to a weekly allowance to see how that worked. Maybe because it was less time to deal with or whatever, but this ended up working fine for us and it is the system we still use now. It took us about 18 months to get there though!

Now we come to the family; as I said, in the beginning we didn't have any money so no requests came in, everyone knew the situation. But as things improved, sure enough, the money requests came in. I was always very wary about this for obvious reasons, and (this is where you really need to have your partner on the same page!!) said it's a one shot thing. If they don't pay it back then they can never ask again. And that is what has more or less happened. Some have paid it back, others haven't, and the ones that haven't can't ask for any more.

Funnily enough, my wife says(and I agree) that it is good when someone can't pay it back because they can't ask for any more, even though she still has to listen to their money problems when speaking.

Something else we have done is to take things instead. A sister needed money so we took her motorbike, another sister we took pieces of land either side of our house. We knew when we lent it that they had land so I was quite happy to lend because when repayment time came a year later, I knew they wouldn't be able to pay so we'd get some more land out of it. I can't stress enough though that you both have to be on the same page.

One thing that has happened over the years is that as time has gone on, my wife has got more and more bored/annoyed by having to listen to family members talk to her about their money troubles. We both believe that our family has to come first and we need to provide for them. It has got so bad that she now believes that building a house in here village was a mistake and we need to have another place far away from them. I agree. We have never lent to anyone outside the family and would never consider it.

I think for the OP, he should have set down clearer boundaries right at the start, but hindsight is a wonderful thing. It's also not a bad idea to be a good way away from the family. People used to say in Thailand to follow the 50km rule. As in a Thai wouldn't consider going that far on an everyday basis, therefore you're not likely to see them that often, but it's still not that far. 500km and you're doing even better. LOL

I think the important thing is that you both have to think the same way, and the GF here needs to decide whether her priorities are with the man she lives with, or with the family. What comes first.

p.s. kick that sister out, she's a leech and she'll never stop sucking. It might force a confrontation with the GF, but good, let her decide what's more important. Even offer to pay her first two months rent if you have to. What I always say to foreigners, is to remember that they were all still eating before you arrived on the scene, and they'll all still be eating if you depart from the scene.

Good luck, and I hope it all works out for you in the long run.

Great thread!!!

mikek1

Nice to see your back on 'tap'. Would appear all is not well where you live .The question of security seems a bit dubious, I can honestly say that in wife's barangay the chances of a foreigner being singled out and intimidated are very, very remote . We had to get barangay clearance to open a bank account (Philippines bureaucracy)where our house is located. The captain (she) and her secretary welcomed us with open arms. When your g/f said she did not feel safe with you, after the attempted bag snatch, that must have been very hurtful to your feelings. From your previous blogs you have stated that she blows hot and cold, can you seriously put up with that on a continuous basis ? Regarding, your gfs request for you to purchase the rented property to you live in, I would not entertain that under any circumstances. Your G/F is blackmailing you, your not even married. Her threat to work abroad to pay for the house and lot is a fantasy. How long would it take to earn PHP1.5m let alone send money for the family ,or save that amount? During my visit to the Philippines in August I stayed at a beach resort which is frequented by a fair amount of Foreigners . I got talking to a Brit who was with a bar girl ( I know this because my French friend uses her services) and he was lavishing her with ,clothes, mobile phones, food, etc. He even took her to the passport office and paid for her to get a passport so she could stay with him in Hong Kong. They stayed at the resort for 4 days, and during that time ,95% of her time was allocated to looking and texting on her 'new' mobile phone. On speaking to this guy it turns out that he was a London lawyer, based in Hong Kong. The crux of this, is that he had previously met a Filipino 'bar girl' in Hong Kong and fell in love with her. He was so besotted he bought her a house in the Philippines for £12K, along with other expensive gifts. Things started to go wrong, so he hired a private detective to shed some light on this girls activities..............turned out she had a boyfriend in the Philippines and was just using him !!He told me he had been married in the UK but was divorced. I did not tell on that I knew about his new 'girlfriends' occupation, just thought what a mug !The moral of this is be careful. Personally. I think you need you need a 'break' for maybe a month, to let your g/f know how supportive you have been. Its highly unlikely that any Filipino, would have been as free flowing with the money as you. Get yourself off to other parts of the Philippines , for sure you will meet many others, and see some beautiful places (and girls !) . Most important, you can reflect on your time with your g/f and decide if its for you.

Philosophical 11

Many thanks all for your interest and responses.

First ... The house. The husband of the landlady will be returning from Saudi in December and they will love to visit us. He sounds a reasonable man and I know she is too. We will sit on the balcony here and have a few beers. This being the best way of communication rather than via Skype or 3rd persons. Then I know we will have a clear understanding from a man to man talk. I have already said that if and when I buy the house, I will take care of the wall. They offered to take the cost of repairs off the price of the house. But, I have a cunning plan. If and when I come into this money..she will not be told. If we have to move at some point then so be it. Then I will see her reaction. If as I think she will gladly move with me, then I will consider buying. But there is a lot of time between now and that point of time. We shall see what if anything materialises before then.

Thank you Nonthaburi for your kind comments. Guess I could write a book about all this! I probably already have. Nice to hear your viewpoints and taking the time to read my story. Two things: My gf (so far) has had no problems with her allowance. She looks for bargains and checks all receipts thoroughly. Yes, she has asked for an advance but for bulk shopping a few days before she is due for her allowance. I have no problem with that. Normally it is about 3k. It is to buy frozen meat when it becomes available from a friend of hers. Next... I have no problem with her sister living here. Ok, I thought it was a temp measure but she is good company for us. As previously explained, I think it would be churlish to charge her rent and the use of my electricity/water/internet which would be about 2k per month at a guess.

Thank you Mikek1. Yes, it was the most hurtful thing she said to me. After all, it was her decision to walk home at night...her decision to openly display her expensive purse and phone. She still does, although we do not walk back at home at night. I have told her to put these in my pockets now and she still wants to carry them. She expects me to check our back every couple of minutes whilst out walking. Told her that I am not on army patrol looking for snipers. I am a pensioner trying to enjoy a quiet retirement. Yes...she blows hot and cold. 95% of the time she is a beautiful, loving and caring woman. I have now found that if she goes quiet...pinay pout warning... then ignoring her for a couple of hours does the trick. She comes around and all is well. Problem really is that she will not speak to me about the issue that causes her grief which is normally caused by cultural/language misunderstanding. But, in the past she will not speak to me but will post the issue on fb to her friends. That makes me angry. She always retracts the post after we have "spoken" and she apologises. Prior to meeting here, she has on two occasions threatened self harm when due to a misunderstanding she thinks I am not coming here. The issues are always one of misunderstanding. And as you suggested....her going back to Kuwait to earn money to buy a house is nothing but bluster. I actually trust her 99.9% despite her black moods and pouts. I have explained why earlier on this post. The .1% is only because this is the Philippines and I am always thinking of conspiracy theories. ie...the wall problem was a perfect source of money for her family and friends who always undertake repairs here. Most satisfactorily and cheaply I may add. It would also mean we will need an overnight guard whilst the wall was being built. Her uncle is unemployed. Maybe I am thinking too much about the .1%....maybe. Better to be cautious out here.

Anyway all for now. Thanks for your interest once again. One favour please. One of you is a fb friend. Although you have never sent me fb pm thankfully....please be aware that I usually have a pinay sitting on my shoulder when I open fb!

Gazza-d

It still concerns me that you are still considdering buying your girlfriend a house.

Stokkevn

I am in agreement with Gazza's concern regarding the house purchase, if you do buy - do not get a dog, he may come higher on the inheritance hierarchy than you. Can you please forward the training manual, I have been married for 15 years and budget still comes out with 'when it runs out, ask for more' I would still charge a token rent, even if it is only a case of beer on the first of the month I agree with you, my wife has lived overseas in some dangerous places and would never put me at risk, she gets annoyed because I get a bit blasé about where I go. If your gf didn't blow hot & cold and jump up and down you would not be in the Philippines, anyway you started it by accepting all that water melon. Without all those misunderstandings and the following make-ups there would be a World glut in watermelon.

Gazza-d

One problem in the Philippines with improving rented property is stopping the owner throwing you out and either moving in or putting it on the market for a higher rental.

Philosophical 11

Thanks all,

Yes, I was surprised about her keeping within the budget but it may be that I am over-generous. She has 15k for food per month for both of us. Sometimes we eat out and she pays. She tries to bulk buy frozen meat where possible and looks for bargains. Most certainly she checks receipts and finds errors. She appears to know the best price for everything. She also has a personal allowance plus an allowance for fixed items such as rent etc. Most impressed. Obviously any surplus in the food allowance is hers. An incentive.

As far as house/land buying is concerned, I understand the huge doubts. I am sure she is genuine as I have said before, but I think in the longer term....a few years down the line and if the relationship goes sour, then I could find myself homeless. Anyway, bridges are there to be crossed. When you get to them. That bridge is a long way off yet.

All for now.... she has just come out of the shower. With that knowing smile on her face!

Philosophical 11

Two pieces of information I have learnt...one important and the other intriguing.

I learnt yesterday that a foreigner can indeed buy a house in the Philippines. But not the land it stands on. A foreigner not far away has done just that. With the help of an attorney. Transpires that the attorney drew up a mutual agreement with the landowner that land rental increases would not be above an agreed limit and the house owner would be compensated for an agreed sum if the land owner required the land for other purposes. Food for thought.... but that bridge has yet to be crossed.

A few pages back, I talked about getting the duplicate keys off gf father. This never happened for several reasons but I knew I could change the locks if need be. But the family were not happy that I wanted the duplicate keys back. Trust being the keyword. Also mentioned a few pages back (bear with me!) that we came home one evening after locking the house to find that gf sisters son had been let into our house by the father because he wanted to watch cartoons on our tv. He had made himself at home. I was not happy thinking it was an intrusion of privacy and after all....an Englishmans home is his castle. They thought nothing of it..... their custom, I guess. Found out a few days ago, gf took the duplicate keys off her father because I was not happy with this intrusion. Bless her.

Think food is still disappearing. Saw pictures on fb of gf sister and son munching prawns which probably were the ones gf bought in bulk I mentioned and could not sell. Visited their house this morning and saw a couple of kids chomping on what looked like our meat which she bulk bought a couple of weeks ago. I may be wrong. But I suppose I should be pragmatic about it. If she keeps within the budget then It should be ok. But I know where budget cuts will be made if the need arises.

All for now.... Gf wants something.

Gazza-d

It's a little more complex than that. You would have to build the house on a vacant lot, once a house is built the house and lot are considdered as one item. You would need to keep every receipt from building to house should you have to recover the money should it go sour and you have to move on. It has often been suggested that you could build the house on wheels.lol. In theory you could recover the cost of the house but the land owner just has to say they don't have any money, then what do you do. As they say you can't get blood from a stone.

Philosophical 11

Had a very unpleasant episode yesterday. I have been lending small amounts to gf family and friends, and so far all debts have been repaid. I turned down a request from one of her friends for 15k repayable over 3 months because it was for non-essentials otherwise I would have considered it. This produced the famous pinay pout for a couple of hours but nothing serious.

Yesterday her father asked her to ask me to take on his loan which he has with another person. She did not say how much. However, I believe it to be in the region of 70k and he would repay monthly. I would guess that to be about 5k pm due to his small salary. I said I did not have the means to do this (although I do) and this resulted in her locking herself in the bedroom for a couple of hours. She emerged on her mobile enquiring about her old job in Kuwait which is open to her complete with pay rise. After she decided to talk to me, I ended up with a sobbing pinay and she has been ok since. In fact she has been purring away next to me on the sofa this morning. But, I think I have had enough. Next time she does this, I shall just let her go and see what happens. After all, I am already supporting her and her family to the tune of 16k per month with education, allowances and medicine. I think the "wall" episode described in an earlier post was probably a means for her family to get money and work from our landlady which back-fired dramatically. Guess I was half expecting this request because I have heard them discussing it over the previous months. Anyway, I have stood firm....they all know where they stand. The next big issue will be house purchase but as I have said, I have a cunning plan for that. But that is a long way off yet. That's if we get there.

Nearly forgot to mention that her father and brother came round last night after the episode. My sword was drawn but not a word was mentioned. In fact we all got merry with vast amounts of Red Horse and Tanduay. Strange.

Gazza is right by the way. Only a house that a foreigner has actually built can be owned by a foreigner. A pre-owned house cannot.

All for now.... She is cooking with a big smile on her face. But I wonder sometimes what is behind that smile.

Gazza-d

It's all just a big game of cat and mouse. They'll be back with the next cunning plan.

It took my wife to lose a couple of big amounts of money to extended family before she came on side.

A filipina we know who lives in the UK would be presented with a big sari sari store bill on her arrival home where her mother would make loans on the strength of her daughter paying them when she visited.

Until your gf is completely on side you will be constantly under pressure. I think any cunning plan you have is going to need at least wedding bells and more likely a bit of distance for you and the gf from the family.