Erica P

My OH is just organising some work with his previous employer in the UK, hopefully we will be in a position to move back by late Spring.

When we left the UK last March the housing situation was just beginning to slow down in terms of sales and we were not able to sell so we rented it out. We couldn't afford to buy in Canada as our equity was tied up in our UK house so we are just renting here. At first this seemed to add to the stress of emigrating, now it seems it was a blessing in disguise as we will be able to go back to our UK home.

Fingers crossed for you and your house!

cricket1again

The reference about lemmings was made towards my husband and myself if we moved back to soon to less stability than what we have currently. It's all a matter of choice and really, despite all the advice in the world, only the OP can decide what's right for her.
I personally would be asking myself if the timing is right while there is so much instability but this line of thought is relevant to me right now. I am in a position of stability at the moment. It may be different for the OP.

Tegwyn

Actually Cricket1 is spot on! I relate to wanting to throw in the towel and run homewards and even after 25 years still have feelings that surface from time to time. This is my second marriage. Emotions sometimes impede on sound decisions, and sometimes one has to think of the cold hard facts in taking care of the business of basic economics to afford the necessities of everyday living. No income will certainly make depression even worse! One question that needs to be asked if a couple have reached such an impasse that will cause a separation of the family is how the "moving" partner plans to support her/himself back home? Does she has the skills to support herself in this event or is he expected to fund the decision? Does one have the right to force their partner to oblige their wishes? I don't see any compromise on either side here. My personal experience taught me that you cannot make anyone feel/care/nurture or believe how things should be done. Everyone is different and those differences do not make one partner wrong or the other right. These behaviours are ingrained from early childhood and unlikely to change.

I have intentionally left the emotional factor out of this, and no I am not cold! These factors will come into play regardless of these feelings and that is one folk need to focus on in making such significant decisions. Family is important but it is prioritizing what constitutes family is the bigger question. Will she be happier with the parents/siblings/cousins than her life partner?

cricket1again

This was my main point. When emotions are running high, it is extremely difficult to make a decision based on objective, clear thinking. Actions done in haste can often lead to years of regret and waste. I have so many friends who have walked out on their marriages in a moment of anger or disagreement and then later dispaired at how their assets have been halved or in some cases divided on a 80/20 basis. I always ask the question, 'did they not realise that there would be practical repercussions'?
A marriage or partnership, especially where children are involved is a business. To dissolve it means dissolving the entire emotional and business partnership. Therefore a lot of thought needs to go into any long term decision because even if you believe you can survive the hardship of being a single parent family in a recession, your children also have to go down this route too.
I would say exhaust all possibilities with your partner first. If you still can't agree or compromise, then you will need to review the situation in a few months time when each side has given more thought to the consequences of all the what if's.

moneypenny20

That is very much your 'one-sided angle' though isn't it? Regardless of how you feel, he is still her dad and in his own way loves his daughter. He is the only dad she knows and so knows no different 'dad love'. No one can say his way is wrong, it's just his way.

Say you do leave your other half and move back with your daughter. What happens in x months/years time when your daughter may turn round to you, desperately unhappy, wanting her father, and maybe accusing you of taking her away from him because of your feelings, not hers. What would you do then? I'm not having a go, I'm not saying you're wrong, these are just immediate thoughts of mine and I don't know how I would deal with them.

ex_exile

Holy moly!

Sorry, but you are being a selfish moo, however if this is how you feel about him maybe you would both be better off apart. The economy in the UK has stopped right now, its not the time to be giving up jobs and moving home if you have a secure financial position where you are.

How would you and your husband cope with the stress and recriminations of unemployment back home? The grass often seems greener on the other side and his resistance is probably making you feel stronger about going back but threatening to leave on your own is eventally going to split you up. Every time you make the threat whether you mean it or not the clock on your relationship ticks down.

scrubbedexpat097

And if this one sided angle is correct then when do you say enough is enough? When is it time for Ruby to put herself first and not keep going along on the emotional roller coaster her OH has put the whole family on for so long? It's not just putting herself first either, what good is it doing to her 11 year old daughter when home life is obviously strained?

Hopefully neither Ruby or her OH will blame each other and their daughter will still have a good relationship with her father where ever they all live.

cricket1again

The thing to remember is that there won't be a 'happy ending' whichever way you decide for a while. But at least this means you won't be chasing rainbows. You can always learn to live with a situation that isn't ideal while you make plans for later.
It would be good if you could all agree to give it your best shot, not to blame or shame anyone if it doesn't work, then allow your daughter to have a long distance relationship with her father to keep the bond going.

In all honesty though, I'd be more concerned about going back to the UK while there is no guarantee of a job or stability. Could you not stick to your guns but delay taking any action for a while?

moneypenny20

Completely agree. Unfortunately it's a lose lose situation whichever way it goes.

Danny B

I take sides with your husband, you'd (he) be mad to move back to the UK without a firm job offer.

You've been in Canada for quite a few years now, what difference is another 12 months? I know it must be hard, but I would forget moving back until this time next year when things start picking up again.

Try and enjoy your last year in Canada and be happy that there is light at the end of the tunnel.

Tegwyn

I agree with that. Perhaps the kids could use some counseling too. It is not uncommon for kids to copy the behaviours of their parents. If Mum is so unhappy, that message is being transmitted loud and clear to her children. They in turn will either mimmic the behaviour to appease the parent or turn away and withdraw.

Ruby Murray

Hiya....well I've just checked in to see the latest thoughts/views/opinions.....Wow!! Such a diverse number of angles on what you consider is moralistically the right thing to do. Don't know where to start really.

Ok, firstly......the mention of my daughter and the fact that it's just coming from my angle re: the father/daughter situation.

Yes, he does love her in his own way and he claims he'd do ANYTHING for her. But I have never been able to accept this statement. Surely a father that loves his daughter so much would hug her, kiss her, grab her affectionately to give her a cuddle, praise her, TELL HER HE LOVES HER??????? I kid you not, my daughter has cried bucket loads to me in her room (away from earshot from her Dad) asking me why her Dad is not like other Dads. How does that make me feel? I feel like I'm a worst mother for staying with him to receive such treatment. My son has grown up all his life without never, EVER receiving a hug and a kiss from his Dad, but he's grown up without revealing his feelings, unless pressed to. My daughter, however, is very expressive in her emotions and is not afraid to say it as it is. She feels unbelievably lacking in love and affection and is jealous of her cousin's relationship with her Dad, as well as several of her friends' relationships with their Dads. And yes, she is in therapy here....just like me It is the very reason of his coldness and detachment from his kids that shut me down emotionally years ago.

Ok...now the subject about the economy back home.

If I were to go back on my own with my daughter, naturally I'd find it quite hard to provide for us compared to what a working couple can bring in. I am a well-experienced Admin/Typist with about 20 years knowledge behind me. I check the job sites quite frequently and there always seems to be plenty of jobs going for office staff. I don't worry about me not finding a job. But I could probably afford, at a pinch, a 2 bed flat for around 450/500 GBP. If we all went back and mucked in, we could get a nice 3 bed semi to rent for not much more!! I put it to my OH 2 days ago now to at least look on the net for possible jobs to consider back home....even a friend working for British Aerospace emailed me and told me they want a couple of Aircraft Painters.....has he taken any notice? NO It tells me he isnt' even prepared to consider anything. What he doesnt grasp is that if I go, the house we live in now will most definitely, no if's or buts, have to be sold. Sure, he has a job over here that is paying pretty well, but with regards to a roof over our heads and a vehicle to run around in...that's really a mirage! The mortgage and truck payments are too expensive and are (seriously) on the verge of repossession. We have had so little "extra" money for a year that we have had no "lifestyle" at all. I keep putting it to him "Why keep battling on here having zero lifestyle, on the brink of financial ruin, seeing a relationship going down the toilet and me and our daughter so unhappy here"....for what!!!???? For the sake of pride? To have his family back home believe that he's the "successful" one out of the lot of them? The economy/recession thing is happening all over the world - over in the UK and over here too - but in certain industries remember. I am a firm believer that you can achieve anything as long as your mind is pro-active and motivated to act positively. I'm not scared by the prospect of being skint back home, but I am scared of running out of money here and not being able to pay the mortgage, truck finance & 2 credit card bills....how will we cope then with absolutely no family support or benefit assistance support here?

Well, I'm on a serious downer today...my depression has raised it's ugly head again, I feel trapped, worthless, useless and "in a very dark place" again. I hope to get a grip on things though by talking to my OH tonight about our relationship and where we're heading.

And just for the record...I do feel like I'm the one being the selfish moo. I've been through enough heartache and major stress brought on by my OH over the years to decide that my needs & my daughter's needs must come first now.

scrubbedexpat097

I'm glad you finally were able to say that honey

I hope your plans pan out for you. Your OH is an adult, if he has issues he needs to sort them out, your daughter is still a child and looking out for what is best for her and what is best for you to help her have a more settled life are the most important things right now. Good luck mate

Tegwyn

Dear Ruby, this is something very important you need to hear and understand. Not all men have the ability to express themselves in the terms you describe. My father never hugged me, cuddled me or told me in exact words that he loved me. In fact my mother was not one for much of the physical affection either but was my rock. It was old school upbringing, but I can tell you that I knew they loved me in ways that were supportive. Both my parents had tough childhoods and they had to grow up with tougher realities than I ever had to face. Both my parents saw the glass as half empty and quietly celebrated when things turn out for the better. It is the stuff of which they were made and even with that type of upbringing I knew I was loved. I have grown to appreciate that they did try their very best. The first time my father really hugged me and told me he loved me was when I left S.A. for Canada. I was 24 at the time. He had never shown that much emotion before. For some, no matter how deeply they love, they simply cannot reach the point of expression that others demand, no matter how much they may wish they could.

I do understand that you are unhappy and hope you find your path to better times, but you do need to understand you cannot force people to change. It is something that comes from within. This really sounds like a negative power struggle and the conclusion could be even more depressing.

Please note that this is not an attack on you, but perhaps some of what all have said on here will make you take a step back and think things through with a bit more clarity. I wish you well.

TMRE

I don't think you are going to get your answer on here. This is a decision you need to make, even if people have been in a similar situation to yours it is not their life. Be very careful what your daughter sees and hears around you from now on though. I've been there,done it and got the t-shirt with my parents. The effects of which are still being played out now 21 years later. I would suggest that maybe your daughter should see a counselor just to give her some time to figure out her feelings without being 'pushed' in to saying/thinking what she hopes will appease the situation. Just for the record my dad was a lot like your husband. His emotional response was not what my mother required of him. Only now years later have I gained any understanding as to why he was like it.
I wish you well in whatever you decide, just don't forget that this is bigger than just you.