ps Zulu, do we have that nice, cool autumn feeling in the air yet, or is summer hanging on? I'll be over next week and I've become so acclimatized to the cool/cold, I think anything above 20 will kill me.

What do you hope to achieve by calling it an invasion?

Of course the answer the left will say it is recognition that Britain did the wrong thing.

But who are we to judge 225 years later, and who are we to judge on the movement of people long before that. The aborigines once moved themselves. Do we know what they did to claim their turf - no.

All you will achieve is further divisions between indigenous and non indigenous Australians. And who does division hurt the most - indigenous people.

Don't you think enough is enough - time to move on for the welfare of indigenous people.

Did you settle it or invade it?


S

It's cool, has been a few days. Lots of rain recently freshening things up

It will definitely be over 20 but the heat will be manageable

The hills will be glorious when the sunshine comes back

Which is why the correct wording is important. As no one was asked to come and share this land nor even an agreement under law (as UNHCR Agreement ) to take in Britain's huddled or criminal masses, why not just call it an invasion and move on? Of course injustices resulted from initial settlement/invasion.
I suspect the division will continue to exist regardless of wording but small steps forward towards inclusiveness is obviously the way forward.

The issue is less with which particular English word you are using, than with the fact that those who are looking backwards are part of the problem.

You certainly live in a lovely area of Perth.

Neither. I was still a twinkle in my great-great-great-grandfather's eye

I meant the argument

Totally unapreciated in my time...


S

Having just now sat down and had a really good old read from page one , I have to 100% agree with you. I was engaged and interested . Actually thought it was one of the best discussions I've read in ages. A thread of the year type of calibre, right up until the blessed leftie/rightie thing twanged.

Shall I put those two words on the filter so everyone would have to discuss from their own personal point of view without being labelled.

Thing is. I do that & two more words crop up. Dictator & Junta.

I'm liking this thread and topic.

My suggestion is that someone starts a right/left thread about what is right /left in the TIO. That leaves the Barbie discussion threads free for really good reads and discussion like this one.

BTW.
I am not sure one of my lot was either an invader or a settler. He was deported to Oz for stealing a horses head to feed his family.
He was simply a man of his times.

I don't think individuals were invaders, other than those who had the power to make the orders, iyswim. The individuals that came to Australia were surely in the most part a mixture of folk like us trying to improve their lot and folk in miserable predicaments like your rellie.

But still, when the intentions of the crown at the time and the actions taken and ordered in its name when resistance was met are scrutinised my sympathies lie with the argument that Australia was both invaded and settled but that its invaded status has been ignored as an inconvenient truth. If the voice that it was invaded is silenced (by the likes of those who state what is only their opinion with phrases like "end of" as if they possess a God-given authority!) then we have no hope of ever moving forward to a unified future. You only have to look to every and any area of the globe where a population that perceives itself as oppressed is ignored and marginalised to realise that ignoring the other side and using majority authority to dismiss and belittle does not result in a harmonious and unified society.

As to the right/left mudslinging, I only want to say that the person moneypenny (Oztennis) quoted on post 63 when raising her objection was only remarking that they anticipated getting the lefty insult hurled at them, which is understandable if you read the posts of Amazulu and Beoz on this thread BEFORE oztennis posted: Amazulu continually refers to 'the left' etc. and even insultingly links the left with "anti-West" (post 25) and "its 3rd world Islamic masters" (post 52). So it didn't seem very fair to quote oztennis when making the point that the left/right mudslinging is tiresome.

Hands up here. The "left" is too broad. Its now the democratic socialists

Sincere apologies if I didn't list all the people who have been banging on about rightie/leftie for the past year. Oztennis mentioned it and I commented because I'm over it and I'm not alone. Next time I want to comment on something I'll make sure to have a complete list of 'baddies' and maybe multiquote every single mention.

Correct and

No, you're not alone, many people are over the constant left/right issue that keeps being raised in these threads. Why can't a subject just be discussed without people having to be labelled as one or the other?