Let's talk about cars
Jan 28th 2014, 8:09 am
#1276
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Dixie, ex UK
Posts: 52,621
Re: Let's talk about cars
Not really sure how you figure that. Toyota, Honda and others that have a manufacturing presence in the U.S., collectively, directly employ a total in the neighborhood of 70 thousand plus workers. Toyota employs about 31,000 and Honda 28,000.
Suppliers that feed their plants employ perhaps double that number. If one includes dealership personnel the number increases dramatically. Toyota dealerships employ just under 130,000 and Honda just under 150,000 (including dealerships that sell other Honda products).
We can also take into account the spin off jobs and businesses that flourish around their plants, suppliers and dealerships. Those manufacturers pay taxes, the suppliers pay taxes, the employees pay taxes, the spin off businesses pay taxes. Tens of billions in tax revenue. How about the jobs created by all of that capital investment; building plants and design centers, land purchases, construction workers, engineers, ongoing infrastructure improvement, maintenance etc. That's just the manufacturers while the same applies to suppliers and dealerships.
It is far from the old days when everything they sold was imported. Oh, and as to design, Toyota, for one, has two Calty design facilities in the U.S., in California and Michigan.
Ooops, I forgot, they did not need a bailout.
Good article here on the subject of buying domestic and what actually is domestic these days. http://www.edmunds.com/car-buying/fo...-money-go.html
Suppliers that feed their plants employ perhaps double that number. If one includes dealership personnel the number increases dramatically. Toyota dealerships employ just under 130,000 and Honda just under 150,000 (including dealerships that sell other Honda products).
We can also take into account the spin off jobs and businesses that flourish around their plants, suppliers and dealerships. Those manufacturers pay taxes, the suppliers pay taxes, the employees pay taxes, the spin off businesses pay taxes. Tens of billions in tax revenue. How about the jobs created by all of that capital investment; building plants and design centers, land purchases, construction workers, engineers, ongoing infrastructure improvement, maintenance etc. That's just the manufacturers while the same applies to suppliers and dealerships.
It is far from the old days when everything they sold was imported. Oh, and as to design, Toyota, for one, has two Calty design facilities in the U.S., in California and Michigan.
Ooops, I forgot, they did not need a bailout.
Good article here on the subject of buying domestic and what actually is domestic these days. http://www.edmunds.com/car-buying/fo...-money-go.html
Jan 28th 2014, 8:27 am
#1277
Rootbeeraholic
Joined: Aug 2009
Location: Houston, Tx
Posts: 2,280
Re: Let's talk about cars
http://britishexpats.com/forum/showp...&postcount=346
Jan 28th 2014, 8:34 am
#1278
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Re: Let's talk about cars
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I still don't see, no matter how positive the contribution, how it wouldn't be more positive if it were an American controlled corporation. Oh, and I don't like Japanese, or Korean cars. Let me know when hell has frozen over and I'll start shopping for a Toyota truck!
So your theory is that it's fine for American controlled subsidiaries in foreign countries to manufacture and sell vehicles in in those countries, but the other way around is some kind of horrible injustice to the American way? I'm guessing, of course. It would be highly disingenuous to overlook their contribution to the American economy. Wait, I've got it. We can shut all of their plants down, replace them with new GM and Chrysler plants to fill the sales gap, thereby making those companies bigger and more expensive to bailout the next time they manage to totally **** up their business, not to mention their product quality. Problem solved.
30 years in the business taught me not to depend on the quality of domestic products, especially GM, and so far I have not changed my opinion with the possible exception of Ford who seem to be making a real effort. Gm made a 50 year career out of shoving garbage down the buying publics throat, and went from over 60% of the market to less than 20%. The American addiction to quarterly results and their effect on stock prices will always influence their decision making when it comes to cutting corners to boost quarterly profits. Have to take care of the value of the CEO's stock options, you know.
Anyone, by the way, that pays any attention to a J.D. Powers initial quality survey to determine a vehicles reliability needs to be educated as to how meaningless that award is. I used them for paperweights.
Now, for a company that totally blows at being the least bit supportive of the American job market or contribution to the tax base, try a look at Apple.
Last edited by dakota44; Jan 28th 2014 at 8:46 am.
Jan 28th 2014, 8:35 am
#1279
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Dixie, ex UK
Posts: 52,621
Jan 28th 2014, 8:52 am
#1280
BE Site Lead
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: MA, USA
Posts: 92,176
Re: Let's talk about cars
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I still don't see, no matter how positive the contribution, how it wouldn't be more positive if it were an American controlled corporation. Oh, and I don't like Japanese, or Korean cars. Let me know when hell has frozen over and I'll start shopping for a Toyota truck!
Jan 28th 2014, 9:05 am
#1282
Bloody Yank
Joined: Oct 2005
Location: USA! USA!
Posts: 4,186
Re: Let's talk about cars
Most of the money spent on new cars is paying for parts and labor, in that order. Relatively small amounts contribute to R&D and to corporate overhead.
Automakers then take some of the money that's left and use it to expand production.
If you want to help the US economy, then the best thing to do would be to buy cars that are assembled in the US; the more US parts content, the better. It would also help to give the money to companies that have a long-term plan to increase their production in the US. That money supports US jobs at the assembly plant, as well as with the suppliers who serve the plant.
Based upon that, the best choices are Toyota and Honda models that are built in the US. Not only are they built here, but it is likely that those companies will increase their US production as their market grows.
US-built Hyundais and Chryslers may also belong on this list. The US is important to both companies, and they will both try to gain market share here with US-built vehicles.
Buy a GM car, and you're probably helping to fund the development of new factories in Asia. GM is trying to diversify away from the US and to take advantage of the growing market for cars in the BRICs. These are multinational companies -- it matters little where the corporate HQ is located.
Automakers then take some of the money that's left and use it to expand production.
If you want to help the US economy, then the best thing to do would be to buy cars that are assembled in the US; the more US parts content, the better. It would also help to give the money to companies that have a long-term plan to increase their production in the US. That money supports US jobs at the assembly plant, as well as with the suppliers who serve the plant.
Based upon that, the best choices are Toyota and Honda models that are built in the US. Not only are they built here, but it is likely that those companies will increase their US production as their market grows.
US-built Hyundais and Chryslers may also belong on this list. The US is important to both companies, and they will both try to gain market share here with US-built vehicles.
Buy a GM car, and you're probably helping to fund the development of new factories in Asia. GM is trying to diversify away from the US and to take advantage of the growing market for cars in the BRICs. These are multinational companies -- it matters little where the corporate HQ is located.
Last edited by RoadWarriorFromLP; Jan 28th 2014 at 9:08 am.
Jan 28th 2014, 9:12 am
#1283
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2013
Location: Monterey, CA
Posts: 2,554
Jan 28th 2014, 9:16 am
#1284
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Jan 28th 2014, 9:37 am
#1286
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Re: Let's talk about cars
Most of the money spent on new cars is paying for parts and labor, in that order. Relatively small amounts contribute to R&D and to corporate overhead.
Automakers then take some of the money that's left and use it to expand production.
If you want to help the US economy, then the best thing to do would be to buy cars that are assembled in the US; the more US parts content, the better. It would also help to give the money to companies that have a long-term plan to increase their production in the US. That money supports US jobs at the assembly plant, as well as with the suppliers who serve the plant.
Based upon that, the best choices are Toyota and Honda models that are built in the US. Not only are they built here, but it is likely that those companies will increase their US production as their market grows.
US-built Hyundais and Chryslers may also belong on this list. The US is important to both companies, and they will both try to gain market share here with US-built vehicles.
Buy a GM car, and you're probably helping to fund the development of new factories in Asia. GM is trying to diversify away from the US and to take advantage of the growing market for cars in the BRICs. These are multinational companies -- it matters little where the corporate HQ is located.
Automakers then take some of the money that's left and use it to expand production.
If you want to help the US economy, then the best thing to do would be to buy cars that are assembled in the US; the more US parts content, the better. It would also help to give the money to companies that have a long-term plan to increase their production in the US. That money supports US jobs at the assembly plant, as well as with the suppliers who serve the plant.
Based upon that, the best choices are Toyota and Honda models that are built in the US. Not only are they built here, but it is likely that those companies will increase their US production as their market grows.
US-built Hyundais and Chryslers may also belong on this list. The US is important to both companies, and they will both try to gain market share here with US-built vehicles.
Buy a GM car, and you're probably helping to fund the development of new factories in Asia. GM is trying to diversify away from the US and to take advantage of the growing market for cars in the BRICs. These are multinational companies -- it matters little where the corporate HQ is located.
Someone actually sees it.
Looking at GM, they make the Camaro, Equinox, Impala and Terrain in Canada. Cadillac SRX, Escalade EXT, Aveo, HHR, Silverado and Sierra (driving a Mexican truck dude) in Mexico. And of all the models built in the U.S., some have engines and transmissions and other parts built in China (that's reassuring
), plus Mexico, Japan, Canada, France and Hungary. Yep, all American, all domestic, all the time. In fact, 70% of the vehicles they make are not built in the U.S. Pretty good breakdown here. http://autos.aol.com/article/is-your...ally-american/
People who tout "Buy Domestic made" when it comes to cars get on my nerves because they usually have no clue where their car was built or where the parts came from, yet they talk down supposed "imports". We're not in Kansas anymore, Dorothy.
Oh, and GM won't have to pay any Federal taxes for about 20 years thanks to being allowed to carry forward losses prior to bankruptcy, in spite of the fact that they are making record profits, that they erased all of their debt in bankruptcy (which would have included some of those losses) and received an 85 billion dollar bailout on which at least 25 billion will never be recovered by the Fed. Bonus. Ford will avoid taxes for the same reason, but at least they did not get a bailout. Chrysler? An LLC partnership and not subject to federal corporate taxes. Oh yes.
Last edited by dakota44; Jan 28th 2014 at 10:05 am.
Jan 28th 2014, 9:38 am
#1287
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Re: Let's talk about cars
Jan 28th 2014, 10:42 am
#1288
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Re: Let's talk about cars
Interesting statistics. Of the vehicles manufactured and sold in the U.S. with at least 75% American content, the top 10 include one Ford, one Chrysler product, three GM products and....four Toyotas and One Honda. Go figure. Half of them are those darn foreign cars.
What Are the Top American-Made Cars?
Cars.com's American-Made Index rates vehicles built and bought in the U.S. Factors include where the car's parts come from, whether the car is assembled in the U.S. and sales. We disqualify models with a domestic parts content rating below 75 percent, models built exclusively outside the U.S. or models soon to be discontinued without a U.S.-built successor.
Rank Make/Model U.S. Assembly Location
1. Ford F-150 Dearborn, Mich.;
Claycomo, Mo.
2. Toyota Camry Georgetown, Ky.;
Lafayette, Ind.
3. Dodge Avenger Sterling Heights, Mich.
4. Honda Odyssey Lincoln, Ala.
5. Toyota Sienna Princeton, Ind.
6. Chevrolet Traverse Lansing, Mich.
7. Toyota Tundra San Antonio, Texas
8. GMC Acadia Lansing, Mich.
9. Buick Enclave Lansing, Mich.
10. Toyota Avalon Georgetown, Ky.
What Are the Top American-Made Cars?
Cars.com's American-Made Index rates vehicles built and bought in the U.S. Factors include where the car's parts come from, whether the car is assembled in the U.S. and sales. We disqualify models with a domestic parts content rating below 75 percent, models built exclusively outside the U.S. or models soon to be discontinued without a U.S.-built successor.
Rank Make/Model U.S. Assembly Location
1. Ford F-150 Dearborn, Mich.;
Claycomo, Mo.
2. Toyota Camry Georgetown, Ky.;
Lafayette, Ind.
3. Dodge Avenger Sterling Heights, Mich.
4. Honda Odyssey Lincoln, Ala.
5. Toyota Sienna Princeton, Ind.
6. Chevrolet Traverse Lansing, Mich.
7. Toyota Tundra San Antonio, Texas
8. GMC Acadia Lansing, Mich.
9. Buick Enclave Lansing, Mich.
10. Toyota Avalon Georgetown, Ky.
Jan 28th 2014, 12:31 pm
#1289
BE Site Lead
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: MA, USA
Posts: 92,176
Re: Let's talk about cars
Jan 29th 2014, 1:00 am
#1290
Mions' a point.
Joined: Jun 2012
Location: Cleveland Ohio
Posts: 1,340
Re: Let's talk about cars
How much does Toyota make per unit? Honda? BMW? That money leaves the country. When Ford makes it, it stays.
Side note, I walked to the gas station last night, so cold exposed skin started burning immediately. Take a shortcut through a starbucks parking lot, there's a little old ethnic lady trying to open the hood of her Intrigue.
Trying not to scare her I say hello, what's the matter? She says I think it needs oil. Smiling to myself at that I asked, does it start? Smacking me down a few places in my mind she says, yes, it starts fine but it has a tick and it needed a quart of oil the other day! She is AT LEAST 80 (I think older!) and is trying to check her oil in the deep freeze! I love this lady.
Pete
Side note, I walked to the gas station last night, so cold exposed skin started burning immediately. Take a shortcut through a starbucks parking lot, there's a little old ethnic lady trying to open the hood of her Intrigue.
Trying not to scare her I say hello, what's the matter? She says I think it needs oil. Smiling to myself at that I asked, does it start? Smacking me down a few places in my mind she says, yes, it starts fine but it has a tick and it needed a quart of oil the other day! She is AT LEAST 80 (I think older!) and is trying to check her oil in the deep freeze! I love this lady.
Pete
