Bob

https://www.motor1.com/news/458346/h...uAVKmuG_QTNaMI

Haynes, no more in printed form for new cars. Digital only....Still printing the old cars though.

Nutek

So many of these, over the years. Must have saved me a fortune.

Steerpike

Hybrid / EV car noise -

I've just rented a 2021 Toyota Venza Hybrid with a view to it becoming my next car. It's a lovely looking thing (IMHO; YMMV).
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/2...icial-details/
Overall, I'm loving it - plenty of power, very quiet, lovely interior appointments, etc etc. But the weirdest thing is the sound it makes at slow speeds! As you roll to a stop, you suddenly hear a 'choir of angels' singing to you ....and as you take off from a stop sign, the choir joins you again, then cuts out at about 10mph. I thought at first it was the sound of the electric motors / invertors / regen braking, which tend to 'whine' at times, but no ... it's an intentional, manufactured sound! (and it's the same whether braking or setting off)

Apparently, all Hybrids/EVs must make a certain level of sound at low speeds for safety - "Nov 14, 2016 4:09 PM EST WASHINGTON — New hybrid and electric cars are required to make noise when traveling at low speeds so that pedestrians, especially those who are blind or have poor eyesight, will hear them coming, under a new rule released Monday" and "Manufacturers must install (a noise-generating) system in four-wheeled electric and hybrid electric vehicles that are approved from July 1, 2019, and to all new quiet electric and hybrid vehicles registered from July 2021. The vehicle must make a continuous noise level of at least 56 dBA (within 2 meters) if the car is going 20 km/h (12 mph) or slower, and a maximum of 75 dBA"

I'm now researching whether you can kill this sound. Some forums say that if you unplug the speaker, you get an error code on the display, so some people are taping over it. Nowadays, any modern car is virtually inaudible at very low speeds (eg, parking lot speeds) - tire noise is typically more prevalent than engine noise when crawling along.

Have any of you new Hybrid buyers noticed this? I know Giantaxe just bought the Honda CR-V hybrid. Ironically, the Venza is appealing to me because it is extremely quiet and smooth (otherwise, I'd be going for the RAV4 or CR-V).

ddsrph

It would be hard to prove but if you take out some blind guy would there be any liability from disabling a safety system?

OldJuddian

I have a 2021 Toyota Highlander Hybrid, so really a larger version of your Venza.
It just whines a lot when going at slow speed, which I thought was only motor noise. There is no 'choir' or other noises coming out.

I love this car, and now use it all the time as it is so fuel efficient especially as I live on a hill. Just wish the battery was a little larger.
It also makes an awesome inverter - at the ski-resort with the kettle going, or at home powering the freezer after the last windstorm took out the power.

Steerpike

What clued me is was, you get the same/similar noise when taking off from stationary, if you go real gentle (to avoid having the gas motor kick in). The Toyota forums are suggesting the Venza is an unusually loud version! It's also an unusually quiet vehicle.

Regarding the car being an excellent inverter - can you elaborate - you plug in what to where?

steveq

Yes. Fascinating idea. How much can you pull out, what voltage etc ?

Giantaxe

Yes, as you pointed out it's a requirement for any Hybrid or electric vehicle from this January (I think) onwards. So you'd better get used to it as a driver or pedestrian...

On my Honda, it makes a generated noise when (i) the vehicle is going below 20mph without the gas engine running; and (ii) any time it's in reverse. The latter is louder than the former. I found it quite annoying to begin with but I really don't notice now.

Having almost been hit twice by silent electric vehicles backing out of parking spaces, I think this is a good safety initiative.

OldJuddian

My car has 2 120V sockets, and can supply 1500W. I was worried if an electric kettle may trip it as it warns about transients, but it works fine. It also powered the main things in my house after the last storm. It cuts out after 1 hr, but that is a minor issue. Occasionally the gas engine runs to top up the hi voltage battery, but that is really rare. If we still had soccer I would take my espresso machine and run that in the trunk.

https://www.toyotanation.com/threads...rator.1675665/

ddsrph

Been working on my Mail Jeep project all winter with some good progress. Here is a before and after.

Steerpike

I really hope you mean, after and before pictures

ddsrph

I had a little trouble getting the pictures to post. Still have a long way to go but can do a very short test drive in next few days. It’s only going to have a bikini top and no doors has no heater or anything not absolutely necessary to be road worthy.

zzrmark

How is it that after 100+ years of employing methods to reduce cabin noise that manufacturers can't use something to make noise outside without it being heard in the cabin, it's not as though the driver needs to be informed that their car is moving slowly - and if they do they probably need to hand in their license.

BenK91

Our Tesla has a "Passenger Warning Module" that's located under the front splitter. It is pretty audible outside the car but from inside it's very hard to notice, not like I've ever actually tried to listen to it however as from the minute the car turns on to the minute it shuts off there's music or a podcast being played.

That said, my second generation Raptor has engine/exhaust notes coming through the speaker to make it sound more like a V8 when they switched to the twin turbo V6, I was able to turn this off via Forscan though.

Steerpike

I'm a bit unusual in that I treat my car as something of sanctuary. My g/f is hard of hearing, and has the TV on 'quite loud' much of the time, so sitting in my car in total silence is something I really enjoy. Ironically, this Venza is very quiet inside, and the sound generation speaker is mounted behind the radiator, so it's not clear why it's so noticeable. I should probably mention that I have always had, and continue to have at 62, the most amazing hearing. I can hear things most people don't seem to catch. I'm probably going to silence it somehow or other. I wouldn't mind if it was only 'reverse', but doing it at all times when <20mph seems extreme. I have to pass through about 5 closely located stop signs on my way home, and I just about exceed 20 mph between them, so I hear it go on / off / on / off / on ... all the time.