paintermujer

Beautiful blue sky this morning but OMG 0 degrees.

I dont really think that living in Spain makes us soft its just that it is very difficult to warm up inside so we ourselves never really warm up like we would if we had central heating and carpets.

If anything I think we might become harder to withstand these extreme temperatures.

Remember people living in the UK dont have temperatures which vary by 45 degrees in a short space of time.

agoreira

And good isulated, heated houses. I speak to my brother in Sweden on skype and he always seems to be sat there in just a shirt, or whatever, not wrapped up like a Lap. They seem to have it sorted up there, despite - 10/20º. I remember we spent some time together, separate houses, in Spain in April, and he felt the cold more than me, he was constantly asking the owners for some additional form of heating.

agoreira

Yes, I love the different seasons, they all have their different attractions, walking a deserted beach in winter, nice chill in the air, suits me perfectly. Did several years in the Middle East, every morning sun rises in the east, travels across a clear blue sky and sets in the west, next day, sun rises in the east, travels across a clear blue sky and sets in the west. Next day.... and so it goes on, bloody boring. We've not had it here like you have, so I've been out every day for hours as I always do. I often read of people telling us of the great outdoor life in Spain, I bet there are very very few that spend more time outdoors than I do, whatever the season.

bil

Dick, pay attention mate please. Cold does not harm bacteria. Bacteria are very, very hard to kill, except by the means I described, and even of those three, all dryness does is make them sporulate, ie turn into spores to await better times. The only real way to kill them outside of your body is pH ie acid or alkali or heat.

Why do you think the use heat to sterilise stuff?

I have a fridge and a freezer. The difference is I know what they do and why.

If you leave a leg of chicken out in the kitchen, it will start to stink and be heaving with bacteria quite quickly. If you leave it in the fridge, it will still end up stinking and heaving, it will just take longer.

Put it in the freezer and the process of bacterial multiplication slows to effectively zero. Take it out and the process resumes.

Look, here's a thought experiment for you. Meat products like pate etc will keep a long time in the fridge, because they are sealed in plastic and heat sterilised.

Now take a piece of meat that has been handled and not cooked, and seal it in plastic. Put it in the freezer, and when it has been frozen solid, take it out and store it at room temp. That meat will start heaving with bacteria because the freezing process DOES NOT KILL BACTERIA.

Dick Dasterdly

Just as I said in post 81, except that it does also kill some types of bacteria.

bil

Excellent. Do please give me a list of bacteria that are killed by cold, including the temps they have to be dropped to.

If not I shall just have to assume you are repeating bullshit.

In your own time.

bil

Swedes have brains. I think that a Swedish house in the worst winters needs the equivalent of one can of gas, to heat it.

Sadly, the UK government is incapable of doing joined up thinking. If they were, they'd send teams out to research what it is that other countries do better than us and find out how to implement it in the UK.

As if. There are so many vested interests holding the government by the balls there is no way that's going to happen till frogs grow hair.

Alectryon

There are so many vested interests holding the government by the balls there is no way that's going to happen till frogs grow hair.[/QUOTE]

There is hope then.

bil

There is hope then.

Attachment 97388[/QUOTE]

I'm amazed that anyone would have thought of the hairy frog. Trouble is, that's strips of skin in the males that aids breathing in water. A bit like external gills.

agoreira

To be fair, we don't suffer the snow and the temps that Sweden do, they know it'll arrive every winter without fail. I think the one's that do it better than us are the countries that suffer a lot harder winters than we do. It would probably be a waste of money for my local council having a fleet of snow ploughs sitting in a garage somewhere, as 95% of the time, they'd just be sitting idle. Also there are grants here for insulation, I know cavity wall insulation cost me about £100 and a similar amount for some incredibly deep loft insulation. My son has an apartment with a huge roof space, and he has just paid £130 to have the whole lot done(inc tank,pipes lagged etc).

bil

Yeah, but look at the heating bill we used to have in the UK each year and compare that to the Swede's. hell, given that the uk is warmer, you probably wouldn't need heating in a swedish style house.

That's a lot of energy saved......

Plus, OK it costs to have snowploughs around, but how much did it cost us in uncleared roads?

bil

While we are waiting for the list of bacteria killed by cold, here's some cold lovers.

http://serc.carleton.edu/microbelife...d/general.html

Also, remember that a fridge optimum temp is about 5 C. I'm going to be very interested if any bacteria on earth would worry about that.

Remember, it's got to KILL them. Not turn them into spores, slow them down or temporarily stop them breeding, but KILL them dead.

agoreira

I'm only talking about my local council here, we haven't had any real snow, but yes, the majority will need them. My son drove from Bristol (rearranged flight from Tolouse-Gatwick the day previous!) to Cardiff yesterday, and is heading down to see us now, and no sign of snow whatsoever.

bil

At the end of the day we pay our government big bucks to act correctly, sensibly and honestly on our behalf.

I just read that back to myself.

We're screwed, aren't we?

Dick Dasterdly

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_freez...ia_by_freezing

SOME bacteria ARE killed by freezing.
Some are actually killed by the shear pressure of the actual freezing process itself.
If you want a list you'd best find it yourself.