Originally Posted by Alen1

And what is the undemocratic world doing?

Originally Posted by The Dean

Esther Rantzen has just earned the biggest round of applause so far, with her comment:

"If I were God, I'd ban religion".

Originally Posted by Norm_uk

Well:

• 40million died in Red China this century due to famine, war and Gulags.
• 1.9million have died in Sudan due to various wars and militias killing off the native animist Africans.
• Around 1million died in the Iran/Iraq war.
• 900,000 are said to have died in the Rwandan Genocide.
• Some 300,000 Kurds have been killed in Iraq, Turkey and Iran.
• In East Timor Indonesia is blamed for around 200,000 deaths.
• 200,000 died when Islamists squared off against the government in Algeria.
• 150,000 died in Lebanon's civil war.
• 100,000 Albanians have died at the hands of their own people.
• Interestingly, estimates for the total killed in the Arab-Israeli conflict since Israel's inception stand at around 51,000 to 71,000 thousand (civillian and military deaths)

N.

Originally Posted by benzonar

Norm, You forgot to mention the 856,000 Jews that have been forced to leave Arab countries between 1948-1970 via violence, coercion and oppression.

I wonder how many Arab countries would be willing to support the right of return or the possible recompense of the $300 billion in assets left behind.

Originally Posted by Norm_uk

I didn't want to mention that as I am probably already going to be accused of being a Zionist spy or something for posting reasonably assessed figures of other conflicts around the word...

...but yes, you raise a very interesting point there. Controversial for sure though!

N.

Originally Posted by Norm_uk

Well:

• 40million died in Red China this century due to famine, war and Gulags.
• 1.9million have died in Sudan due to various wars and militias killing off the native animist Africans.
• Around 1million died in the Iran/Iraq war.
• 900,000 are said to have died in the Rwandan Genocide.
• Some 300,000 Kurds have been killed in Iraq, Turkey and Iran.
• In East Timor Indonesia is blamed for around 200,000 deaths.
• 200,000 died when Islamists squared off against the government in Algeria.
• 150,000 died in Lebanon's civil war.
• 100,000 Albanians have died at the hands of their own people.
• Interestingly, estimates for the total killed in the Arab-Israeli conflict since Israel's inception stand at around 51,000 to 71,000 thousand (civillian and military deaths)

The world has been busy going about it's dark business.

However - if we look at cold hard numbers the Arab-Israeli conflict is one of the least deadly conflicts on earth. Not to detract from the tragic loss of innocent life which is always wrong but it's just not a world threatening conflict by any standard. Yet it remains plastered over the news when other, far worse things are happening right under our very noses.

Have a look on google and get your own numbers folks, don't take my word for it.

Let's give peace a chance.

N.

Originally Posted by Pablo

A supreme example of how the trendy European commentariat just doesn't get it. Sad, but typical, that such a thick comment should elicit applause.

Originally Posted by Pablo

A supreme example of how the trendy European commentariat just doesn't get it. Sad, but typical, that such a thick comment should elicit applause.

Originally Posted by Norm_uk

Beard Man.

I don't think anyone here supports the killing of innocent people for any reason - either Jew or Arab. It is murder and is always evil.

I honestly think the people in Gaza would achieve more by not fighting back...violence can only give birth to more violence. Perhaps my view is not going to be popular and some will even accuse me of taking sides but they have been fighting for years and it has achieved nothing but more extremism, more bloodshed, more pain and more innocents killed. Look what happened in Northern Ireland when the IRA stopped fighting...more than in 30 years of them fighting.

If people want change they will have to do something that they have not done before. It's that simple and yet so difficult. Every time an Israeli or an Arab have honesty tried to make peace with each other in the past they have been killed by their own people (like with Rabin or Sedat). That tells me none of the leaders or conservatives on either side want peace.

It seems everyone has enough religion to make them hate each other but not enough to make them love each other.

N.

Originally Posted by Squirty Cream

So as a brother Arab, what are you doing yourself to help? Sending money, raising money, giving blood, organising collections of food, clothing - anything solid and real?

Or are you just paying lipservice?

Originally Posted by Norm_uk

Well:

• 40million died in Red China this century due to famine, war and Gulags.
• 1.9million have died in Sudan due to various wars and militias killing off the native animist Africans.
• Around 1million died in the Iran/Iraq war.
• 900,000 are said to have died in the Rwandan Genocide.
• Some 300,000 Kurds have been killed in Iraq, Turkey and Iran.
• In East Timor Indonesia is blamed for around 200,000 deaths.
• 200,000 died when Islamists squared off against the government in Algeria.
• 150,000 died in Lebanon's civil war.
• 100,000 Albanians have died at the hands of their own people.
• Interestingly, estimates for the total killed in the Arab-Israeli conflict since Israel's inception stand at around 51,000 to 71,000 thousand (civillian and military deaths)

The world has been busy going about it's dark business.

However - if we look at cold hard numbers the Arab-Israeli conflict is one of the least deadly conflicts on earth. Not to detract from the tragic loss of innocent life which is always wrong but it's just not a world threatening conflict by any standard. Yet it remains plastered over the news when other, far worse things are happening right under our very noses.

Have a look on google and get your own numbers folks, don't take my word for it.

Let's give peace a chance.

N.

Originally Posted by Beard Man

it is not about the numbers only.

Palasitine is an Arabic and islamic country that was taken from the real owners and given to Israel.

Israel is getting alot of support from countries like US and the UN ignores what they do in palastine.

alot of decisions were taken againest Israel by UN but none was enforced on them.

Palastine means alot to muslims .. and it will remain.

Originally Posted by benzonar

Norm, You forgot to mention the 856,000 Jews that have been forced to leave Arab countries between 1948-1970 via violence, coercion and oppression.

I wonder how many Arab countries would be willing to support the right of return or the possible recompense of the $300 billion in assets left behind.

Originally Posted by Ray

Cyprus means a lot to the Greeks..but the Turkish invaded and took half in 1974... although their has been hundreds of United Nations resolutiona its still at Stale ..the bloodshed of the early days has literally ceased and they co-exist at his time ...

I can see similarities ...

Originally Posted by Beard Man

are you telling me that you are happy to see women and kids getting killed for their rights in Palastine at the moment ??

are you telling me that the UN should do nothing againest Israel??

what are you saying exactly?

and you ignore all my post and come to this one only !!!

Ray.. you have been always the one who is never serious about a fair and serious discussion.... and here you are ... the same man .. didn't change.