scrubbedexpat141

Extending on the first part, I agree.

Sometimes it's a fear of not wanting to disappoint / say no. Unfortunately it's a cultural clash.

If I ask for someone to come at 0830 then I expect them there at 0830. Maybe 0835.

When someone doesn't turn up, you ring them and get the bollocks of; I'm just coming, 5 minutes. 20 minutes later I'm ready to explode. I know I shouldn't let it bother me and should expect it but if I'd been told 0900 instead, I'd be fine. I'd take it. I'd even take it if they rang at 0815 and said, shit; we're going to be late.

Problem is they don't. They just say ANYTHING to not get in trouble or get a bollocking at that moment, forgetting it will be much worse when they arrive.

It's like dealing with kids:

Did you break this?
No
Did you break this?
No
Don't lie. I know you broke it, just tell me you did and it will be fine.
I didn't.

SOME TIME LATER - Scamp has had a chat from the other parent

Sorry Dad, I broke it.
*Explosion*

Lie now, don't get in trouble, but eventually you'll have to face it up, but kids and Indians can't see beyond the immediate lie to not get in trouble.

/rantover

Bipat

What you and others don't seem to understand is that what you call culture etc. is actually 'class', yes, I am going to be 'classist', you employ "Indians" of a particular background and judge an entire nationality as the same.
Like stating 'British women all get drunk on a saturday night and lay in the streets'.
Don't you think other Indian people have the same exasperation at some workers behaviour???
"Head wobble" just shows ignorance don't you ever nod your head to indicate 'yes'?

mikewot

Oh my, I'm guessing you've never been in the ME where head wobbling (not nodding or shaking) appears endemic amongst those from the Indian sub continent.

scrubbedexpat141

No. It's nothing to do with class.

It's to do with not being on time (in this example) and saying you will be, when KNOWING you won't be. Because you don't want the bollocking now (I assume).

I haven't said anything about the head wobble. I get it, to a certain extent, but it's almost as frustrating as when Arabs say Inshallah.

Bipat

Can't you see that particular movements of the head become instinctive when used from childhood. (Or even if you have lived there a long time!!),
Just as you nod or shake your head for yes or no??

I have no problems
(I have to explain about various British habits to Indian rels.)

mikewot

No. It is quite bizarre.

Incidentally and apropos nothing at all why are you so aggressive and appear to have to defend every single post? This is rhetorical.

Bipat

You were talking about 'employees' that is a particular "class". It does not include an entire nationality. (Although I am sure as with any nationality even the British, there are middle class liers).

Bipat

Not aggressive, I have also pointed out things that I dislike in India. Just trying to correct gross ignorance.
Also to respond to what is actually a personal insult that all Indians as a nationality lie etc. My family are Indian, my children are as much Indian as British.

PS Why is it bizarre? when your head shaking or nodding is not bizarre?????? ( Just enquiring)

scrubbedexpat141

Nope, wasn't talking about employees. My example was actually about the maintenance guys in my building.

Regardless, you're right that it doesn't apply to everyone. Of course it doesn't. But I'll draw a ring around 'the vast majority' of those I have had dealings with.

Bipat

Thank you, you are right.

(You should hear what some Indian people say about some of their compatriots who go out/come back from ME, maybe envy about the fact that their neighbour, house helper/servant comes back a great deal of money)

Irishbeekeeper

a rubber wall comes to mind...

scrubbedexpat141

I'm sure there are millions of Indians that hate shit I do or other Brits do. Such is life.

norsk

I am still wondering what the point is of all this bickering. Some of us (maybe most of us even) are slightly exasperated at the ridiculousness we have to endure when dealing with Indians we encounter in the Middle East.

What I don't get is why Bipat sees it as his mission to defend an entire country (actually ~14% of the world's population)? I'm pretty sure none of us think that every single person in India behaves the same way...

Then there is of course the shitting in the streets. That's pretty strange behaviour from a country which believes itself to be one of the most progressive economies in the world, but of course I don't think that everyone does it. And actually I don't think it happens in the same way anywhere else regardless of how poor or uneducated the people are so there has to be some other reason why this is somehow acceptable in India.

Irishbeekeeper

X 2

Bahtatboy

I'm pretty sure we couldn't have this sort of open debate in UK without real fear of the consequences of being branded racist.

My kids, who haven't lived in the region since they were too young to remember, but have visited often, sometime look at me in wide-eyed amazement at the things I come out with. "Dad, you can't say that!". The trouble is, what we encounter day-in day-out is representative behavious of various groups (mainly racial, also religious). My view is that if the vast majority of people of a given group who you encounter behave in a particular way, then it defies logic to assume that the majority of people of the entire group (i.e., including those you haven't met) will behave differently. But to make that assumption is racist (or whatever-ist) in modern Britain (Americans at home seem far less restricted), which merely results in many people being closet racists because of the social unacceptability of speaking logically about their experiences.

Apart from the restriction of free speech, it also results in real danger--if I come face-to-face with a tiger in the wild, I'm going to react according to what I've heard from reliable sources about how most other tigers in the wild will behave: I'm not going to assume I've met the deviant, nice one.