dbd33

Glib, but working backwards; Brexit, especially no deal Brexit will damage the economy, I don't think anyone disputes that. The case for Brexit is that emotionally it will be enriching while financially it's impoverishing. See pro-Brexit posts above.

JRM and Johnson, rich men, matter of record. I don't know that they're financially invested in the UK but trust that they are, at least to the extent of having personal chattels there.

No deal Brexit hurts them. Even if Johnson gets a long term as PM he's a big fish in a smaller pond and that's not considering the Union breaking up.

Why do they want the no deal Brexit; what's in it for them?

BritInParis

Let’s just skip to the end: why do you think Boris and JRM want a ‘No Deal’ Brexit when they are doing everything in their power to get the WAB through Parliament?

Novocastrian

But I didn't rely on or appeal to his Brexit position but rather on his fiscal expertise (or at least knowledge base). This was in response to your claim that none who understand how financial markets function would give credence to manipulation of politics by hedge funds etc.

Shard

Glib, but a map of the world with many of pink bits re-coloured. It's British exceptionalism writ large.

BritInParis

Just so, an appeal to authority. “Phil Hammond says it so it must be true” is not a valid argument. I’ve yet to see anyone pushing this theory be able to explain it, Hammond included.

dbd33

I don't think they are doing that. I think they could have softened it a bit and got it through. A customs union for the whole country would likely have made it acceptable to a majority of the house.

dbd33

That asks us to believe that Johnson is acting on principle, misguided but sincere. That's just not credible. There's something, likely a knobbing, in it for him.

Novocastrian

I did not say that, nor would I ever say that. I said that Hammond and other such fiscally fluent people supported an enquiry to be instigated by the Cabinet Secretary so as to investigate what they feel is a highly credible possibility. That's all.

DaveLovesDee

I'd suggest it's because if BoJo and JRM openly supported no deal, when the economy nosedives under a no deal Brexit and it starts to hurt Leavers in their wallets, many of those will start to question why they weren't told how bad it would be. And if, as some polls show, it was the older generation who tended to vote Leave,many of them are barely managing on their income now. It's easy for Leavers to say they're prepared to be financially worse-off to Leave the EU, but another to actually have to do so medium to long term.

But the likes of JRM with his hedge funds and his wife's family money will be insulated from such things, and BoJo won't be short of public-speaking engagements, a book deal, and directorships when he's no longer PM.

Shard

Yes, definitely. They are well insulated, and more than ready to give swashbuckling a try. Personally, they have no downside, unlike the country as a whole. I don't believe it's about personal enrichment, more about power and identity.

dave_j

I wonder whether posters actually read their own posts.
The current proposition is that the Johnson clique is pushing a no-deal Brexit in the full knowledge that it'll cripple the UK economy but they're apparently content with this because they're wealthy and they'll be able to sustain any impact on their wealth because they're all using their hedge fund mates to bet on this outcome and clean up afterwards.
It's an attractive tale, spread by those who'd prefer to believe anything that'd put a spoke into the Brexit wheel, but it's just a little thin when subject to the 'Is this True?' test.
The proposition itself is ludicrous when you stand back, study it, and ask yourself the question, 'Why, when the government has no control over what happens, would Johnson et al bet the farm on anything, especially a no-deal?'

Shard

I find some poster's posts more verbose than others.

dbd33

Because he's not a serious man and it's fun to do things that seem big but don't directly affect oneself. I don't say that he has bet on no deal but the idea isn't at all far-fetched.

dave_j

But that isn't the accusation.
The smear is that Johnson and his rich colleagues stand to benefit financially from his actions. Are you suggesting that none are serious and all simply act because it's a fun thing to do?
I can't believe that JRM ever indulged in fun, can you?

dbd33

No. I think it very likely that JRM has bet on a no deal Brexit.