|
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
Originally Posted by morge
(Post 5830153)
OK, We will start at the beginning.....
when can we expect the european ruling? would a new petition, leaving out mention of the excess funds available, but just mentioning the unfair discrepancy, have a different answer than the previous petition, as surely it diverted attention from the fact that the disparity is unfounded? |
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
Originally Posted by morge
(Post 5830153)
OK, We will start at the beginning. The European Court is going to look at Human Rights and Equality. It will rule on whether it thinks that the British Government is discriminating against it's pensioners that live in countries where the pension is frozen. Nothing to do with the British governments finaces, so let's get that straight.
As for it not being a human rights issue I would ask "Why have they accepted the case then?" and why do we have the largest law firm in Canada representing us there ? The second point about it being financial. It is a fact that should all of the pensioners return to the UK, then the cost to the government in terms of health care and benefits that could be claimed would more than exceed the cost of paying us the uprated pension. In addition to that, if you have done your homework, which is pretty clear that you have not, then you would know that the Pension Fund in the UK cannot be touched and used for any other purpose. The government Actuary report last year will tell you about the financial state of this fund. Go to : http://www.gad.gov.uk/Publications/docs/CM7021.pdf This fund already exceeds the amount required by one sixth and by 2011/12 it will be exceeding the required amount by 90% and still growing. It's not going to change - you said. Do you have a crystal ball then? Perhaps you could tell me the lottery numbers for the Super7. But if you think Im telling you next weeks and then end up having to split the jackpot with the rest of you, then you have another thing coming:D There is the Canadian Alliance of British Pensioners and the British Pensioners in Australia plus South Africa, New Zealand and many of the smaller Commonwealth countries who are fighting this issue. Plus the many relatives and friends of those pensioners in the UK. Plus many of the UK MP's who also feel that we are being treated unfairly - see the signatures against the Early Day Motions to be brought up in the House of Commons. You can find those and look yourself. I do not know your age but you speak as an immature person who has no conception of right or wrong / justice or injustice. If you are an ex-pat who will someday qualify for a UK pension then just maybe you will thank us for getting you the pension you deserve. As for your comments about the third world - they do you no credit. Many of the pensioners work tirelessly for many charities and do so for no reward. They do not get paid. In fact they often put their hand in their pocket to lend support. So that is insulting. Finally :-your quote : worrying about a few measly quid annual increase in a pension that will be only a tiny fraction of what you will need to live on anyway by the time we retire. At last you have got it right. When we win this fight you can thank us because the pension that you will get will be worth that much more. Please do your homework before making comments that do not hold up and should you feel that something that affects you is wrong, then get up and do something about it instead of taking the defeatist attitude that you seem to think we should have. My facts hold up. This is not about not getting NO pension, its about the few percent annual increase after you start to claim whatever you are entitled to from the time you spent paying into the UK system. For most expats thats not going to be a huge amount. Not since they got rid of the retirement class anyway, and if you came on that boat without checking out your retirement benefits here, then you deserve trouble in my opinion. By the time most expats emmigrating in there 20s or 30s retire the amount we are talking about in index linking will be laughably small in real terms. If you think it will affect your material well being in retirement in any real way, then you are not saving enough for your own independent plan. I know right from wrong yada yada yada, but I know a hiding to nothing when I see it too. This is wrong, we agree its wrong, we signed the petition to try and fix it, but beating your head against the wall wont change it now. Carrying on this thread wont change it either. That was my point, someone should kill this thread, it degenerated into name calling and its not stating anything new that wasnt stated 300 posts again. Its time to euthanise it. If you want to go on protesting till you are blue in the face, then good luck to you, its just sad to keep a 300+ post thread alive long after the original topic for discussion has closed, especially as it has degenerated into personal remarks about other posters, and long after all the points have been made, (and agreed with in large part) .)DOZENS of times. You are all either preaching to the converted, or in dbds case to the unconvertable. |
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
Originally Posted by morge
(Post 5830153)
I do not know your age but you speak as an immature person who has no conception of right or wrong / justice or injustice.
(Just defending a poster against the dirty tactic of ad hominen attack, not reentering the debate). |
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
What do old people need money for, anyway? Sitting around stinking of piss doesn't sound like a very expensive hobby.
|
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
[
You are all either preaching to the converted, or in dbds case to the unconvertable.[/QUOTE] :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl: |
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
Originally Posted by bazzz
(Post 5830624)
What do old people need money for, anyway? Sitting around stinking of piss doesn't sound like a very expensive hobby.
|
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
Originally Posted by smiges33
(Post 5830635)
presume you will be old one day unless you plan on leaving the planet early:ohmy:
|
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
Originally Posted by bazzz
(Post 5830641)
I imagine one of those internet-messageboard-death-threats will catch up with me long before then.
|
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
Originally Posted by iaink
(Post 5829490)
This law has been appealed all the way to the house of lords, the countries highest court, and beyond.
But Law can be changed. Think about all those courts that ruled on poll tax issues - didn't stop the law from being changed did it. Where you're right is to say there's no great push for this particular change. That could be because few people are affected by it. Or it could be so few people know about it. Campaigns may increase awareness leading to a bigger push. Someone mentioned what would people in Britain say if they were asked if those moving abroad should get increases. I'm pretty sure most would say no. But what do you think the answer would be if the question was worded in a different way. "Having paid in for your pension, do you think that when the time comes you should get the same returns as everyone else whether you live in the UK, Country A or Country B?" I think the results would be somewhat different when the question directly involves the person being polled. I'm pretty sure not many would agree they should lose it in leaving the UK. I'm absolutely positive nobody (of sound mind) would say give it to me in Country A but not Country B.
Originally Posted by iaink
(Post 5829490)
Pensions increases are not, no matter what you might think, a fundamental human right. Be grateful to get anything at all, and plan accordingly to take care of yourself.
British law has put this law in place. Not surprisingly the British courts have backed it just as they backed that case discriminating against Widowers a few years ago. But the European Court ruled that the (British) law did, in fact, discriminate against Widowers. So British law got changed. Did you not hear about that one? It was about bereaved women qualifying for something while bereaved men did not. Sound familiar? One group of Brits getting something that another group did not. All backed up by the British courts but overturned by the European court as discriminatory. Of course none of this guarantees anything. The European Court is not always consistent. But the fact that a country's legal system has backed it's law means nothing. That's the whole point of having the European Court for such matters surely? The UK signed up to it. What would be the point of that if a different ruling wasn't possible? |
Re: FROZEN Pensions - Action Needed
I think this thread has run its course and turned to name calling, so it's now closed.
Please remind yourselves of the site rules . |
| All times are GMT -12. The time now is 6:27 pm. |
Powered by vBulletin: ©2000 - 2026, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.