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Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:16 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by mpgrewal
What kind of suggestions are you giving?
1. Punish only immigrants, don't you know that immigrants are victims in (99%) of the crimes.

2. Racial issues - Who will accept that the crime was racially motivated. As far as I know there's no standard definition of racism. So no crime will be accepted as 'racist' under Australian Law.
I suggested for both sides, look it once again.

1) Punishment for those migrants only, who earlier agreed on several conditions and then started to do & behave as they wish. This is not fair as they were agreed earlier that, they will be gentle in ozland. There are some people as you say 1% who are victims of migrants as well. We cant ignore even .0001% as well.

2) If not then trully this is time to define it and make new act only if the aussie government is wishing to have a sophisticated & secure aussie society.

A tough punishment is required to control the crime, and if its not there then unfortunately there will be no control over crime and such incidents of racical crime will ultimately disturn australia's image worldwide.
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:19 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

I sincerely hope that Indian media stops calling these attacks racist. I'm sure they have other issues to report than highlighting every murder that happens in Australia.

This isn't doing any good to the Indians living in Australia and it certainly wont do any good to the future migrants.

Last edited by ronan_in_Oz; Jan 8th 2010 at 6:29 pm.
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:23 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by ronan_in_Oz
I sincerely hope that Indian media stop calling these attacks racist. I'm sure they have other issues to report than highlighting every murder that happens in Australia.

This isn't doing any good to the Indians living in Australia and it certainly wont do any good to the future migrants.
So you know that or you are assuming that, the attacks were NOT racically motivated?

However, your suggestions are .
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:24 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by pinkpik
2) If not then trully this is time to define it and make new act only if the aussie government is wishing to have a sophisticated & secure aussie society.
Australian Law won't change for the immigrants. Only immigrants are the victims of 99% crimes or few 'racist' crimes. Why do you think authorities will change laws for the sake of immigrants. A country cares about its natives more than immigrants, isn't it. Let the immigrants suffer
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:27 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by ronan_in_Oz
I sincerely hope that Indian media stop calling these attacks racist. I'm sure they have other issues to report than highlighting every murder that happens in Australia.

This isn't doing any good to the Indians living in Australia and it certainly wont do any good to the future migrants.
http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/soc...0106-lu8y.html



In 2007, according to India's National Crime Records Bureau, 32,318 people were murdered in India. Another 3644 were victims of ''culpable homicide'', roughly equating to manslaughter. In a category of its own, 8093 brides or their relatives were killed in ''dowry deaths'' - murdered by greedy grooms and in-laws angry over the amount of dowry paid by the bride's family. And there were a further 27,401 attempted murders.

By contrast, in 2007, the Australian Bureau of Statistics reports, 255 people were murdered in Australia. Another 28 were victims of manslaughter, and 246 survived attempted murders. No dowry deaths were recorded.

India, of course, is a very big country. But the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime estimates that relative to population, its homicide rate is more than twice that of Australia. It is a country in which violent crime is commonplace - so commonplace that every day more than 100 Indians are murdered by other Indians, yet their TV news channels treat this as humdrum unless it involves some celebrity or unusual features.


Indian student murder furore. Photo: Spooner

Yet when an Indian is murdered overseas, these news channels whip themselves and their viewers into a froth of indignation at the country concerned. How can this happen?, they thunder. How can any civilised nation fail to protect its residents? What kind of racist country is this?

How does this happen? Well, it happens because human beings are imperfect creatures. They can be selfish, they can be hateful, they can enjoy hurting, even killing, other humans. It happens here, it happens in India, it happens everywhere.

Governments can't stop it because they can't control what their citizens do 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Governments can't monitor every suburban park in Melbourne at night to ensure that no teenagers with knives have gathered for an illegal drinking binge. They can't monitor every dark street in India's cities, or every home in its villages, to stop people killing each other.

Australians instinctively know that their parks are not safe places at night, and avoid using them as short cuts. Tragically, Nitin Garg did not know that. And so he has become another victim of our epidemic of alcohol abuse, our tolerance of extreme violence in films and screen games - and yes, of Romper Stomper racism that seems to live on among teenagers in the western suburbs, now directed against Indians instead of Vietnamese.

Does that mean Australia is unsafe? No. Relative to most countries, it is very safe. But you can be unlucky. Like Nitin Garg, you can be in the wrong place at the wrong time - and come up against the worst characteristics of a society.

This was highlighted in the calm, sensible advisory notice on Tuesday by India's Ministry of External Affairs. It warns intending students of the rise in violent attacks on the streets of Melbourne. But it notes that these are occurring all over Melbourne ''without any discernible pattern or rationale behind them . . . often accompanied by verbal abuse, fuelled by alcohol or drugs''. The offenders are ''mainly young people in their teens or early 20s''.

Importantly, the ministry points out that most Indian students ''have a positive experience of living and studying in Australia''. So rather than urging Indians not to come here, it urges them to take ''certain basic precautions'': don't travel alone late at night, and try to stick to ''well-lit, populated areas'', conceal expensive items and tell others where you're going.

It is street-smart survival-kit stuff, as relevant in Delhi or Mumbai as Melbourne. And thank God for some common sense after all the hyperventilating by the humbugs on India's news channels or by the Minister of External Affairs, S.M. Krishna, who called the murder a ''heinous crime against humanity''.

Well, yes. But what of the 32,318 murders, 3644 culpable homicides and 8093 dowry deaths committed in his own country in 2007? Are they not equally ''heinous crimes against humanity''? What is Mr Krishna doing about them? What are the Indian TV networks doing about the huge death toll of Indians killed in India itself (where the annual road toll is now tipped to reach 150,000)?

The networks don't have to make a direct comparison. Urban Delhi spills into the state of Haryana, which is relatively well-off and with a population slightly larger than Australia's. In 2007, Haryana had 1252 homicides/manslaughters/dowry deaths, compared with 283 in Australia. More people were murdered in Haryana over dowries than in Australia for all causes.

Why aren't India's TV networks campaigning against the epidemic of death all around them? Why does it take a murder of an Indian overseas to stir their moral outrage?

Were they equally outraged 10 years ago when Australian missionary Graham Staines and his two sons were burnt alive in their car by Hindu extremists in Orissa? Or in 2004 when Australian tourist Dawn Griggs was robbed, raped and murdered by two taxi drivers after arriving late at night at Delhi airport?

Those murders don't mean India is unsafe for Australians. Rather, we all need to be wary, wherever we are. This time last year, I was in India with the family on holiday, and the worst danger we faced was trying to cross the road. I hope Indians thinking of studying in Australia listen to their diplomats, not to their TV humbugs
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:28 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by pinkpik
So you know that or you are assuming that, the attacks were NOT racically motivated?

However, your suggestions are .
I don't know if these attacks were racist or not. But I do know that it's not fair to call every attack racist and this is exactly what the media is doing right now.
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:40 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by mpgrewal
Australian Law won't change for the immigrants. Only immigrants are the victims of 99% crimes or few 'racist' crimes. Why do you think authorities will change laws for the sake of immigrants. A country cares about its natives more than immigrants, isn't it. Let the immigrants suffer
If its true then this is not one can expect from 2nd best country to live. I dont know but why this kind of attacks are not happening in other countries like Canada where there are more Indians then Australia? It is also a great country to live & work and comprable equal to Australia. Is there any specific acts for racism based crime there in Canada?
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:45 pm
  #218  
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by steve`o
http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/soc...0106-lu8y.html



In 2007, according to India's National Crime Records Bureau, 32,318 people were murdered in India. Another 3644 were victims of ''culpable homicide'', roughly equating to manslaughter. In a category of its own, 8093 brides or their relatives were killed in ''dowry deaths'' - murdered by greedy grooms and in-laws angry over the amount of dowry paid by the bride's family. And there were a further 27,401 attempted murders.

By contrast, in 2007, the Australian Bureau of Statistics reports, 255 people were murdered in Australia. Another 28 were victims of manslaughter, and 246 survived attempted murders. No dowry deaths were recorded.

India, of course, is a very big country. But the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime estimates that relative to population, its homicide rate is more than twice that of Australia. It is a country in which violent crime is commonplace - so commonplace that every day more than 100 Indians are murdered by other Indians, yet their TV news channels treat this as humdrum unless it involves some celebrity or unusual features.


Indian student murder furore. Photo: Spooner

Yet when an Indian is murdered overseas, these news channels whip themselves and their viewers into a froth of indignation at the country concerned. How can this happen?, they thunder. How can any civilised nation fail to protect its residents? What kind of racist country is this?

How does this happen? Well, it happens because human beings are imperfect creatures. They can be selfish, they can be hateful, they can enjoy hurting, even killing, other humans. It happens here, it happens in India, it happens everywhere.

Governments can't stop it because they can't control what their citizens do 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Governments can't monitor every suburban park in Melbourne at night to ensure that no teenagers with knives have gathered for an illegal drinking binge. They can't monitor every dark street in India's cities, or every home in its villages, to stop people killing each other.

Australians instinctively know that their parks are not safe places at night, and avoid using them as short cuts. Tragically, Nitin Garg did not know that. And so he has become another victim of our epidemic of alcohol abuse, our tolerance of extreme violence in films and screen games - and yes, of Romper Stomper racism that seems to live on among teenagers in the western suburbs, now directed against Indians instead of Vietnamese.

Does that mean Australia is unsafe? No. Relative to most countries, it is very safe. But you can be unlucky. Like Nitin Garg, you can be in the wrong place at the wrong time - and come up against the worst characteristics of a society.

This was highlighted in the calm, sensible advisory notice on Tuesday by India's Ministry of External Affairs. It warns intending students of the rise in violent attacks on the streets of Melbourne. But it notes that these are occurring all over Melbourne ''without any discernible pattern or rationale behind them . . . often accompanied by verbal abuse, fuelled by alcohol or drugs''. The offenders are ''mainly young people in their teens or early 20s''.

Importantly, the ministry points out that most Indian students ''have a positive experience of living and studying in Australia''. So rather than urging Indians not to come here, it urges them to take ''certain basic precautions'': don't travel alone late at night, and try to stick to ''well-lit, populated areas'', conceal expensive items and tell others where you're going.

It is street-smart survival-kit stuff, as relevant in Delhi or Mumbai as Melbourne. And thank God for some common sense after all the hyperventilating by the humbugs on India's news channels or by the Minister of External Affairs, S.M. Krishna, who called the murder a ''heinous crime against humanity''.

Well, yes. But what of the 32,318 murders, 3644 culpable homicides and 8093 dowry deaths committed in his own country in 2007? Are they not equally ''heinous crimes against humanity''? What is Mr Krishna doing about them? What are the Indian TV networks doing about the huge death toll of Indians killed in India itself (where the annual road toll is now tipped to reach 150,000)?

The networks don't have to make a direct comparison. Urban Delhi spills into the state of Haryana, which is relatively well-off and with a population slightly larger than Australia's. In 2007, Haryana had 1252 homicides/manslaughters/dowry deaths, compared with 283 in Australia. More people were murdered in Haryana over dowries than in Australia for all causes.

Why aren't India's TV networks campaigning against the epidemic of death all around them? Why does it take a murder of an Indian overseas to stir their moral outrage?

Were they equally outraged 10 years ago when Australian missionary Graham Staines and his two sons were burnt alive in their car by Hindu extremists in Orissa? Or in 2004 when Australian tourist Dawn Griggs was robbed, raped and murdered by two taxi drivers after arriving late at night at Delhi airport?

Those murders don't mean India is unsafe for Australians. Rather, we all need to be wary, wherever we are. This time last year, I was in India with the family on holiday, and the worst danger we faced was trying to cross the road. I hope Indians thinking of studying in Australia listen to their diplomats, not to their TV humbugs
Thats true and thats why any Indians who are peace loving and broad minded who are interested to live in conditions suitable to them are always trying to migrate permanently in developed countries like Canada & Australia. I am referring here skilled migrants here who migrate with their entire families and who want to see their childrens growing in a decent society and enjoy a peaceful live.
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:51 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by ronan_in_Oz
I don't know if these attacks were racist or not. But I do know that it's not fair to call every attack racist and this is exactly what the media is doing right now.
Thats correct. There are always images of Sydney riots in Indian TV media while reporting attacks on indians in australia, they dont know that it was riots between lebanese and white australains and the indians were not in the entire picture and nothing to do with those riots but still they are showing it. In-fact most can say 99.99% indian tv media is full of over smart people with very very few & limited knowledge who dont know meaning of responsible reporting.
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 6:55 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by pinkpik
Thats correct. There are always images of Sydney riots in Indian TV media while reporting attacks on indians in australia, they dont know that it was riots between lebanese and white australains and the indians were not in the entire picture and nothing to do with those riots but still they are showing it. In-fact most can say 99.99% indian tv media is full of over smart people with very very few & limited knowledge who dont know meaning of responsible reporting.
You shouldn't always blame the media. I agree they create bit of hype by saying every crime 'racist'. But they are doing good job of atleast highlighting the atrocities on Indians in front of the world. Good job there Media always has 2 faces, its upto the audience that how they intelligently recognize the right face
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 7:01 pm
  #221  
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by pinkpik
I dont know but why this kind of attacks are not happening in other countries like Canada where there are more Indians then Australia?
No race attacks in Canada ?

Vancounver

Six Indians suffer racial assault in Canada
Six Indians on Tuesday, Jun 9 were racially assaulted by four white Canadians on the outskirts of Vancounver in Canada.
Police said that six Indian men were playing tennis during the weekend when the four suspects approached them and started shouting 'racially based expletives'.
http://news.oneindia.in/2009/06/10/s...in-canada.html
The suspects were formally charged with assault with a weapon, robbery, causing physical harm and uttering threats.
But not charged with race offences ? But the Indian news said it was racist ?
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 7:02 pm
  #222  
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by pinkpik
So you know that or you are assuming that, the attacks were NOT racically motivated?
And do you know that they were racist ?
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 7:04 pm
  #223  
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Originally Posted by pinkpik
Thats the whole idea of emotional pressure technique. If you can think about your family the offenders will also think about their beloved ones before doing any crime.
And you really believe that the idiots that commit such crimes will consider that ?

I begin to despair.
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 7:05 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by ABCDiamond
No race attacks in Canada ?


The suspects were formally charged with assault with a weapon, robbery, causing physical harm and uttering threats.
But not charged with race offences ? But the Indian news said it was racist ?
At least suspects were charged there. Hope suspects start getting charged in Australia also And those 1447 pending cases against Indians should finally see 'a conviction'
 
Old Jan 8th 2010 | 7:11 pm
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Default Re: 2nd Indian found dead

Originally Posted by mpgrewal
You shouldn't always blame the media. I agree they create bit of hype by saying every crime 'racist'. But they are doing good job of atleast highlighting the atrocities on Indians in front of the world. Good job there Media always has 2 faces, its upto the audience that how they intelligently recognize the right face
I am not telling that, they should stop showing that, but there should be a clear picture of whats happening instead of showing wrong images. I know that those images are wrong but most people who dont know about that will understand, see how indians are getting beaten in Australia? Thats what i want to tell.
 


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