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Tax avoidence/evasion

Tax avoidence/evasion

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Old Feb 25th 2015, 5:51 am
  #46  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

Wealth Tax (the name itself illustrates typical socialist anti-wealth policy)

The unlikeliest member of France’s super-rich trundled his wheelbarrow full of potatoes from his smallholding to his attractive, but modest, wood‑and-brick house. Down the road, one of René Allier’s equally fat‑cat neighbours set off in his ancient boat to catch some fish. If he managed to sell them on his market stall, he might make enough to pay his wealth tax.

Mr Allier and his wife, Jacqueline, are not the kind of plutocrats against whom students go on demos. Their van is old and small. Their income is a pension of €600 (£450) a month. Their hands are coarsened by decades of manual work. “We’ve never had a holiday, ever,” he said.

But to their horror, the Alliers, along with 500 other peasant farmers, fishermen and smallholders on the Île de Ré, off France’s Atlantic coast, have in recent years found themselves classed as “wealthy” – and liable for vast bills under the country’s version of the mansion tax. Their fate is a sobering reminder of the perils that may lie ahead if Labour leader Ed Miliband ever tried something similar in Britain.

The wealth tax, first introduced by the Mitterrand government in 1981 and in its present form in 1988, tends to yo-yo, with Right-wing governments reducing it and Left-wing governments putting it up. In 2012, President François Hollande’s socialists sharply increased the rates and bands, dragging in more people. In 2001, only 281,000 paid it. Eleven years later, that had more than doubled, to 600,000.

A testament to the immunity of the Socialist ruling class
Then there are the more advanced forms of avoidance – like those practised by, well, one François Hollande. He may have declared his support for wealth taxes because, in his words, he “hates the rich”. But the then future president and his then partner, Ségolène Royal, also a leading French politician, were monstered by the press in 2007 after it emerged that they had dramatically undervalued their own personal property empire in order to minimise their ISF.

The couple valued what they described as a “modest villa” at Mougins, on the Riviera near Cannes – complete with swimming pool, garden and nice view of the Med – at just €270,000 (then £192,000), a figure greeted with a mixture of disbelief and laughter by locals. A panel of estate agents convened by the investigative newspaper, Le Canard enchaîné, said it was worth three times as much.

Their flat in the expensive Paris suburb of Boulogne-Billancourt was declared to the tax authorities at £535,000, when it was actually worth £850,000. Then there was a third property they used in northern France. Mr Hollande and Ms Royal escaped ISF on this altogether by transferring it to a special property company – owned by themselves and Mr Hollande’s parents. In total, it was estimated, French politics’ premier power couple should have paid £4,300 in ISF that year. They actually paid £616.

Ms Royal’s defence, incidentally, was that the Mougins villa was a “family house, bought more than 20 years ago”. That is, of course, the precise frustration expressed by thousands of other middle-class people across France – but then, they do not support the wealth tax.

After Mr Hollande acceded to the presidency, one of his ministers was found to have taken an even more direct approach to avoiding his dues. In April last year, after flatly denying it for months, Jérôme Cahuzac admitted that he had, for two decades, used a secret bank account at UBS in Geneva to avoid paying French tax. His role in Mr Hollande’s government? He was the minister responsible for tackling tax avoidance.

Last edited by amideislas; Feb 25th 2015 at 6:14 am.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 6:13 am
  #47  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

France's mistake shows taxing wealth doesn't work


Hollande’s tax, levied on incomes above one million euros, has been a miserable failure. Over its lifespan, it raised around $500 million, a tiny fraction of the original projections. Why? Well, the Paris bureaucrats who made those projections overlooked something rather important. Rich people don’t sit around waiting to be taxed. They have all sorts of ways of beating the system, not necessarily involving accountants. The two most straightforward forms of legal tax avoidance are earlier retirement and emigration, and wealthy Frenchmen have made ample use of both.

Parts of Kensington, an expensive district of West London, are now largely Francophone. London is, on some measures, the sixth-largest French city in the world. It pullulates with French financiers and French footballers and French management consultants and French pastry chefs. They have just two things in common. First, all had the get-up-and-go needed to start a career in a new language and a new country. Second, all are paying their taxes to the British Exchequer instead of the French treasury. Merci, mes amis.

The new EU ruling class

A lot of politicians don’t want to hear this. Instead of accepting international competition, they legislate against it — by, for example, imposing international rules on tax harmonization. The new president of the European Commission, Jean-Claude Juncker, has campaigned all his life for European fiscal integration, including financial transaction taxes, debt pooling and a common EU finance ministry. Amusingly, though, it now emerges that while he was mouthing these platitudes, he was, as prime minister of Luxembourg, wooing multi-nationals with secret tax exemptions.

The best way to maximize your tax revenue, though, involves neither harmonization nor secrecy. On the contrary, it involves lower, flatter, simpler taxes.

Europe’s dogmatic ruling class remains wedded to its folly
Proclamations of the euro’s salvation owe more to ideology than to the facts

Members of the political class consider themselves exempt from the routine constraints that apply to their fellow citizens. They feel certain that they are making extraordinary sacrifices, and therefore deserve exceptional compensation (this emotion is the psychological trigger that sets off a great deal of low-level corruption). Once in government, they are soon part of a parallel reality, in which they live and breathe a separate world than the one experienced by voters.

Though this dichotomy is powerfully present at Westminster, it is worse by far on the European mainland, where a barrier between civil society and the state-funded political elite was erected several decades ago. It was this elite that made the collective decision to piledrive through European monetary union at the end of the last century. It literally cannot conceive that the euro might fail, a state of mind that has generated a series of arresting epistemological consequences.

The European elite now constructs reality around the euro, not the other way around – a method that involves all manner of ungainly manoeuvring and deceit. For reasons of space, I can only highlight a few recent examples. Last November, Mariano Rajoy, the Spanish prime minister, told a news conference that he was “totally and absolutely convinced that the worst [of the euro crisis] has passed”. The following month, Olli Rehn, the vice-president of the European Commission, insisted that the Cassandras “have been proved wrong” over Greece, and the euro area more generally. (I have recently been told that in 2011, the BBC apologised to Mr Rehn’s spokesman, Amadeu Altafaj Tardio, after I called him “that idiot in Brussels”, causing him to flounce out of a Newsnight studio. The BBC did so without asking me. For the record, nothing Mr Altafaj Tardio or Mr Rehn have said or done since has caused me to reconsider my opinion.)

Last edited by amideislas; Feb 25th 2015 at 6:41 am.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 7:48 am
  #48  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

EU Tax Greed


Europe is known for its high taxes, but there is one exception: corporate income taxes. Compared to American corporate income taxes – federal and state – the EU has relatively mild tax rates.

While punitive personal income taxes, very high payroll taxes, confiscatory value-added taxes and other taxes contribute to holding Europe back economically, the comparative advantage of moderately reasonable corporate income taxes has helped, on the margin, to prevent the economic crisis from getting even deeper.

Now there is a push in the EU to squander this one little competitive advantage that they have on the global economic arena...

...
The commonly shared wisdom among government expansionists is that all private income belongs to government by default, and that government does the private sector a favor by not raising tax rates to 100 percent. This is why a tax cut is viewed as a “gift” to taxpayers and a “cost” to government.

Therefore, when Ireland allows businesses to make money at a lower tax rate than the rest of the EU, other European government see this as Ireland is giving corporations government money – a corporate subsidy.

But not only that: they see that gift as being not just from the Irish government, but from all European governments. The reason is simple: by having a low corporate tax rate Ireland puts competitive pressure on other EU governments who then have to lower, or at least refrain from raising, their corporate tax rates.

By being forced to hold back taxation, Ireland’s competitors think that they are being forced to give up their own money.

Last edited by amideislas; Feb 25th 2015 at 7:54 am.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 8:34 am
  #49  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

European Competitiveness deficit - World Economic Forum

Europe’s competitiveness deficit, together with the competitiveness divide that has developed within its own borders, has jointly led to stagnation or declining growth, rising unemployment and fiscal instability.

With a series of reforms under way and more yet to come, Rebuilding Europe’s Competitiveness highlights five key enablers that will be pivotal to making these measures work. These are: strong collaboration across stakeholders, political consistency, political leadership, sense of urgency as well as strong and clear communication plans.
Curiously, all focus on political objectives, yet devoid of any practical competitive advantage facilitators, such as tax relief, job creation, spending/subsidy and regulatory reform, etc.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 8:49 am
  #50  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

This thread seems to have graviated/deviated into an anti EU campaign rather than discussing tax/ tax avoidance.
The burden of tax has always been unfairly placed on the shoulders of those who can least afford it and whose daily spending has a greater effect on the health of any economy.
The "black " economy in part is a result of what the averaged waged see as an unfairness in the system.
IE Why should we pay tax when corporations and certain individuals do not.
THis of course is not the only reason but it is a factor.
France is a good example of what NOT to do, the UK is perhaps one of a tax regime moving in the right direction.
The idealist in me would like to see a EU tax regime based on the best of the member countries but of course that will not happen just as there will never be a common EU tax regime.
Closing tax havens is another matter as the size of the economies of havens and the contribution they make to the European economy is minimal but the PR effect on the mass of tax payers would be significant
The only people it would hurt would be the tax avoiders and those involved in the aiding of tax avoidance/evasion.
Competative tax regimes such as the example of Ireland are an acceptable incentive if a country is trying to attract genuine inward investment.
How else would the UK have attracted Nissan, Toyota, Honda etc.
But there is a big difference to a company that not only employs thousands but also generated similar levels of indirect employment in the country and that which uses a country as a means of avoiding tax in those countries where it economically active and where its profits are generated.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 9:07 am
  #51  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

Originally Posted by EMR
Closing tax havens is another matter
Until an across the board agreement on what constitutes a Tax Haven is found then nothing can be done, they are not illegal.

One country's low corporation tax maybe considered, but another country may have lower personal tax or VAT etc.

Tax harmonisation across a group of countries ( EU for example ) could stifle competition and lead to stagnation.

The USA has been mentioned but even there there is no tax harmonisation.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 9:19 am
  #52  
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Originally Posted by Fredbargate
Until an across the board agreement on what constitutes a Tax Haven is found then nothing can be done, they are not illegal.

One country's low corporation tax maybe considered, but another country may have lower personal tax or VAT etc.

Tax harmonisation across a group of countries ( EU for example ) could stifle competition and lead to stagnation.

The USA has been mentioned but even there there is no tax harmonisation.
What will happen is that individual countries will start to look increasingly at schemes promoted within their regime and declare them illegal.
THis is happening on an almost daily in the UK.
Thus low tax havens will still exist but those selling schemes based in these countries will find that they are running out of customers.

Last edited by EMR; Feb 25th 2015 at 9:24 am.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 9:31 am
  #53  
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Forgetting the amount of tax to be raised where tax avoidance occurs it is those that do not have the capability to avoid tax that suffer as they have to make up the shortfall.
In the UK that is primarily those in middle of the road PAYE employment.
This section of the community whether they be teachers, bank clerks etc. have no such opportunity to avoid the tax they pay yet they see at one end the massive amounts of tax avoided by big business and the mega wealthy. At the other end of the scale they see their friends, neighbours etc avoiding their share of the tax burden by working for cash and not fully disclosing this to the tax man, working on a self employed basis and paying themselves dividends in lieu of salary avoiding NI contributions, employing family members who do not actually perform any function in the business to lessen their taxable income etc. etc.
It is the unfairness of the system that is the problem and I think the squeezed middle exists because of the tax avoidance of others.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 9:31 am
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So you believe that the problem lies with individual countries and their lack of legislation and not with the country that has a different tax regime. ?
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 9:40 am
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

Originally Posted by Fredbargate
So you believe that the problem lies with individual countries and their lack of legislation and not with the country that has a different tax regime. ?
Both.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 9:44 am
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Originally Posted by johnnyone
Both.
Why?
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 9:54 am
  #57  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

Originally Posted by EMR
This thread seems to have graviated/deviated into an anti EU campaign rather than discussing tax/ tax avoidance.
The burden of tax has always been unfairly placed on the shoulders of those who can least afford it and whose daily spending has a greater effect on the health of any economy.
The "black " economy in part is a result of what the averaged waged see as an unfairness in the system.
IE Why should we pay tax when corporations and certain individuals do not.
THis of course is not the only reason but it is a factor.
France is a good example of what NOT to do, the UK is perhaps one of a tax regime moving in the right direction.
The idealist in me would like to see a EU tax regime based on the best of the member countries but of course that will not happen just as there will never be a common EU tax regime.
Closing tax havens is another matter as the size of the economies of havens and the contribution they make to the European economy is minimal but the PR effect on the mass of tax payers would be significant
The only people it would hurt would be the tax avoiders and those involved in the aiding of tax avoidance/evasion.
Competative tax regimes such as the example of Ireland are an acceptable incentive if a country is trying to attract genuine inward investment.
How else would the UK have attracted Nissan, Toyota, Honda etc.
But there is a big difference to a company that not only employs thousands but also generated similar levels of indirect employment in the country and that which uses a country as a means of avoiding tax in those countries where it economically active and where its profits are generated.
By George, I think you may be starting to get it.

The common wisdom is that "tax avoidance" or "tax evasion" of "greedy" individuals and corporations are the scourge that has led to our continuing decline.

Yet that view patently dismisses the massive tax greed that is so prevalent in European socialistic policy (and the motivations to evade it), as is consistently illustrated, increasingly under the control of an immune ruling class, funded largely by the average citizen, whilst the elite and ruling class enjoy increasing immunity.

Precious few ever consider that if the system did not focus burden on the wealth of the average citizen in favour of the elite and ruling class, the widespread motivation to evade the system at all levels would be a moot point.

That's actually a pretty predictable trend, as it has always been in socialist politics. You only need to look at the socialist experiments that have consistently miserably failed, as a result of inherent self-servitude of a paternal ruling class: Most recently, Argentina, Venezuela, and throughout Latin and south America. I need not bother with the Soviet Union, nor most of Eastern Europe.

You can argue that Norway, Ecuador, even Bolivia are stable socialist states (Sweden is facing increasing economic difficulty as we speak), but ironically, they are almost entirely funded by a rather capitalist state sale of massive natural resources. Something Europe is not nearly as fortunate to possess.

I need not mention China - who has only succeeded in incubating a massive middle class through the adoption of mass capitalism, after generations of abject poverty - except of course, for the Chinese ruling class.

So, to reasonably label this as an "anti-EU" argument, one must patently dismiss the fact that the EU's Socialist politics and its predictably self-serving policies are demonstrably the very reason for the topic of this thread.

Last edited by amideislas; Feb 25th 2015 at 9:59 am.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 10:03 am
  #58  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

Originally Posted by amideislas
By George, I think you may be starting to get it.

The common wisdom is that "tax avoidance" or "tax evasion" of "greedy" individuals and corporations are the scourge that has led to our continuing decline.

Yet that view patently dismisses the massive tax greed that is so prevalent in European socialistic policy (and the motivations to evade it), as is consistently illustrated, increasingly under the control of an immune ruling class, funded largely by the average citizen, whilst the elite and ruling class enjoy increasing immunity.

Precious few ever consider that if the system did not burden the wealth of the average citizen in favour of the elite and ruling class, the widespread motivation to evade the system at all levels would be a moot point.

That's actually a pretty predictable trend, as it has always been in socialist politics. You only need to look at the socialist experiments that have consistently miserably failed, as a result of inherent self-servitude of a paternal ruling class: Most recently, Argentina, Venezuela, and throughout Latin and south America. I need not bother with the Soviet Union, nor most of Eastern Europe.

You can argue that Norway, Ecuador, even Bolivia are stable socialist states (Sweden is facing increasing economic difficulty as we speak), but ironically, they are almost entirely funded by a rather capitalist state sale of massive natural resources. Something Europe is not nearly as fortunate to possess.

I need not mention China - who has only succeeded in incubating a massive middle class through the adoption of mass capitalism, after generations of abject poverty - except of course, for the Chinese ruling class.

So, to reasonably label this as an "anti-EU" argument, one must patently dismiss the fact that the EU's Socialist politics and its predictably self-serving policies are demonstrably the very reason for the topic of this thread.
They may be for you but for me its about the man in the street having to carry less of a tax burden and that tax is more fairly applied and paid by those individuals and companies who have the ability to avoid/evade it.
Who ever and where ever they are.

As society where access to unlimited health care , decent living conditions, a living wage, access to a decent education you may call socialist I belive it to be the right of every one of us.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 10:05 am
  #59  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

Originally Posted by amideislas
By George, I think you may be starting to get it.

The common wisdom is that "tax avoidance" or "tax evasion" of "greedy" individuals and corporations are the scourge that has led to our continuing decline.

Yet that view patently dismisses the massive tax greed that is so prevalent in European socialistic policy (and the motivations to evade it), as is consistently illustrated, increasingly under the control of an immune ruling class, funded largely by the average citizen, whilst the elite and ruling class enjoy increasing immunity.

Precious few ever consider that if the system did not burden the wealth of the average citizen in favour of the elite and ruling class, the widespread motivation to evade the system at all levels would be a moot point.

That's actually a pretty predictable trend, as it has always been in socialist politics. You only need to look at the socialist experiments that have consistently miserably failed, as a result of inherent self-servitude of a paternal ruling class: Most recently, Argentina, Venezuela, and throughout Latin and south America. I need not bother with the Soviet Union, nor most of Eastern Europe.

You can argue that Norway, Ecuador, even Bolivia are stable socialist states (Sweden is facing increasing economic difficulty as we speak), but ironically, they are almost entirely funded by a rather capitalist state sale of massive natural resources. Something Europe is not nearly as fortunate to possess.

I need not mention China - who has only succeeded in incubating a massive middle class through the adoption of mass capitalism, after generations of abject poverty - except of course, for the Chinese ruling class.

So, to reasonably label this as an "anti-EU" argument, one must patently dismiss the fact that the EU's Socialist politics and its predictably self-serving policies are demonstrably the very reason for the topic of this thread.
They may be for you but for me its about the man in the street having to carry less of a tax burden and that tax is more fairly applied and paid by those individuals and companies who have the ability to avoid/evade it.
Who ever and where ever they are.

As society where access to unlimited health care , decent living conditions, a living wage, access to a decent education you may call socialist I believe it to be the right of every one of us.
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Old Feb 25th 2015, 10:11 am
  #60  
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Default Re: Tax avoidence/evasion

Nobody (including myself) are against public health care , decent living conditions, a living wage, access to a decent education. Traditionally socialism has never been able to fully realise that dream in any "quality" way, in addition to the predictable ruling class aristocracy.

Many would argue that if the forest is healthy, the leaves of the trees flourish.

I just can't reckon how collecting all the leaves off the trees can be ever good for the forest.

Last edited by amideislas; Feb 25th 2015 at 10:26 am.
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