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Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

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Old Aug 9th 2013, 11:57 am
  #406  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Zen10
I would argue that British human nature has changed in the last 50 years, and more broadly English-speaking culture. It has become mercenary because of the economic model imposed on people. Manufacturing was destroyed and replaced with casino economics. Now our culture is dysfunctional to the point we have a Prime Minister going round car plants begging the workers to be more like Germans, a people who did not dismantle their manufacturing base in the 1980s and still have old-fashioned values and respect. You can't get that back when it's gone, as the British are slowly discovering.
Ironically, the UK worker probably needs to be more like a German worker due to their overall better work ethic, better training and attitude to work, but if our consumers were like Germans and frugal the economy would be more screwed than it already is because in picking apart the current 'uplifting' growth targets it seems to be consumer expenditure funded by debt that is still the key mainstay of the economy alongside public expenditure - nothing has changed.

Onlookers point to the inadequate training, poor management leadership, lack of innovation and lack of investment in industry as main reasons for UK industry in particular not moving ahead these days as much as it should and as much as is needed.

This is not helped by a general skills shortage currently being in part met by importation of labour. Crackdowns on migrants in general will not help UK industry in its efforts at growing and competing globally.

What is more, the UK needs migrants as overall they are greater contributors to the Government purse than home-growns because their time in the UK causes them to overall proportionally absorb fewer UK Govt / taxpayer-funded services while they pay more in taxes.

All of this may not have a bearing on an individual's experience setting-up shop in the UK depending upon what they have to offer in terms of demonstrable skills and qualifications but it will and does colour the state of the economy and the ability of the government to fund services and pay its bills and some of this must trickle down.

After all, right or wrong, the Chancellor of the Exchequer's strategy is to cut away the levels of UK Government fat and debt and keep interest rates low to allow for reduced taxes, to enable unfettered UK industry to then forge ahead. A trimming of rules and regulations would help too.

Last edited by Pistolpete2; Aug 9th 2013 at 12:01 pm.
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 12:15 pm
  #407  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Pistolpete2
Ironically, the UK worker probably needs to be more like a German worker due to their overall better work ethic, better training and attitude to work, but if our consumers were like Germans and frugal the economy would be more screwed than it already is because in picking apart the current 'uplifting' growth targets it seems to be consumer expenditure funded by debt that is still the key mainstay of the economy alongside public expenditure - nothing has changed.

Onlookers point to the inadequate training, poor management leadership, lack of innovation and lack of investment in industry as main reasons for UK industry in particular not moving ahead these days as much as it should and as much as is needed.

This is not helped by a general skills shortage currently being in part met by importation of labour. Crackdowns on migrants in general will not help UK industry in its efforts at growing and competing globally.

What is more, the UK needs migrants as overall they are greater contributors to the Government purse than home-growns because their time in the UK causes them to overall proportionally absorb fewer UK Govt / taxpayer-funded services while they pay more in taxes.

All of this may not have a bearing on an individual's experience setting-up shop in the UK depending upon what they have to offer in terms of demonstrable skills and qualifications but it will and does colour the state of the economy and the ability of the government to fund services and pay its bills and some of this must trickle down.

After all, right or wrong, the Chancellor of the Exchequer's strategy is to cut away the levels of UK Government fat and debt and keep interest rates low to allow for reduced taxes, to enable unfettered UK industry to then forge ahead. A trimming of rules and regulations would help too.
Surely the reason, if correct, that the homegrowns, absorb more government funded services, is, in part, because they have to compete* for tax paying jobs with the growing population. I can't see why if unemployment is at 'x' millions we have to import 'y' amount of more workers.

I could never understand why the government boasts about more and more children going to university and attaining degrees at the same time as 'having to' import more qualified staff from other countries. I'm thinking of the nursing profession in particular.

* or refuse to compete.

Last edited by Bud the Wiser; Aug 9th 2013 at 12:17 pm. Reason: Error
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 12:20 pm
  #408  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by TheEmperorIsNaked
Well it seems we are to go on for another 27 pages; and counting.

Just to be clear: I have absolutely no illusions. NONE.

What disgusts me is the need to show the UK in the worst possible light. It is all very well to criticise those who have a more positive outlook, but given that we are British, talking about Britain, I feel somewhat more of a rapport with those who don't feel the obsessive need to ensure their Mother country is not looked on in any positive way.

The only counter to those who are more positive is to accuse them of naivety or honeymoon phases- or rose tints. That is how far the need to trash goes.
It is incomprehensible to the doomgloomers that anyone can have a positive view, or even experience a decent life in the UK.
It doesn't matter if so many live happily there; they HAVE to be wrong!

That is why I have such utter contempt for you people. You simply don't give up! Leave no turn unstoned. That has way more with justifying your own location than the UK.

Well OK. No time for specifics now, but it seems we have only just got started.

So be it.

(And try and allow time for responses before you deny a modus operandii that is so blatantly transparent).
Spot on again, we are loving being here, there are the odd things we dont like but overall life is good. As you say we must surely be wrong or making it up or laughably we are still in the honeymoon period. Of course it could be that we are just happy here
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 1:46 pm
  #409  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Bud the Wiser
Surely the reason, if correct, that the homegrowns, absorb more government funded services, is, in part, because they have to compete* for tax paying jobs with the growing population. I can't see why if unemployment is at 'x' millions we have to import 'y' amount of more workers.

I could never understand why the government boasts about more and more children going to university and attaining degrees at the same time as 'having to' import more qualified staff from other countries. I'm thinking of the nursing profession in particular.

* or refuse to compete.
There will be a level of unemployment in the UK no matter what happens - supposedly that level is around 5%+, presumably mostly because there is a skills miss-match and the employment is not available where the jobs are. In the same way, there is a difference between the degrees and skill levels that graduates attain and the skills and qualifications that employers are actually looking for. There are loads of unfilled vacancies in high tech areas, civil engineering, film production and the more technical areas of nursing for example, but no home-growns applying because that's not what they aspire to do for one reason or another. As a result, employers are almost completely free to hire migrants in these select job areas without going through the usual immigration procedures.

Plus, if/when the economy truly picks up, there will be loads of sidelined individuals not presently seeking work who will filter back into the system and have to be included/counted as unemployed before they end up falling into the ranks of the employed which will make it hard to get the unemployment rate down towards the so called minimum.

Last edited by Pistolpete2; Aug 9th 2013 at 2:53 pm. Reason: 5%+
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 6:41 pm
  #410  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Bud the Wiser
The argument is that we need more people to increase the tax revenue to help fund the aging population, but the increased population also grow old, so who funds them. A Ponzi scheme indeed. And as the population grows resources become more scarce and, and therefore more expensive. i.e. housing, energy, food.

Are we growing more food? Serious question.
Clearly we need the NHS to kill more old people.
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 6:46 pm
  #411  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Giantaxe
Clearly we need the NHS to kill more old people.
They are obviously part of this nefarious Ponzi scheme.
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 6:46 pm
  #412  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Giantaxe
Clearly we need the NHS to kill more old people.
Mid-Staffordshire are leading the way..............

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/10...00-deaths.html
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 6:56 pm
  #413  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Bud the Wiser
Mid-Staffordshire are leading the way..............

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/10...00-deaths.html
300? Pfft. We need to kill tens of thousands, maybe more...
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 7:01 pm
  #414  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Giantaxe
300? Pfft. We need to kill tens of thousands, maybe more...
They're working on it..............

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/he...iser-says.html
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 7:05 pm
  #415  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Bud the Wiser
They're working on it..............

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/he...iser-says.html
They need to work on it harder... life expectancy in the UK has risen faster than in the US over the last two decades. What's more, they seem to be killing younger people too; how's that for poor public policy?

Last edited by Giantaxe; Aug 9th 2013 at 7:11 pm.
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 7:17 pm
  #416  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Giantaxe
They need to work on it harder... life expectancy in the UK has risen faster than in the US over the last two decades. What's more, they seem to be killing younger people too; how's that for poor public policy?
Can't trust the government to get policy 100% right.

First there was Harold Shipman
Then came Mid-Staffs hospital
Followed by 15 other hospital trusts
They eventually got caught with the Liverpool care pathway idea.
Before you know it the old folks will have to sign up to Dignitas in order to get a bus pass.

Mark my words.
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 9:22 pm
  #417  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Pistolpete2
Ironically, the UK worker probably needs to be more like a German worker due to their overall better work ethic, better training and attitude to work, but if our consumers were like Germans and frugal the economy would be more screwed than it already is because in picking apart the current 'uplifting' growth targets it seems to be consumer expenditure funded by debt that is still the key mainstay of the economy alongside public expenditure - nothing has changed.

Onlookers point to the inadequate training, poor management leadership, lack of innovation and lack of investment in industry as main reasons for UK industry in particular not moving ahead these days as much as it should and as much as is needed.

This is not helped by a general skills shortage currently being in part met by importation of labour. Crackdowns on migrants in general will not help UK industry in its efforts at growing and competing globally.

What is more, the UK needs migrants as overall they are greater contributors to the Government purse than home-growns because their time in the UK causes them to overall proportionally absorb fewer UK Govt / taxpayer-funded services while they pay more in taxes.

All of this may not have a bearing on an individual's experience setting-up shop in the UK depending upon what they have to offer in terms of demonstrable skills and qualifications but it will and does colour the state of the economy and the ability of the government to fund services and pay its bills and some of this must trickle down.

After all, right or wrong, the Chancellor of the Exchequer's strategy is to cut away the levels of UK Government fat and debt and keep interest rates low to allow for reduced taxes, to enable unfettered UK industry to then forge ahead. A trimming of rules and regulations would help too.
The exact problem. The problem with the British economy is that has embraced an economic model that has been demonstrated not to work, but it does enrich those controlling what kind of economy the British embrace, so it goes round in neat little circles, for ever increasing the wealth gap. The Australians are doing the same thing.
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 10:24 pm
  #418  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Bud the Wiser
Can't trust the government to get policy 100% right.

First there was Harold Shipman
Then came Mid-Staffs hospital
Followed by 15 other hospital trusts
They eventually got caught with the Liverpool care pathway idea.
Before you know it the old folks will have to sign up to Dignitas in order to get a bus pass.

Mark my words.
The Liverpool care pathway is used worldwide.....how about checking a few details before you rush in to slag off the UK.

Dodgy doctors also exist everywhere.....and hospital problems are not unique to the UK

Not sure what you want to achieve with these constant, selective, negative posts about the UK......or maybe I do know

Last edited by Grayling; Aug 9th 2013 at 10:31 pm.
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Old Aug 9th 2013, 11:28 pm
  #419  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Grayling
The Liverpool care pathway is used worldwide.....how about checking a few details before you rush in to slag off the UK.

Dodgy doctors also exist everywhere.....and hospital problems are not unique to the UK

Not sure what you want to achieve with these constant, selective, negative posts about the UK......or maybe I do know
Lighten up.
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Old Aug 10th 2013, 1:50 am
  #420  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Bud the Wiser
Lighten up.
What extraordinary irony coming from you.

Later.
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