The Reid

On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 10:44:58 +0100, Tim C. <[email protected]>
wrote:

>>Why SHOULD they be so exposed? They've paid for their
>>seats, too, and have a right to expect a reasonably quiet
>>journey.
>
>They have the /right/ to a seat. Nothing more, nothing less.

Do you really think that? Surely we all have a responsibility to not
make others flights unpleasant and a reasonable expectation that the
person next to us wont do unpleasant things? We don't just book a
seat, we book the whole package from safety record on up.

>If they want to be reasonably certain of having a /peaceful/ flight then
>they should go first class (not business as they are normally the worst of
>all).

that's just saying rich people can avoid problems most cant, its like
saying to some pensioner frightened of yobs on PT, hire a chauffeur
driven limo.
--
Mike Reid
UK walking, food, photos "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Spain walking, food, tourism "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk"
Beginners UK flight sim addons "http://www.lawn-mower-man.co.uk"

-Martin

On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 01:37:38 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 01:14:24 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>
> ... On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 00:48:18 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:
> ...
> ... >On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 00:32:15 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
> ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
> ... >
> ... > ... On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 00:16:24 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:
> ... > ...
> ... > ... >On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 23:38:37 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
> ... > ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
> ... > ... >
> ... > ... > ... On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 18:59:50 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:
> ... > ... > ...
> ... > ... > ... >On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 18:48:36 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
> ... > ... > ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
> ... > ... > ... >
> ... > ... > ... > ... On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 10:42:57 -0700, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)"
> ... > ... > ... > ... <[email protected]> wrote:
> ... > ... > ... > ...
> ... > ... > ... > ... >(These are the same children who can be taken to restaurants
> ... > ... > ... > ... > and public functions without annoying the other patrons.)
> ... > ... > ... > ...
> ... > ... > ... > ... Mine! )
> ... > ... > ... >
> ... > ... > ... >Except when they destroy English pubs.
> ... > ... > ...
> ... > ... > ... Wrong tense, my kids are in their twenties.
> ... > ... >
> ... > ... >They can still destroy English pubs.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... but like you and I they don't.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... They are both very well behaved having been educated at the same school as
> ... > ... little Miss Bartlett.
> ... >
> ... >She destroys pubs too??
> ...
> ... Do you mean you do too?
>
>Your son used to.

Before he reached the age of reason. He is 26 now.

Were you the perfect little girl who was seen, but never heard?
--

Martin

-Martin

On Tue, 6 Mar 2007 06:53:03 +0100, [email protected] (Mister Bartlett) wrote:

>Martin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 5 Mar 2007 22:10:58 +0100, [email protected] (Mister Bartlett) wrote:
>>
>> >David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*) <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Mister Bartlett <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > If you were on a small craft, one assumes there were not
>> >> > > hundreds of fellow-passengers to consider!
>> >> >
>> >> > Heaven forbid that Fellow Passengers should be exposed to the fact that
>> >> > small children are Not Silent !!!
>> >>
>> >> First it was the ravage of disease, now the noise. She should make her
>> >> mind up.
>> >
>> >Air travel is a risky undertaking these days - and that's even without
>> >KLM food!
>>
>> and DVT.
>
>We watch the in-flight movie rather than taking a DVT-player ...

on medical advice?
--

Martin

Jeremyrh Geo

On 5 mrt, 21:39, Tom Peel <[email protected]> wrote:

> Did you ever stop to wonder why we didn't do just that?
> Budget airlines here use extortioniate call center telephone numbers to
> handle customer questions. They make almost as much money on customer
> phone calls as they do flying customers around.
> T.

I would say that making a holiday arrangement for an unborn child is a
risky business. Before Bartlette was born we did NOTHING by way of
preparation in terms of, say, buying a cot, clothing etc. It just felt
to us like bad karma. Plans can go astray. Pray that nothing goes
wrong, but it can do, and the mother and/or baby may not be fit to
travel when you're planning your holiday. Why not just wait? Otherwise
just put the cost of the phone call into the category of necessary
expenses.

B;

-Martin

On Tue, 6 Mar 2007 06:53:03 +0100, [email protected] (Mister Bartlett) wrote:

>Erick T. Barkhuis <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*):
>> > Mister Bartlett <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >
>> > > EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) <[email protected]> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > If you were on a small craft, one assumes there were not
>> > > > hundreds of fellow-passengers to consider!
>> > >
>> > > Heaven forbid that Fellow Passengers should be exposed to the fact that
>> > > small children are Not Silent !!!
>> >
>> > First it was the ravage of disease, now the noise.
>>
>> What about the smell?
>
>You're right - I hate the smell of OLD people !

and KLM fish on the Rome to A'dam flight.

Caught off West Africa, imported and packed in Katwijk, left standing somewhere
to rot, put on a plane to Rome stored until needed at blood heat and served to
the starving in business class.
--

Martin

-Martin

On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 10:33:12 +0100, Tim C. <[email protected]> wrote:

>Following up to gerald <[email protected]> :
>
>>On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 13:13:05 +0100, Martin <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>The baby doesn't get a seat. I don't understand why the airline is making an
>>>issue of it. If you just book two seats now isn't that sufficient? You can
>>>always buy the baby's ticket later????
>>
>>
>> sounds to me like they have enough intelligence to realize
>>that it is dangerous to not put the baby in a seat or a basset of it's
>>own.
>
>Babies don't fit the seats or belts. I.m.e. you get given small harness
>that fits the baby and clips to the adult's seatbelt.

Which we used, but always found dangerous. In a crash the mother folds over the
baby.
--

Martin

Jeremyrh Geo

On 6 mrt, 11:06, Martin <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Tue, 6 Mar 2007 06:53:03 +0100, [email protected] (Mister Bartlett) wrote:
> >Erick T. Barkhuis <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >> David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*):
> >> > Mister Bartlett <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >> > > EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >> > > > If you were on a small craft, one assumes there were not
> >> > > > hundreds of fellow-passengers to consider!
>
> >> > > Heaven forbid that Fellow Passengers should be exposed to the fact that
> >> > > small children are Not Silent !!!
>
> >> > First it was the ravage of disease, now the noise.
>
> >> What about the smell?
>
> >You're right - I hate the smell of OLD people !
>
> and KLM fish on the Rome to A'dam flight.
>
> Caught off West Africa, imported and packed in Katwijk, left standing somewhere
> to rot, put on a plane to Rome stored until needed at blood heat and served to
> the starving in business class.

Or to my sister in Scheveningen.

B;

-Martin

On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 23:56:02 -0700, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>
>Mister Bartlett wrote:
>
>> EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>If you were on a small craft, one assumes there were not
>>>hundreds of fellow-passengers to consider!
>>
>>
>> Heaven forbid that Fellow Passengers should be exposed to the fact that
>> small children are Not Silent !!!
>
>Why SHOULD they be so exposed? They've paid for their
>seats, too, and have a right to expect a reasonably quiet
>journey. Even very small children can be taught to behave
>reasonably well in public, and intelligent parents make
>provisions for keeping their children amused without
>disturbing fellow passengers unduly. Not everyone finds the
>human young irresistible - especially those whose doting
>parents think their offspring can do no wrong!

The discussion started off as being Tom's future baby, when it is a few weeks
old.
--

Martin

Erick T . Barkhuis

Tom Peel:
> Martin schrieb:

> > Which airline are you using?
>
> At last, a serious on topic response, thankyou Martin thankyou!
>
> HLX, now part of TUIFly. Their callcentre is one of those 01805 numbers
> that will bankrupt you listening to "All our lines are busy, please hold
> the line".

I haven't read every post in this thread, but....

do you _have_ to fly HLX/TUIFly if their call center is that bad? Isn't
there another airline that may get you and your (future) family to your
destination and that will listen to your questions?

--
Erick

-Magda

On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 11:03:04 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:

... On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 01:37:38 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:
...
... >On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 01:14:24 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... >
... > ... On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 00:48:18 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:
... > ...
... > ... >On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 00:32:15 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
... > ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... > ... >
... > ... > ... On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 00:16:24 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:
... > ... > ...
... > ... > ... >On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 23:38:37 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
... > ... > ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... > ... > ... >
... > ... > ... > ... On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 18:59:50 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:
... > ... > ... > ...
... > ... > ... > ... >On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 18:48:36 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
... > ... > ... > ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... > ... > ... > ... >
... > ... > ... > ... > ... On Mon, 05 Mar 2007 10:42:57 -0700, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)"
... > ... > ... > ... > ... <[email protected]> wrote:
... > ... > ... > ... > ...
... > ... > ... > ... > ... >(These are the same children who can be taken to restaurants
... > ... > ... > ... > ... > and public functions without annoying the other patrons.)
... > ... > ... > ... > ...
... > ... > ... > ... > ... Mine! )
... > ... > ... > ... >
... > ... > ... > ... >Except when they destroy English pubs.
... > ... > ... > ...
... > ... > ... > ... Wrong tense, my kids are in their twenties.
... > ... > ... >
... > ... > ... >They can still destroy English pubs.
... > ... > ...
... > ... > ... but like you and I they don't.
... > ... > ...
... > ... > ... They are both very well behaved having been educated at the same school as
... > ... > ... little Miss Bartlett.
... > ... >
... > ... >She destroys pubs too??
... > ...
... > ... Do you mean you do too?
... >
... >Your son used to.
...
... Before he reached the age of reason. He is 26 now.

Don't say that yours "can be taken to restaurants and public functions without annoying
the other patrons", then.

... Were you the perfect little girl who was seen, but never heard?

I was the one who never destroyed her toys (or anyone else's, for that matter). Even the
books I had then are intact, not a single page missing.

As for being heard... it never happened. It still doesn't happen today, by the way. Plus
�a change, plus c'est la m�me chose.

-Martin

On Tue, 6 Mar 2007 11:17:38 +0100, Erick T. Barkhuis
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Tom Peel:
>> Martin schrieb:
>
>> > Which airline are you using?
>>
>> At last, a serious on topic response, thankyou Martin thankyou!
>>
>> HLX, now part of TUIFly. Their callcentre is one of those 01805 numbers
>> that will bankrupt you listening to "All our lines are busy, please hold
>> the line".
>
>I haven't read every post in this thread, but....
>
>do you _have_ to fly HLX/TUIFly if their call center is that bad? Isn't
>there another airline that may get you and your (future) family to your
>destination and that will listen to your questions?

TUI have travel agencies, most if not all of the big Dutch agencies belong to
TUI.
In travel agencies you can ask questions and the staff can use the phone at
their expense to get answers if they need to.

Incidentally, in ABNAMRO banks when told that I can dial a premium number to get
an answer, I reply that I am the customer and the employee can do the dialling
at ABNAMRO's expense.
--

Martin

-Magda

On Tue, 06 Mar 2007 10:46:55 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Tim C. <[email protected]>
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:

... Following up to Erick T. Barkhuis <[email protected]> :
...
... >David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*):
... >> Mister Bartlett <[email protected]> wrote:
... >>
... >> > EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) <[email protected]> wrote:
... >> >
... >> > > If you were on a small craft, one assumes there were not
... >> > > hundreds of fellow-passengers to consider!
... >> >
... >> > Heaven forbid that Fellow Passengers should be exposed to the fact that
... >> > small children are Not Silent !!!
... >>
... >> First it was the ravage of disease, now the noise.
... >
... >What about the smell?
...
... Newly born babies don't smell much.

They poop 'round the clock.

-Martin

On 6 Mar 2007 02:04:55 -0800, [email protected] wrote:

>On 5 mrt, 21:39, Tom Peel <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Did you ever stop to wonder why we didn't do just that?
>> Budget airlines here use extortioniate call center telephone numbers to
>> handle customer questions. They make almost as much money on customer
>> phone calls as they do flying customers around.
>> T.
>
>I would say that making a holiday arrangement for an unborn child is a
>risky business. Before Bartlette was born we did NOTHING by way of
>preparation in terms of, say, buying a cot, clothing etc. It just felt
>to us like bad karma. Plans can go astray. Pray that nothing goes
>wrong, but it can do, and the mother and/or baby may not be fit to
>travel when you're planning your holiday. Why not just wait? Otherwise
>just put the cost of the phone call into the category of necessary
>expenses.

One solution that meets TUI's terms and conditions is to decide now on the names
to be given for a girl or boy. Each parent is allowed to be accompanied by one
child, each parent books one child at a cost of EUR 10.
If Tom's wife has twins of the same sex then ... good luck to the passengers.
--

Martin

Erick T . Barkhuis

Magda:

> Tim C. :
>
> ... Erick T. Barkhuis:
> ...
> ... >David Horne:

> ... >> First it was the ravage of disease, now the noise.
> ... >
> ... >What about the smell?
> ...
> ... Newly born babies don't smell much.
>
> They poop 'round the clock.

...unless you don't feed them.
Would that be a solution to OP's little problem?

[*ducking*]

-Martin

On 6 Mar 2007 02:09:19 -0800, [email protected] wrote:

>On 6 mrt, 11:06, Martin <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Tue, 6 Mar 2007 06:53:03 +0100, [email protected] (Mister Bartlett) wrote:
>> >Erick T. Barkhuis <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >> David Horne, _the_ chancellor (*):
>> >> > Mister Bartlett <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >> > > EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >> > > > If you were on a small craft, one assumes there were not
>> >> > > > hundreds of fellow-passengers to consider!
>>
>> >> > > Heaven forbid that Fellow Passengers should be exposed to the fact that
>> >> > > small children are Not Silent !!!
>>
>> >> > First it was the ravage of disease, now the noise.
>>
>> >> What about the smell?
>>
>> >You're right - I hate the smell of OLD people !
>>
>> and KLM fish on the Rome to A'dam flight.
>>
>> Caught off West Africa, imported and packed in Katwijk, left standing somewhere
>> to rot, put on a plane to Rome stored until needed at blood heat and served to
>> the starving in business class.
>
>Or to my sister in Scheveningen.

They probably buy fish rejected by KLM.
The types of fish actually landed in Scheveningen are very limited "if it aint
flat, it aint locally caught".
--

Martin