Groceries

Old Jan 13th 2016, 7:59 am
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Default Re: Groceries

At least canned tomatos are still cheap, the fresh ones are 3x what they were in season.
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 8:09 am
  #587  
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by R I C H
Urban and rural areas here are on a completely different scale of distribution here though. I'm 50 minutes drive from a grocery store. The depot the distributes produce for my business is Vancouver, 4 hours away. The rural population here (c250 permanent, which swells to 5,000+ during holiday seasons) isn't big enough to support a reasonably priced distribution model. It's not untypical of Canada generally outside of urban centres. I can buy 4l of milk at $4.50ish retail in a grocery store. Delivered it costs me a fraction under $10. I buy as much as 240l per week - what I spend in time and gas driving to Kamloops, I more than save on delivery costs. That's one example of 50+ items I regularly order.
Thanks RICH you have got me thinking
How far is it in drive time from one end of population to the other (just in terms of a diameter line
How far to the next small rural town? The business model would make sense if people could pre order 24 hours in advance.
Would people travel the radius of town (per above drive time on diameter) to collect at a given time their weekly or daily shop if it was same instore price as city and no delivery charge?
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 8:44 am
  #588  
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Parnell
Thanks RICH you have got me thinking
How far is it in drive time from one end of population to the other (just in terms of a diameter line
How far to the next small rural town? The business model would make sense if people could pre order 24 hours in advance.
Would people travel the radius of town (per above drive time on diameter) to collect at a given time their weekly or daily shop if it was same instore price as city and no delivery charge?
Kamloops east to west takes 30 minutes drive time. North to south maybe a little more as it isn't served by a highway for a large proportion. There are small populations of a thousand or so in each direction 20 minutes from town. None have grocery stores. The next large urban areas are an hour and a quarter south or 50 minutes east. People commute to Kamloops and pick up groceries while there. What additional convenience are you offering?

I'm not sure I understand your proposition. How will you buy at a price point that provides enough profit to offer free delivery? The volume you'd have to purchase would mean you'd need storage and a huge refrigerated truck. I purchase >$5,000 per week and you can see how expensive delivery charges are even at that volume.
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 9:00 am
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by R I C H
Kamloops east to west takes 30 minutes drive time. North to south maybe a little more as it isn't served by a highway for a large proportion. There are small populations of a thousand or so in each direction 20 minutes from town. None have grocery stores. The next large urban areas are an hour and a quarter south or 50 minutes east. People commute to Kamloops and pick up groceries while there. What additional convenience are you offering? I'm not sure I understand your proposition. How will you buy at a price point that provides enough profit to offer free delivery? The volume you'd have to purchase would mean you'd need storage and a huge refrigerated truck. I purchase >$5,000 per week and you can see how expensive delivery charges are even at that volume.
If a large truck could travel on a straight line through and park up at a central spot in each rural township being serviced. Full automated container could retrieve relevant customers order (tote boxes) and then move on to next location.The business cost offset is retail space versus truck running costs. For example it would require the people in town to be prepared to order today for items to be delivered tomorrow and to be at a certain point in town I think a truck can service around 2,000 customers so say 100 customers (households) per small town would mean 20 stops?I need to get myself familiar with Canada Map but I don't see why it would be too much trouble to organize ????
Vancouver to Calgary for example one way, then Calgary to Vancouver the next day? about 1000km?

Last edited by Parnell; Jan 13th 2016 at 9:03 am.
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 9:14 am
  #590  
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Parnell
If a large truck could travel on a straight line through and park up at a central spot in each rural township being serviced. Full automated container could retrieve relevant customers order (tote boxes) and then move on to next location.
The business cost offset is retail space versus truck running costs. For example it would require the people in town to be prepared to order today for items to be delivered tomorrow and to be at a certain point in town I think a truck can service around 2,000 customers so say 100 customers (households) per small town would mean 20 stops?
I need to get myself familiar with Canada Map but I don't see why it would be too much trouble to organize ????

The 2 national restaurant suppliers don't have retail space, but they need warehouse space to fulfil orders. How do you avoid that? It's 35-40 degrees here in the summer and -15 in the winter. You can't distribute in a container that isn't climate controlled.

People in rural areas commute to town for work and shop while there. I'm not sure you'd get anywhere near 2,000 customers worth of weekly grocertries in a truck, but to cover just 3 rural populations north of Kamloops you'd drive well over 300kms on a round trip. The fuel and running cost overhead in a large truck is substantial.

Your business model suggests you can deliver more cheaply (and therefore purchase more cheaply) than national distributors that in my small town alone deliver over $80k per week of groceries to businesses.
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 9:22 am
  #591  
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Parnell
Vancouver to Calgary for example one way, then Calgary to Vancouver the next day? about 1000km?
You'd never make any drops trying to cover that mileage in a day. There'll be winter days you'd be lucky to do half that sort of distance. You're also reliant on the timely arrival of customers at the drop point (and your timely arrival). My deliveries are 3x per week. They vary by as much as a 4 hour window depending on weather, traffic and other drops.
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 10:23 am
  #592  
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Parnell
Its all those buy one get one free offers that causes a lot of unnecessary glutton and waste.
Ah, without meaning to sound rude, there speaks someone with a luxury boat to be kept in the Bahamas.

For many others, the bogofs, twofers and other deals, help them put food on the table.

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian
OK. Buy what the offer promotes and give the excess to a food bank or a homeless person.

We all know that this is exactly what I do
Good one.
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 10:53 am
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Shard
I find many of the offers are for items I do want, but simply do not need the quantity offered. Even produce is being oversold, for example packs of peppers containing 2-3 when you only need one. And some supermarkets are even doing 'buy three for the price of two'.
Peppers at our local stores are all sold by the pound, they just pile them up in the produce cooler.

They are getting pricey though these days, and less North American... The last ones had stickers that said product of Spain.

One item that never seems to increase is Banana's, despite the pain in the rear they are to ship, the price is the most stable food price wise.
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 12:37 pm
  #594  
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Jsmth321
by the pound
Demand metric. It is your duty!
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 1:52 pm
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by orly
Demand metric. It is your duty!
At check out they do it in metric and on the sign on the bottom is metric, the big sign is just in pounds......


Relevant article about groceries.

Canada Grocery Prices Are Giving Shoppers Serious Sticker Shock

Spoiler:
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 1:58 pm
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Jsmth321
At check out they do it in metric and on the sign on the bottom is metric, the big sign is just in pounds...... Relevant article about groceries. Canada Grocery Prices Are Giving Shoppers Serious Sticker Shock
So retailers that utilize an end to end supply chain from paddock to pantry so to speak should be at an advantage to keep prices down?
For example exporting from NZ, importing into Canada?
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 2:06 pm
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Parnell
If a large truck could travel on a straight line through and park up at a central spot in each rural township being serviced. Full automated container could retrieve relevant customers order (tote boxes) and then move on to next location.The business cost offset is retail space versus truck running costs. For example it would require the people in town to be prepared to order today for items to be delivered tomorrow and to be at a certain point in town I think a truck can service around 2,000 customers so say 100 customers (households) per small town would mean 20 stops?I need to get myself familiar with Canada Map but I don't see why it would be too much trouble to organize ????
Vancouver to Calgary for example one way, then Calgary to Vancouver the next day? about 1000km?
This is not accounting for the 'buy local' campaigns in the provinces and the 100 mile diet. Most communities have local produce markets especially in summer. Winter is where there is more demand when many roads are hard to travel.

Vancouver to Calgary is 1000km each way, 12 hours in a semi. A few mountain passes in between. What do you do if the truck is stuck for 4 days in a snow slide? Reefer essential for produce. Would need two drivers to comply with hours of service rules in that time frame. To comply with driver rules, make necessary stops (stopping time is duty time), driving time, this would be minimum of 3 day round trip. Servicing 2000 customers, probably a week. Our trucks do, Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton, 15 drops, 5 day trip there and back when no hold ups, such as the TCH being closed.

Last edited by Aviator; Jan 13th 2016 at 2:25 pm.
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 2:22 pm
  #598  
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by BristolUK
Ah, without meaning to sound rude, there speaks someone with a luxury boat to be kept in the Bahamas.

For many others, the bogofs, twofers and other deals, help them put food on the table.


Good one.
I have to agree with Bristol, you sometimes come across "none to well"- perhaps look to the common man and think of the "normal" population both on this forum and indeed in Canada. Maybe be a little more tactful?
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 2:56 pm
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by Parnell
Have been looking at the online operators and the likely hood of Instacart starting later this year.
They all appear to push the grocery pricing up around 28% because of delivery charges and additional product markups.
Would free delivery, faster or more convenient delivery and better pricing be well received in Canada?
I don't see a market for online grocery shopping in Canada at all. Online shopping in general is not very big even for electronics etc...
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Old Jan 13th 2016, 3:01 pm
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Default Re: Groceries

Originally Posted by bc2015
I don't see a market for online grocery shopping in Canada at all. Online shopping in general is not very big even for electronics etc...
I agree- It is improving and increasing with improvements in delivery electronic stuff etc but geography isn't going to change- groceries may be fine to deliver in cities but it isn't going to be viable in 99% of Canada. I miss Tesco delivery on a Sunday when in the UK but have long been resigned to having to bloody shop in person
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