Coronavirus

Old Dec 15th 2021, 4:47 am
  #5656  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by Atlantic Xpat
You'dve thought after 2 years of this sh1t that the govt would have learned the fallacy of knee jerk reactions. The best thing they could do right now is 1) ensure booster vaccine supply 2) have a national programme to roll out LFT's (NS I think leads the way here) and 3) Make sure that Canada is providing as much support as possible to countries with low vax rates. I suspect they'll do 1 and not even attempt 2 & 3.
yeah you’re right they’ll just focus on 1, because why would they want to make it easier for people to do preliminary testing before taking a PCR slot and why would Canada want to support lower vax countries, feds have already shown they’re prepared to withdraw supplies from COVAX

just clicking through the UK news conference, Chris Whitty is reminding vulnerable people to get their 4th shot…. Not sure if that’s a typo or not lol I don’t recall there being anyone getting 4th shots? If it’s not a slip then we have a long year or 2 ahead of us
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 5:13 am
  #5657  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by ChrisBan
yeah you’re right they’ll just focus on 1, because why would they want to make it easier for people to do preliminary testing before taking a PCR slot and why would Canada want to support lower vax countries, feds have already shown they’re prepared to withdraw supplies from COVAX

just clicking through the UK news conference, Chris Whitty is reminding vulnerable people to get their 4th shot…. Not sure if that’s a typo or not lol I don’t recall there being anyone getting 4th shots? If it’s not a slip then we have a long year or 2 ahead of us
I had a 3rd dose, but judging by this blurb, I may be getting a 4th sometime next year.

Third dose vs. booster dose
A third dose is not the same as a booster. For people who do not develop the same immune response to the first two doses of the vaccine, a third dose is needed to get a similar level of protection as others in the population.

For these people, receiving a third dose to complete the initial vaccine series can help individuals create antibodies to protect them from COVID-19.

A booster dose is an additional vaccine you may get later if the protection from the initial two-dose vaccine series begins to decrease over time. A booster gets immunity back up to a desirable level of protection for an extended period of time.
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 6:05 am
  #5658  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

The federal government is asking Canadians not to travel abroad for at least the next four weeks as the Omicron coronavirus continues to spread.

"If you do not have to travel internationally, please do not," Intergovernmental Affairs Minister Dominic LeBlanc said Wednesday.

Health Minister Jean-Yves Duclos said the official order to avoid international travel will be in place for the next four weeks, after which the situation will be re-evaluated.

"The rapid spread of the omicron variant on a global scale makes us fear the worst," he said.

He said they will continue to ramp up PCR COVID-19 testing measures at all border entry points over the next few weeks.

"I know that we’re all tired of the pandemic, but I must call on the solidarity of all Canadians," he said.

So no actual information right now on what the travel restrictions will be. I have this feeling that they'll close the border as had been done previously, and there will be required PCR testing and 14-day isolation for land travel, and likely the same for Air travel too. I'd expect this to probably come into affect either Friday or next monday.

What annoys me is they are banging on about rapid testing, and yet they will not offer that instead of PCR at the border. Why not just allow people to use rapid test, if negative, all good, if positive, get PCR and isolate until you get a negative test. Maybe I'm missing something with that process though.
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 6:47 am
  #5659  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by Paul_Shepherd
Agreed... politics is a huge issue, no western governement has followed its own protocol for this pandemic....they have blindly followed China all along, some countries more than others... to the point now I think its lost its scare for a lot of people... most people just want to get on with their lives, and the fact that vaccine is mostly successful makes this possible...given the fact that if you do get it, it wont be any more than a cold. There is the odd case that fully vaccinated people can die from it, but there is also the odd case that you won't make it to your destination when you board a plane.

.
Example of the "odd cases" from UK data in July:

Deaths of someone in their 50's (per 1 million population)
Vaccinated: 19 persons
Unvaccinated: 152 persons

Although a vaccinated person is far less likely to die from Covid than an unvaccinated, it isn't nearly as trivial as you suggest. At least for us that are over 40.
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 8:35 am
  #5660  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

anyone 18+ who is eligible for third dose / booster can book as of Monday 20th December. wait period between second dose and booster / third dose has been changed to three months as well.
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 9:41 am
  #5661  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Canadians told to avoid nonessential international travel as Omicron spreads

​​​​​​https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/c...vel/index.html
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 10:14 am
  #5662  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by Atlantic Xpat
This is a very balanced article on Omnicron. We know how to deal with it. We just need to do it. https://time.com/6128506/omicron-covid-19-how-to-fight/
Yes that was good. One thing I might query from it, and maybe this was just my interpretation, was the suggestion that travel restrictions (involving South Africa) would be inappropriate or knee jerk and like a punishment.
Despite some claims, it’s premature to conclude that Omicron will cause mild illness with few consequences. For example, in South Africa’s Omicron wave, infected people have tended to be younger than in previous waves, and we know that younger people are more likely to have more mild disease when infected with any SARS-CoV-2 variant. And given the time lags between infections, hospitalisations, and deaths, it is still too soon even for South Africa to pick up a signal in its excess death monitoring system
We know the UK made a huge mistake in allowing continued travel from India, and was highly criticised for it, when the Delta variant emerged.

Since Omicron is already known to spread more quickly, I'd have thought South Africa being on a red list until more was known would be reasonable.

Some have described it as after the horse has bolted, but you don't keep the barn door open and allow other horses to bolt as well.
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 10:27 am
  #5663  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by Danny B
I had a 3rd dose, but judging by this blurb, I may be getting a 4th sometime next year.

Third dose vs. booster dose
A third dose is not the same as a booster. For people who do not develop the same immune response to the first two doses of the vaccine, a third dose is needed to get a similar level of protection as others in the population.

For these people, receiving a third dose to complete the initial vaccine series can help individuals create antibodies to protect them from COVID-19.

A booster dose is an additional vaccine you may get later if the protection from the initial two-dose vaccine series begins to decrease over time. A booster gets immunity back up to a desirable level of protection for an extended period of time.
That's a bit weird. The last line fits with what we've been told about protection waning.

I understand the idea that a "3rd dose" is needed for people for whom the usual two was less effective. But I've seen nothing about any category - age, health worker, underlying condition etc - needing three instead of two. Surely the only way of knowing that 2 wasn't enough would be by testing the level of protection that two gave an individual 2 weeks after they'd had the second dose. Wouldn't that involve a fair amount of routine testing and wouldn't we know about that?

Of course it's entirely possible that "breakthrough" cases - where someone has been double jabbed but still got covid - could be those for whom two wasn't enough. But A) that's "after the fact" and B) would surely have been given as the reason.

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Old Dec 15th 2021, 12:20 pm
  #5664  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by BristolUK
That's a bit weird. The last line fits with what we've been told about protection waning.

I understand the idea that a "3rd dose" is needed for people for whom the usual two was less effective. But I've seen nothing about any category - age, health worker, underlying condition etc - needing three instead of two. Surely the only way of knowing that 2 wasn't enough would be by testing the level of protection that two gave an individual 2 weeks after they'd had the second dose. Wouldn't that involve a fair amount of routine testing and wouldn't we know about that?

Of course it's entirely possible that "breakthrough" cases - where someone has been double jabbed but still got covid - could be those for whom two wasn't enough. But A) that's "after the fact" and B) would surely have been given as the reason.



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Old Dec 15th 2021, 12:34 pm
  #5665  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by BristolUK
That's a bit weird. The last line fits with what we've been told about protection waning.

I understand the idea that a "3rd dose" is needed for people for whom the usual two was less effective. But I've seen nothing about any category - age, health worker, underlying condition etc - needing three instead of two. Surely the only way of knowing that 2 wasn't enough would be by testing the level of protection that two gave an individual 2 weeks after they'd had the second dose. Wouldn't that involve a fair amount of routine testing and wouldn't we know about that?

Of course it's entirely possible that "breakthrough" cases - where someone has been double jabbed but still got covid - could be those for whom two wasn't enough. But A) that's "after the fact" and B) would surely have been given as the reason.
it might be different out here in Wild West BC, but this is where I got the info from. Third dose was only for the elderly or people with certain conditions to boost up the 2nd dose.

Vaccine Registration and Eligibility

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Old Dec 15th 2021, 1:29 pm
  #5666  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by Siouxie
Originally Posted by Danny B
it might be different out here in Wild West BC, but this is where I got the info from. Third dose was only for the elderly or people with certain conditions to boost up the 2nd dose.

Vaccine Registration and Eligibility
Well bugger me. I found a Septemeber release for NB recommending a 3rd dose - immuno-compromised, chemo, dialysis and so on just as you say.
And yet on the most up to date info page it goes from 1st dose to 2nd dose to booster.
To be fair, if in that group one would likely know. I hope so.

After having it "easy" for so long over here, NB is now 2nd and 3rd worst for some rates.
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 1:37 pm
  #5667  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by sharkus
So no actual information right now on what the travel restrictions will be. I have this feeling that they'll close the border as had been done previously, and there will be required PCR testing and 14-day isolation for land travel, and likely the same for Air travel too. I'd expect this to probably come into affect either Friday or next monday.

What annoys me is they are banging on about rapid testing, and yet they will not offer that instead of PCR at the border. Why not just allow people to use rapid test, if negative, all good, if positive, get PCR and isolate until you get a negative test. Maybe I'm missing something with that process though.
I'm off to the UK on Friday.

I have no doubt that during this travel advisory we'll catch half a dozen politicians in Hawaii, Costa Rica and insert other exotic destinations as well as multiple overpaid civil servants.

I still freshly remember last year when Trudeau asked Canadians to stay home for Easter then got in his car and drove to another province to enjoy a cottage Easter egg hunt.

Enough is enough.

Hopefully I haven't missed Boris's Christmas Party this year.

Last edited by JamesM; Dec 15th 2021 at 1:50 pm.
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 1:54 pm
  #5668  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by JamesM
.

I still freshly remember last year when Trudeau asked Canadians to stay home for Easter then got in his car and drove to another province to enjoy a cottage Easter egg hunt..
Or another way of putting that is that he was someone who crossed border between home and work and was therefore exempt when he returned home like all the others.

It's not really on the same level as the other ones caught going away and other things like testing eyesight by seeing if a crash happens..
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Old Dec 15th 2021, 11:13 pm
  #5669  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by BristolUK
Or another way of putting that is that he was someone who crossed border between home and work and was therefore exempt when he returned home like all the others.

It's not really on the same level as the other ones caught going away and other things like testing eyesight by seeing if a crash happens..

Yeah, I giggled at the idea of crossing the river in Ottawa being like an exotic vacation; which side is the nice bit?
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Old Dec 16th 2021, 4:50 am
  #5670  
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Default Re: Coronavirus

Originally Posted by Shard
Example of the "odd cases" from UK data in July:

Deaths of someone in their 50's (per 1 million population)
Vaccinated: 19 persons
Unvaccinated: 152 persons

Although a vaccinated person is far less likely to die from Covid than an unvaccinated, it isn't nearly as trivial as you suggest. At least for us that are over 40.
So really there is more chance of dying in a car accident, (maybe not stretching to an air crash though) than a vaccinated person dying from covid....even less from this omicron variant, which is much more contagious but much weaker. (from what we know so far) it proves that the vaccine does work....even more so with this 3rd shot.

Last edited by Paul_Shepherd; Dec 16th 2021 at 5:01 am.
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