Bipat

And the majority are in the Middle East as you are!!
They tend to be there temporarily and go back 'home' with their hard earned money---as you will!

('In vain'--)

Millhouse

they only leave when: 1. they are too old to work and have no choice, or 2. their Canada visa dream comes through.

It's not a choice.

morpeth

There appears to be a language problem. I obviously stated stated just on person's view. Where did I use propaganda for the written evidence you attached. You seem to not realize that it is by looking at opposing views and different available evidence that leads toa ore objective approach.

I am only responding to the posts made, and the subject on the thread.If you they pertinent observations I certainly look forward to reading.

I havent live din Indonesia for many years but for business and other reasons have hept up to date on economic trends- but if i understand your position one is more informed being there without serious study and listening to ​​​​​disgruntled family member and friends.​

Bipat

Morpeth ----I described the written history of the community of OH --that in Goan libraries mostly destroyed, some books that I have out of print. You describe anything I post as "propaganda".

(Yet you STILL haven't asked what are those pages of negatives that I keep telling you I could write!!)

My family/friends/acquaintances/workers are not disgruntled! Many are business people (and some with EU partners)!
I have gained knowledge over the decades/ in multiple States, from them/from travel overland in many more than half the States/local newspapers/books etc.etc. Many such contacts are now 'long dead'.

How many times are you going to make a remark about 'language' problem! I speak English---I am English.

One Indian trait is that they all love a good gossip!!
(One point is that as everywhere life expectancy is far longer now, so many very elderly who like to remember their experiences.)

One point of disgruntlement among the elderly is the lack of history teaching in Indian schools-
OH and classmates learned history--- British history---- (along with British poetry/literature!!) but nowadays no history seems to be taught.
Yes OH is 'old'---(I of course was a 'child bride'-----that should start you and EMR off on half-knowledge posts!!)

There is a difference Morpeth between a "view" and actual knowledge of a situation by being there!
Would you accept as accurate the 'view' of someone regarding this Forum if they had never accessed it themselves?

EMR

You obvious,y have no idea how years of severe drought affect crops, crops that people grow to feed themselves.
You inability to understand even basic facts has reached a now low level..
Famine is caused by lack of food, a lack of food bought about by the weather, not British rule.
Facts that have been pointed out to you before which of course you ignore.

Even today as we saw first hand farmers in India are suffering from years of poor monsoons.
Instead of growing two crops year , only one., relying on government relief, leaving the land.
It has been in the papers.
Ma

Bipat

EMR -----You are just repeating what I said!!
Drought is caused by weather, famine is the resulting lack of basic food leading to deaths.

There are droughts and monsoons every year, FACT.
The monsoons have not been bad EVERY year FACT.
Yes I know about farmers problems---and also the using of them as political pawns! FACT
We do have newspapers EMR

EMR, we live in a rural town do you really think I don't know about the weather!! We have an acre of land---multiple mango, coconut trees, other fruit and veg. In OH's childhood they were self supporting apart from cooking oil! Even had a rice field until Indira's land take! But that's another story.

There were 16 major famines in British time, no major famines since. There were many millions of deaths humans and cattle. The poverty meant they couldn't afford good machinery, or store food. Read about these famines off topic here. I think even you might feel pity at the sight of their plight.

morpeth

You just seem confused- whenever you. EMR and I have discussed any topic in depth and you are provided with a load of evidence from a variety of sources Indian and non India you reject evidence simply because you live in India or what your family members say. This dismissal of any factual evidence makes discussion challenging, in addition o constant saying hat other say hings that they don;t.

For example I have family members who have lived in locations their whole life, and have definite views, which may be completely incorrect. I dont need to have lived in Venezuela to know the people heir re suffering currently- I can just imagine using your approach, that a Venezuelan saying things are great here and how could I dare question hat point of view.

If you have some comments about India positive or negative that relate to the thread by all means- as I have stated often- I look forward to hearing. And you being on the ground there certainly gives perspective on current events that I do not have except when it descends to pro Modi or Hindu propaganda..

EMR

You might not know that the advances in agriculture in the 20th century, the creation of new types of wheat and rice that do not require as much water have had a dramatic effect not just in India but globally.. and only became available in tgecsecond half of the 20th century.
The American biologist who created the most grown species of wheat won a Nobel prize for his work.
Before these new crops became available it was believed that India would never be able to feed itself.
I know you want to blame the British for everything and anything but blaming the British for the westher, etc reaches a new level of absurdity even for you..
How many famines were there in India in the 2000 years when the British dud not rule..

Bipat

EMR----can you not understand-----the weather has not changed. There are still droughts.
Regardless of the type of wheat----a poor monsoon is devastating, it affects the Indian economy overall!

The difference is that in a bad year millions are not dying!
As I said take the trouble to look up the 16 major famines.

EMR

You obviously are completely ignorant of the advances in crops, agricultural practices, fertilisers, pesticides etc that have been introduced globally in the second half of the 20th century.
In fact the best way of summing up your posts on this subject is they demonstrate just how ifpgnorant of facts you are.
There was a famine in Bihar post independence you should look it up.

Bipat

Morpeth with respect you just post your own views often not relevant to the post that you are replying to!
You yourself have been negative about the Congress party politics. The present Government is the one voted in by a majority.
I always have distrusted a great orator and Modi is certainly that, can work a crowd.
However in fact has done more than for the country in the last years than happened before. Morpeth you can SEE the differences in peoples lives.
Hindu propaganda?-----the majority of the population is Hindu----you can't change that. Having lived with Hindus for decades perhaps I am able to explain something useful!! For many religion is just superficial but they wouldn't admit that to you would they!!

Bipat

EMR ---do you really think that the average small farmer/or village farmer has access to the all the modern advances??
The Bihar famine in 1951 just 4 years after the British left, poverty didn't improve overnight.

Could I suggest EMR that you spend your next tourist visit during monsoon time or even pre-monsoon heat time and learn a few FACTS .

EMR

Go back and check you facts, you are getting even sillier., or better still log off and come back tomorrow..

Bipat

What FACTS are you referring to? When were you ever there during a monsoon? Do tell us all!
Have you any idea of the FACTs regarding monsoon season in different areas.
70-80% of farmers have less than 2 acres (26 Guntas).
You are just considering the major large scale farmers.

EMR

I have provided you with facts, but no suprise you ignore them
Do you do any research before responding, your posts today suggest that you do not.