Time for some realism
Sep 8th 2014 | 9:15 am
#31
Thread Starter
Muskoka, Ontario
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,045
Re: Time for some realism
Lots going on here!
Firstly, congrats on the baby
I've had 3 here now and they seem to be doing ok so far, no extra heads or anything. I like that they have dual nationality as it gives them more options for the future.
Regarding moving back. I know of 2 families who moved back, in my opinion neither gave it long enough here, but having said that, I'm getting close to a decade now and it still doesn't feel like home. If money were no issue, we would likely have moved on by now. Moving back though - we've come to the conclusion that it's really not that simple. Doing this changes people, and those two families I know have both had real issues trying to settle back there again. One managed to get their kids into the same school, with the same friends and the other even managed to rent the house they had rented before they left. Neither has had an easy ride of it at all.
We were actually considering moving back while I was pregnant with our 3rd. With hindsight, it likely would have broken me, and probably still would now. Hormones and all that.
Only you can know what is best, or not know as the case seems to be. If you know that things will be changing in the next couple of years if you stay, then it might be worth seeing what you can make of that. I get the misery, the homesickness, the lack of friends and feeling alone, I really do, and so do many others on here. It really really sucks at times. But I also think that you could be making things an awful lot worse to try and move back at this point, particularly with what you're saying about nothing being in place that you were expecting (at the risk of being called a hippy nutcase yet again, maybe it's not waiting for you there because you're not supposed to go back. Obstacles to be listened to maybe). You at least know what the status quo here is for the next little bit, if you see what I mean.
Firstly, congrats on the baby
I've had 3 here now and they seem to be doing ok so far, no extra heads or anything. I like that they have dual nationality as it gives them more options for the future.Regarding moving back. I know of 2 families who moved back, in my opinion neither gave it long enough here, but having said that, I'm getting close to a decade now and it still doesn't feel like home. If money were no issue, we would likely have moved on by now. Moving back though - we've come to the conclusion that it's really not that simple. Doing this changes people, and those two families I know have both had real issues trying to settle back there again. One managed to get their kids into the same school, with the same friends and the other even managed to rent the house they had rented before they left. Neither has had an easy ride of it at all.
We were actually considering moving back while I was pregnant with our 3rd. With hindsight, it likely would have broken me, and probably still would now. Hormones and all that.
Only you can know what is best, or not know as the case seems to be. If you know that things will be changing in the next couple of years if you stay, then it might be worth seeing what you can make of that. I get the misery, the homesickness, the lack of friends and feeling alone, I really do, and so do many others on here. It really really sucks at times. But I also think that you could be making things an awful lot worse to try and move back at this point, particularly with what you're saying about nothing being in place that you were expecting (at the risk of being called a hippy nutcase yet again, maybe it's not waiting for you there because you're not supposed to go back. Obstacles to be listened to maybe). You at least know what the status quo here is for the next little bit, if you see what I mean.
Sep 8th 2014 | 10:38 am
#32
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,746
Re: Time for some realism
You're welcome.
So you think everyone might be better off staying? if that's the case have you given it your best shot to make it feel like home? Thrown yourself into it?
Do you have many friends? I remember in the early days even tho I knew we'd made the right move crying buckets logging into FB and seeing gatherings that we would have been at had we stayed.
Making friends is important - but it's not easy.
My motto that I use when not knowing what to do "If in doubt - do nowt"
So you think everyone might be better off staying? if that's the case have you given it your best shot to make it feel like home? Thrown yourself into it?
Do you have many friends? I remember in the early days even tho I knew we'd made the right move crying buckets logging into FB and seeing gatherings that we would have been at had we stayed.
Making friends is important - but it's not easy.
My motto that I use when not knowing what to do "If in doubt - do nowt"
Last edited by Geordie Lass; Sep 8th 2014 at 10:40 am.
Sep 8th 2014 | 11:20 am
#33
limey party pooper
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 10,000
Re: Time for some realism
My theory on such things is that you can never go back, to a job, a city, a country. Things change and what you had is gone. I think it would be even more upsetting to return and discover that you don't like it.
As you know I took a long while to settle and often thought about going back, what stopped us? Money, my husband being happy here, no guarantee that we would be happy back in England, the sheer hassle of moving. Now this place is home for us when I go back I feel like the visitor I am.
You went back on holiday very soon too didn't you, that's hard to do.
Have a look at online courses to exercise your brain perhaps some intellectual stimulation might help.
Don't beat yourself about about not knowing what to do, not many do.
As you know I took a long while to settle and often thought about going back, what stopped us? Money, my husband being happy here, no guarantee that we would be happy back in England, the sheer hassle of moving. Now this place is home for us when I go back I feel like the visitor I am.
You went back on holiday very soon too didn't you, that's hard to do.
Have a look at online courses to exercise your brain perhaps some intellectual stimulation might help.
Don't beat yourself about about not knowing what to do, not many do.
Sep 8th 2014 | 11:23 am
#34
BE Forum Addict
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,348
Re: Time for some realism
Ooh! Brain exercise - look at online European university degrees too - I believe some countries (Sweden, Norway, Iceland, probably others) offer completely free degrees to EU citizens. I have just started researching this for myself
Sep 8th 2014 | 2:06 pm
#35
Thread Starter
Muskoka, Ontario
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,045
Re: Time for some realism
You're welcome.
So you think everyone might be better off staying? if that's the case have you given it your best shot to make it feel like home? Thrown yourself into it?
Do you have many friends? I remember in the early days even tho I knew we'd made the right move crying buckets logging into FB and seeing gatherings that we would have been at had we stayed.
Making friends is important - but it's not easy.
My motto that I use when not knowing what to do "If in doubt - do nowt"
So you think everyone might be better off staying? if that's the case have you given it your best shot to make it feel like home? Thrown yourself into it?
Do you have many friends? I remember in the early days even tho I knew we'd made the right move crying buckets logging into FB and seeing gatherings that we would have been at had we stayed.
Making friends is important - but it's not easy.
My motto that I use when not knowing what to do "If in doubt - do nowt"
Bats...no I didn't go home, I thought it was too risky. You're right about online courses too or something...
Sep 8th 2014 | 4:21 pm
#36
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 888
From: Coquitlam
Re: Time for some realism
Where are you based? Maybe one of us miserable old buggers on here could met you for coffee, objective advice from someone you don't really know can be quite cathartic!!
We have friends who went home after 10 months, it cost them a huge amount financially and i'm not sure they are any happier with the work/home/kids balance. The only thing is that she is closer to family and friends. She doesn't get to see much of them because of the stress of everything else!
This forum is great for venting, there are plenty of folks who have loved, hated and everything in between. Use us!!
We have friends who went home after 10 months, it cost them a huge amount financially and i'm not sure they are any happier with the work/home/kids balance. The only thing is that she is closer to family and friends. She doesn't get to see much of them because of the stress of everything else!
This forum is great for venting, there are plenty of folks who have loved, hated and everything in between. Use us!!
Sep 9th 2014 | 12:15 am
#37
Professional Cat herder
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 5,709
From: TORONTO- yay!!!
Re: Time for some realism
I thought long and hard before posting this because I don’t want to come across as hard hearted, I do feel your pain and have been through similar feelings myself but there is one fact that you cannot get away from. Once you accept this it’ll make any decision a whole lot easier.
Your life that you had in the UK doesn’t exist anymore.
Your house as you left it doesn’t, Your jobs may not, your children’s schools don’t. Your friends have moved on since you saw them last.
That life is gone.
Whatever you decide to do, it will involve either making a new life back in the UK, starting all over again from scratch. Or trying to make a go of what you have here.
As I said I’m not unsympathetic. I came from a profession that is pretty much impossible for me to get back into at the level I’d want to here. The difference was I knew it before I moved. Still it didn’t stop the negative emotions. I didn’t realise how much of my identity was tied up in my profession. Back in England I was Zoe the physics teacher. In Canada I was Zoe the unemployed nothing. It dinged my self-confidence for a long time.
For me the trick was knowing there was nothing to go back to. I either made a life for myself here orwas terminally unhappy. I won’t lie. It took years. But it helped not to see the UK as an escape plan. It was either here or nowhere I guess.
Your decision basically boils down to “make a go of it in Canada†or “start all over again in the UKâ€
I hope you are happy whatever path you choose.
Your life that you had in the UK doesn’t exist anymore.
Your house as you left it doesn’t, Your jobs may not, your children’s schools don’t. Your friends have moved on since you saw them last.
That life is gone.
Whatever you decide to do, it will involve either making a new life back in the UK, starting all over again from scratch. Or trying to make a go of what you have here.
As I said I’m not unsympathetic. I came from a profession that is pretty much impossible for me to get back into at the level I’d want to here. The difference was I knew it before I moved. Still it didn’t stop the negative emotions. I didn’t realise how much of my identity was tied up in my profession. Back in England I was Zoe the physics teacher. In Canada I was Zoe the unemployed nothing. It dinged my self-confidence for a long time.
For me the trick was knowing there was nothing to go back to. I either made a life for myself here orwas terminally unhappy. I won’t lie. It took years. But it helped not to see the UK as an escape plan. It was either here or nowhere I guess.
Your decision basically boils down to “make a go of it in Canada†or “start all over again in the UKâ€
I hope you are happy whatever path you choose.
Sep 9th 2014 | 12:39 am
#39
Slightly Canadian
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 10,146
From: St. John's, Newfoundland
Re: Time for some realism
Is everything going to be exactly the same before you left? Likely not. Particularly not jobwise. Friends? Well that depends, some may have moved on, some you may find you fit straight back in as though you hadn't left.
I've been away 10 years in November. For the past 4 years I've been travelling back to UK 4 or more times a year for business so I've actually got to see a fair amount of friends and family. By and large my group of friends is getting on with life and while I'm not a regular part of that, it doesn't feel as though we wouldn't be able to fit back in reasonably easily. I'd also still be fairly confident about picking up a job although the Mrs would have a much harder time as a teacher.
In our case we couldn't move back to our old lives even if we wanted to, simply because our lives now include two children! So our housing requirements would be different which would likely entail living in a different area than the one we left.
Of course as with everything, it varies from family to family and person to person. I'd suggest consideration of moving back be done in the same light as consideration of emigrating in the first place as an informed consumer, understanding challenges, opportunites, costs etc before making decision. But I also recognise that there will be an emotional part of the decision which might overrule everything else. I think if you want/need to go back enough badly then you can or have to make it work.
AX
Sep 9th 2014 | 4:18 am
#40
Thread Starter
Muskoka, Ontario
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,045
Re: Time for some realism
Where are you based? Maybe one of us miserable old buggers on here could met you for coffee, objective advice from someone you don't really know can be quite cathartic!!
We have friends who went home after 10 months, it cost them a huge amount financially and i'm not sure they are any happier with the work/home/kids balance. The only thing is that she is closer to family and friends. She doesn't get to see much of them because of the stress of everything else!
This forum is great for venting, there are plenty of folks who have loved, hated and everything in between. Use us!!
We have friends who went home after 10 months, it cost them a huge amount financially and i'm not sure they are any happier with the work/home/kids balance. The only thing is that she is closer to family and friends. She doesn't get to see much of them because of the stress of everything else!
This forum is great for venting, there are plenty of folks who have loved, hated and everything in between. Use us!!
I thought long and hard before posting this because I don’t want to come across as hard hearted, I do feel your pain and have been through similar feelings myself but there is one fact that you cannot get away from. Once you accept this it’ll make any decision a whole lot easier.
Your life that you had in the UK doesn’t exist anymore.
Your house as you left it doesn’t, Your jobs may not, your children’s schools don’t. Your friends have moved on since you saw them last.
That life is gone.
Whatever you decide to do, it will involve either making a new life back in the UK, starting all over again from scratch. Or trying to make a go of what you have here.
As I said I’m not unsympathetic. I came from a profession that is pretty much impossible for me to get back into at the level I’d want to here. The difference was I knew it before I moved. Still it didn’t stop the negative emotions. I didn’t realise how much of my identity was tied up in my profession. Back in England I was Zoe the physics teacher. In Canada I was Zoe the unemployed nothing. It dinged my self-confidence for a long time.
For me the trick was knowing there was nothing to go back to. I either made a life for myself here orwas terminally unhappy. I won’t lie. It took years. But it helped not to see the UK as an escape plan. It was either here or nowhere I guess.
Your decision basically boils down to “make a go of it in Canada†or “start all over again in the UKâ€
I hope you are happy whatever path you choose.
Your life that you had in the UK doesn’t exist anymore.
Your house as you left it doesn’t, Your jobs may not, your children’s schools don’t. Your friends have moved on since you saw them last.
That life is gone.
Whatever you decide to do, it will involve either making a new life back in the UK, starting all over again from scratch. Or trying to make a go of what you have here.
As I said I’m not unsympathetic. I came from a profession that is pretty much impossible for me to get back into at the level I’d want to here. The difference was I knew it before I moved. Still it didn’t stop the negative emotions. I didn’t realise how much of my identity was tied up in my profession. Back in England I was Zoe the physics teacher. In Canada I was Zoe the unemployed nothing. It dinged my self-confidence for a long time.
For me the trick was knowing there was nothing to go back to. I either made a life for myself here orwas terminally unhappy. I won’t lie. It took years. But it helped not to see the UK as an escape plan. It was either here or nowhere I guess.
Your decision basically boils down to “make a go of it in Canada†or “start all over again in the UKâ€
I hope you are happy whatever path you choose.
. I think you also understand how lack of work can be hugely demoralising...Well, yes. And no.
Is everything going to be exactly the same before you left? Likely not. Particularly not jobwise. Friends? Well that depends, some may have moved on, some you may find you fit straight back in as though you hadn't left.
I've been away 10 years in November. For the past 4 years I've been travelling back to UK 4 or more times a year for business so I've actually got to see a fair amount of friends and family. By and large my group of friends is getting on with life and while I'm not a regular part of that, it doesn't feel as though we wouldn't be able to fit back in reasonably easily. I'd also still be fairly confident about picking up a job although the Mrs would have a much harder time as a teacher.
In our case we couldn't move back to our old lives even if we wanted to, simply because our lives now include two children! So our housing requirements would be different which would likely entail living in a different area than the one we left.
Of course as with everything, it varies from family to family and person to person. I'd suggest consideration of moving back be done in the same light as consideration of emigrating in the first place as an informed consumer, understanding challenges, opportunites, costs etc before making decision. But I also recognise that there will be an emotional part of the decision which might overrule everything else. I think if you want/need to go back enough badly then you can or have to make it work.
AX
Is everything going to be exactly the same before you left? Likely not. Particularly not jobwise. Friends? Well that depends, some may have moved on, some you may find you fit straight back in as though you hadn't left.
I've been away 10 years in November. For the past 4 years I've been travelling back to UK 4 or more times a year for business so I've actually got to see a fair amount of friends and family. By and large my group of friends is getting on with life and while I'm not a regular part of that, it doesn't feel as though we wouldn't be able to fit back in reasonably easily. I'd also still be fairly confident about picking up a job although the Mrs would have a much harder time as a teacher.
In our case we couldn't move back to our old lives even if we wanted to, simply because our lives now include two children! So our housing requirements would be different which would likely entail living in a different area than the one we left.
Of course as with everything, it varies from family to family and person to person. I'd suggest consideration of moving back be done in the same light as consideration of emigrating in the first place as an informed consumer, understanding challenges, opportunites, costs etc before making decision. But I also recognise that there will be an emotional part of the decision which might overrule everything else. I think if you want/need to go back enough badly then you can or have to make it work.
AX
Sep 9th 2014 | 4:31 am
#41
Professional Cat herder
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 5,709
From: TORONTO- yay!!!
Re: Time for some realism
I think you also understand how lack of work can be hugely demoralising...
not just demoralising. I genuinely lost who I was as a person for a long time.
but then I decided that defining yourself by your job is not necessarily a healthy thing to do.
Ben and I have been here seven years now. I won't lie to you , even now I still get fed up of being an outsider but the positives are much more thna the negatives for me.
Again, having met you, I know that you aren't a drama queen or whatever but I also don't think that you've settled either.
I'm not sure that you've given it enough time , In my opinion.
but it is just that , an opinion. You and your family have to make the final call.
not just demoralising. I genuinely lost who I was as a person for a long time.
but then I decided that defining yourself by your job is not necessarily a healthy thing to do.
Ben and I have been here seven years now. I won't lie to you , even now I still get fed up of being an outsider but the positives are much more thna the negatives for me.
Again, having met you, I know that you aren't a drama queen or whatever but I also don't think that you've settled either.
I'm not sure that you've given it enough time , In my opinion.
but it is just that , an opinion. You and your family have to make the final call.
Sep 9th 2014 | 12:33 pm
#42
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 56
From: Regina, Saskatchewan
Re: Time for some realism
Hi Tirytory, Our family moved to Saskatchewan on christmas day last year. I have found it very tough at time due to having four children and my husband working away 10 days at a time and then home for four. I feel very alone my only company being our 3 and 2 year old boys. I have said to my husband on many occasions that I want to go bad to the UK. Then I get a lightbulb moment and realize that it would be no good for us as a family. My children are very happy my husband loves his job, It seems its only me who is unhappy. Im unhappy because I do not have my life long friends around me nor my mother to support me but they are only a phone call away. I speak to my friends via message most days. I don't like to dwell on the past my life in the UK seems like a lifetime ago, someone else's life even. I believe that your gut instinct is what you should follow but with you expecting again that will make your decisions a less accurate if I'm totally honest i have a wobbler around once a month due to dreaded hormones we go through a lot and us women usually the backbone of our families. i hope you find happiness in whatever decision you make but after living here in this beautiful country the UK will never feel the same to you. xx
Sep 9th 2014 | 12:34 pm
#43
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 56
From: Regina, Saskatchewan
Re: Time for some realism
Oh and congratulations on baby number 3 don't attempt number 4 it pushes you over the edge!!! ;-)
Sep 10th 2014 | 6:59 am
#44
Magnificently Withering
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 6,908
From: Oakville, ON
Re: Time for some realism
Wow, Tirytory, I missed this thread... sorry to hear of your woes.
First, though, congrats on imminent arrival of sprog #3. Brilliant news, although I can also see how that might have brought the whole Canada vs Wales situation to a head.
I don't know that I can add much to what has already been said on here, because when all's said and done this has to be a decision that you and your husband reach between you. But, for the sake of sticking an oar in, here's what I think:
I would suggest that the best medicine would be to come out to the Yard later this month and get pissed with the rest of us, but given your current condition that's probably even worse advice than everything else in this post!
Good luck whichever way you go, do let us know how things work out!
First, though, congrats on imminent arrival of sprog #3. Brilliant news, although I can also see how that might have brought the whole Canada vs Wales situation to a head.
I don't know that I can add much to what has already been said on here, because when all's said and done this has to be a decision that you and your husband reach between you. But, for the sake of sticking an oar in, here's what I think:
- You can't turn the clock back. If you go back to the UK things won't be the same as they were, either at home or at work. You've pointed out a couple of things (schools can't take the kids back, your job as it was is not available, etc)
- You've said that childcare and shift patterns may make it impractical for you to work if you return to the UK. If that happens, will you be left with a similar mental fog to what you have here? How much of the way you feel now is related to not being at work?
- If you stay here, but the administrivia of the nursing registration process is just too labyrinthine and slow to allow you to do that, what options do you have to find work in another field? Getting paid to be out of the house doing something constructive could work wonders. Volunteering could be another valid choice, as would starting a home business (do you bake? making cakes for your kids' classmates' birthday parties can be a good earner!)
- It's impossible to take the emotional response out of the equation, but so far as you are able to mull it over dispassionately, what do you really, actually, want to do. Homesickness can manifest as "put it all back the way it was" or as "get me away from this dreadfulness" - is your dominant feeling a push away from Canada or a pull back towards Wales? If the former, what is it specifically about Canada that's wrong - and can you fix it? If the latter, what is it about your corner of the UK that was so wonderful, and will you be able to recreate that wonderfulness now that you've had the Canadian adventure?
I would suggest that the best medicine would be to come out to the Yard later this month and get pissed with the rest of us, but given your current condition that's probably even worse advice than everything else in this post!
Good luck whichever way you go, do let us know how things work out!
Sep 10th 2014 | 9:40 am
#45
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 6,966
From: SW Ontario, Canada / Gozo, Malta
Re: Time for some realism
I can't really add much to what has been said above. But what I will say is its all about
a) whats best for your happiness
and b) what is best for your family
For me, the consideration is only a) as I don't have a wife or children. I know where I want to be. It isn't here. Its been like that for the better part of 4 years. So if you think going back to the UK will be best for your happiness, then consider it. But as others have said, your old life in the UK isn't the same anymore. People move on, schools fill, etc.
Hubs is seemingly happy here but is open to moving back - correct?
Its a mumbo jumbo of things to consider especially given the fact that the longer you stay here, the harder it is to return home.
The kids will adjust, you've said your son is so-so... How old is he? Worst case scenario he goes back to the UK when he is of age to do so.
If I were you, in your situation, I would stick it out til hubs gets his certification/FSW - try and get mine in order ! and if after 1-2 more years i'm still not happy, i'd try to return.
The thing is returning after a longer stay in Canada is more "starting afresh in the UK" rather than being so soon after you left and feeling empty like "where did my life in the UK go, I wasn't gone that long" ... If you catch my drift?
Anyway, all the best and congrats on the 3rd sprog!
a) whats best for your happiness
and b) what is best for your family
For me, the consideration is only a) as I don't have a wife or children. I know where I want to be. It isn't here. Its been like that for the better part of 4 years. So if you think going back to the UK will be best for your happiness, then consider it. But as others have said, your old life in the UK isn't the same anymore. People move on, schools fill, etc.
Hubs is seemingly happy here but is open to moving back - correct?
Its a mumbo jumbo of things to consider especially given the fact that the longer you stay here, the harder it is to return home.
The kids will adjust, you've said your son is so-so... How old is he? Worst case scenario he goes back to the UK when he is of age to do so.
If I were you, in your situation, I would stick it out til hubs gets his certification/FSW - try and get mine in order ! and if after 1-2 more years i'm still not happy, i'd try to return.
The thing is returning after a longer stay in Canada is more "starting afresh in the UK" rather than being so soon after you left and feeling empty like "where did my life in the UK go, I wasn't gone that long" ... If you catch my drift?
Anyway, all the best and congrats on the 3rd sprog!
