Originally Posted by iPom

These are mainly rubbish. The NT writers were absolutely obsessed with finding any little link to OT 'prophesies' and the connections they draw are so weak, it's laughable.
It's the same as people who interpret Nostradamus's stuff and link any tenuous thing to some happening in the news or history.
His quatrains are so obscure that they can be interpreted to predict any occurrence you so choose.
Poor bloke was probably epileptic. Poor fella.

Originally Posted by iPom

Ah, yes, that's sad. But I guess vicars and other religious leaders say these comforting things, because thinking that your dead child isn't with the lovely man with the smiley eyes, long hair and robes isn't so nice.
Quite literally, we are a soul. Once we die, the soul is gone and we know nothing.
I find that quite nice actually.

I think it's Paul (? - I really can't be bothered to look it up - perhaps northerner can?) who talks about the time he will be dead to the time Jesus comes to resurrect him will pass in the blink of an eye.

I like to think of death and resurrection as the same effect as anesthetic... one minute you're going under and the next minute, you're awake, yet it feels like no time has passed at all.

And this is a perfect reason not to worry about dying. Just going to sleep and ceasing to exist sounds pretty peachy to me. It's merely the method of delivery which is the most worrying.

As for the Alderhay thing, I really don't think Jesus is so mean that he'd ignore a child.
He says in Matthew 19, v14...

"Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them,
for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these."

Originally Posted by Sally

It reminds me of the Peter Cook sketch along the lines of "Aunt Dolly saying 'Beware, trouble is coming' and seven years later WW2 broke out."

Originally Posted by northerner

Hutch,

Do you not think it's man's greed and outright, undeniable evil which has led to things like this? To sit back and say 'well if there is a God, he should sort it out' is saying that 'as a human being I want no free will whatsoever, I wish to make no decisions of my own.'

Originally Posted by Hutch

Okay. Here's my case.

http://www.markdroberts.com/images/C...ng-sudan-3.jpg

God is good.

Originally Posted by northerner

Hutch,

Do you not think it's man's greed and outright, undeniable evil which has led to things like this? To sit back and say 'well if there is a God, he should sort it out' is saying that 'as a human being I want no free will whatsoever, I wish I didn't have to make any decisions of my own.'

Originally Posted by wren

Again I ask you...so there's no god.... what is your take? What is your reasoning behind such suffering? Why does man allow it? What is the purpose? When will it end?

Originally Posted by why

but that means he wants them to die doesn't it?

Originally Posted by Hutch

Sounds to me like your god's got a pretty bloody twisted sense of humour ...

Originally Posted by wren

Again I ask you...so there's no god.... what is your take? What is your reasoning behind such suffering? Why does man allow it? What is the purpose? When will it end?

Originally Posted by iPom

These are mainly rubbish. The NT writers were absolutely obsessed with finding any little link to OT 'prophesies' and the connections they draw are so weak, it's laughable.
It's the same as people who interpret Nostradamus's stuff and link any tenuous thing to some happening in the news or history.
His quatrains are so obscure that they can be interpreted to predict any occurrence you so choose.
Poor bloke was probably epileptic. Poor fella.

Originally Posted by arkon

I'm glad it wasn't just me. I tried to find something in them, but I just couldn't see it. The more I read the bible the more I just conclude that if God does exist he is hugely spitefull, vindictive with a huge ego to boot. for example, read Zechariah 12:7 The command to kill god's shepherd. This seems to be a reccuring theme in the book. God either, killing or commanding to kill, and going more than a little OTT to get people to believe in him and confess that he is indeed their god.

Or how about this one... The Lord will bring a terrible disease on all the nations that make war on Jerusalem. Their flesh will rot away while they are still alive; their eyes and their tongues will rot away.

So basically God is so powerfull he can do this to all the nations that war against Jerusalam yet not powerfull enough to stop it happening in the first place. He would rather we all suffer in a war and then just for some icing on the cake he too will then inflict his own suffering on people too. Or am I just supposed to read the bible and ignore all the bits where he's a bit of a nasty pasty.

Originally Posted by iPom

Are you asking or telling?



What would you like it to mean?



It might do...

See, it's all down to your interpretation.

I personally, having three children, think I get what Jesus meant on this score. I rate children far more highly than many adults I've met simply for their natural ability to be themselves, to see through the BS, to question what they're handed, to think beyond themselves in the most touching ways ...
But really, it can mean whatever you like it to mean.
But for parents in the Alderhay thing who were upset about their children being autopsied and organs taken without permission, it's all about comfort.

Originally Posted by Sally

Many times on this thread you have answered a question with a question.

Originally Posted by Hutch

When will what end? Your endless circular questions, or your cut and pasting off vague 'prophecies'?

"I've got a bob or two, some decent clothes, a car, I've got me health back and I ain't attached. But I ain't got me peace of mind - and if you ain't got that, you ain't got nothing. I dunno. It seems to me if they ain't got you one way they've got you another. So what's the answer? That's what I keep asking myself - what's it all about? Know what I mean?"
Alfie.