Preconceptions
Feb 7th 2005, 6:50 pm
#16
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,577
Re: Preconceptions
Another wrong preconception I had, like a lot of others, was that in the US you pay less taxes. However I'm better off money wise.
I got a small pay rise but still, in the UK I wouldn't have been able to rent or buy anywhere around where I used to live. Now I can rent a nice one bedroom apartment in a nice Chicago suburb, drive a reasonable car, get cable television on a reasonable sized TV etc..... It's not the Ritz but it's better than anything I could have at home.
-tom
I got a small pay rise but still, in the UK I wouldn't have been able to rent or buy anywhere around where I used to live. Now I can rent a nice one bedroom apartment in a nice Chicago suburb, drive a reasonable car, get cable television on a reasonable sized TV etc..... It's not the Ritz but it's better than anything I could have at home.
-tom
Feb 7th 2005, 6:55 pm
#17
Account Closed
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,877
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by anotherlimey
Another wrong preconception I had, like a lot of others, was that in the US you pay less taxes. However I'm better off money wise.
I got a small pay rise but still, in the UK I wouldn't have been able to rent or buy anywhere around where I used to live. Now I can rent a nice one bedroom apartment in a nice Chicago suburb, drive a reasonable car, get cable television on a reasonable sized TV etc..... It's not the Ritz but it's better than anything I could have at home.
-tom
I got a small pay rise but still, in the UK I wouldn't have been able to rent or buy anywhere around where I used to live. Now I can rent a nice one bedroom apartment in a nice Chicago suburb, drive a reasonable car, get cable television on a reasonable sized TV etc..... It's not the Ritz but it's better than anything I could have at home.
-tom
Agree totally - I have nicer "things" (never had a bloody swimming pool in the Uk - well who would in Huddersfield !) I just assumed my deductions would be alot less and was lead to believe that by a number of people in the company. House, cars , electric goods, clothes ,eating out and petrol are cheap in comparison. It seems to me services such as insurance, utilities and groceries are not
Feb 7th 2005, 7:00 pm
#18
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 808
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by FIRSTIMER
Did you have any preconceived ideas about America, that you have since been unfounded - for Good or Bad? e.g quality of life, community relations, Taxes, Health etc
Is there really any thing like the American dream? Hah!
Is there really any thing like the American dream? Hah!
I've heard about this supposed "Amercan dream" business, and even though I'm an American I've no idea what it means. I would like to offer a counter question- is there such a thing as a "British dream"?
While were at it let's include a few other counties in the mix. What would a French dream be? How about a Spanish dream, Russian dream or Austrailan dream? Anybody have an idea what a Japanese dream would consist of?
Just thought I'd ask. We Americans sometimes wonder about the dreams of other nations.
Feb 7th 2005, 7:03 pm
#19
@matthewb76
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 21,886
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by Eskimo
The Sales Director of our company left high school with no quals, had a kid at 19 and started work for us packing boxes - worked her ass off, did a degree at nite school and is now,20 years later, top of the tree
Not convinced this would happen in the UK ..
Not convinced this would happen in the UK ..
Feb 7th 2005, 7:06 pm
#20
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,577
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by Jabba1
I've heard about this supposed "Amercan dream" business, and even though I'm an American I've no idea what it means. I would like to offer a counter question- is there such a thing as a "British dream"?
While were at it let's include a few other counties in the mix. What would a French dream be? How about a Spanish dream, Russian dream or Austrailan dream? Anybody have an idea what a Japanese dream would consist of?
Just thought I'd ask. We Americans sometimes wonder about the dreams of other nations.
While were at it let's include a few other counties in the mix. What would a French dream be? How about a Spanish dream, Russian dream or Austrailan dream? Anybody have an idea what a Japanese dream would consist of?
Just thought I'd ask. We Americans sometimes wonder about the dreams of other nations.
However there's no British Dream.
Perhaps we could make one up.
-tom
Feb 7th 2005, 7:06 pm
#21
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Re: Preconceptions
on the surface the USA looks a cheap place to live but when you consider medical,dental,property tax,social security,and the MULTIPLE insurance coverages you need to protect yourself from the "SHARKS" oops meant to say lawyers.....it ain't that cheap
Feb 7th 2005, 7:08 pm
#22
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,095
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by psb182
on the surface the USA looks a cheap place to live but when you consider medical,dental,property tax,social security,and the MULTIPLE insurance coverages you need to protect yourself from the "SHARKS" oops meant to say lawyers.....it ain't that cheap
Feb 7th 2005, 7:11 pm
#23
Powder Maggot
Joined: Nov 2004
Location: Nuevo Mexico
Posts: 4,452
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by Jabba1
I've heard about this supposed "Amercan dream" business, and even though I'm an American I've no idea what it means.
Feb 7th 2005, 7:13 pm
#24
@matthewb76
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 21,886
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by Pigtails
I have to disagree. I would have to be a bloody millionaire in England to live in the house I live in here!
Feb 7th 2005, 7:15 pm
#25
@matthewb76
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 21,886
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by anotherlimey
Here's the definition of the American Dream.
However there's no British Dream.
Perhaps we could make one up.
-tom
However there's no British Dream.
Perhaps we could make one up.
-tom
The idea of the American dream is long gone. It's puritan 200 years old and it doesn't relate to people any more. One cannot come to Ellis Island, work in a sweatshop for a few months and with the earnings go and buy 100 acres in West Virginia to be self sufficient. However the dream of self sufficiency still lives on, but now it's all greed, getting ahead of your fellow man whilst shoving him down whilst you're on your way up.
The past 10 years has seen a new European dream based on totally different values, secularism, diversity, social equality, communities, friendships and leisure time. The trouble is, the Europeans have an inferiority complex and are not as blatant about bragging about the great things in Europe. The new European dream needs to be ratified within two years with the signing of the EU constitution. If Europe bottles it, then the experiment has failed. But I ask you, is it not better to persue a dream of friendships, leisure time, communities and social well being over the persuit of money and materialistic ideals?
I think if you ask most people they'll say yes.
EU has the largest economy in the world, with 10.2 trillion dollars annually, and I reckon it is just a matter of time before OPEC starts trading in Euro's. Airbus has overtaken Boeing. 4 out of the 6 largest banks in the world are EU based.
The average EU worker has more production per man hour than the average US worker. They have more vacation time in the EU yet, still get the job done.
You cannot look at Europe simply as individual countries, because the youth of the EU are beginning to see themselves more and more as European and not Italian/Dutch/Danish etc etc.
America is good. But the American dream is dead. It was worth dying for, but the New European dream is worth living for. I just hope the UK especially doesn't bottle it with the Euro and the constitution.
Last edited by Manc; Feb 7th 2005 at 7:17 pm.
Feb 7th 2005, 7:16 pm
#26
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 808
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by Pigtails
I have to disagree. I would have to be a bloody millionaire in England to live in the house I live in here!
Oh, live in a one room trailer do you?
Feb 7th 2005, 7:23 pm
#27
Account Closed
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,877
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by Pigtails
I have to disagree. I would have to be a bloody millionaire in England to live in the house I live in here!
me too !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! great aint it
Feb 7th 2005, 7:25 pm
#28
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 808
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by Manc
I posted this before.
The idea of the American dream is long gone. It's puritan 200 years old and it doesn't relate to people any more. One cannot come to Ellis Island, work in a sweatshop for a few months and with the earnings go and buy 100 acres in West Virginia to be self sufficient. However the dream of self sufficiency still lives on, but now it's all greed, getting ahead of your fellow man whilst shoving him down whilst you're on your way up.
The past 10 years has seen a new European dream based on totally different values, secularism, diversity, social equality, communities, friendships and leisure time. The trouble is, the Europeans have an inferiority complex and are not as blatant about bragging about the great things in Europe. The new European dream needs to be ratified within two years with the signing of the EU constitution. If Europe bottles it, then the experiment has failed. But I ask you, is it not better to persue a dream of friendships, leisure time, communities and social well being over the persuit of money and materialistic ideals?
I think if you ask most people they'll say yes.
EU has the largest economy in the world, with 10.2 trillion dollars annually, and I reckon it is just a matter of time before OPEC starts trading in Euro's. Airbus has overtaken Boeing. 4 out of the 6 largest banks in the world are EU based.
The average EU worker has more production per man hour than the average US worker. They have more vacation time in the EU yet, still get the job done.
You cannot look at Europe simply as individual countries, because the youth of the EU are beginning to see themselves more and more as European and not Italian/Dutch/Danish etc etc.
America is good. But the American dream is dead. It was worth dying for, but the New European dream is worth living for. I just hope the UK especially doesn't bottle it with the Euro and the constitution.
The idea of the American dream is long gone. It's puritan 200 years old and it doesn't relate to people any more. One cannot come to Ellis Island, work in a sweatshop for a few months and with the earnings go and buy 100 acres in West Virginia to be self sufficient. However the dream of self sufficiency still lives on, but now it's all greed, getting ahead of your fellow man whilst shoving him down whilst you're on your way up.
The past 10 years has seen a new European dream based on totally different values, secularism, diversity, social equality, communities, friendships and leisure time. The trouble is, the Europeans have an inferiority complex and are not as blatant about bragging about the great things in Europe. The new European dream needs to be ratified within two years with the signing of the EU constitution. If Europe bottles it, then the experiment has failed. But I ask you, is it not better to persue a dream of friendships, leisure time, communities and social well being over the persuit of money and materialistic ideals?
I think if you ask most people they'll say yes.
EU has the largest economy in the world, with 10.2 trillion dollars annually, and I reckon it is just a matter of time before OPEC starts trading in Euro's. Airbus has overtaken Boeing. 4 out of the 6 largest banks in the world are EU based.
The average EU worker has more production per man hour than the average US worker. They have more vacation time in the EU yet, still get the job done.
You cannot look at Europe simply as individual countries, because the youth of the EU are beginning to see themselves more and more as European and not Italian/Dutch/Danish etc etc.
America is good. But the American dream is dead. It was worth dying for, but the New European dream is worth living for. I just hope the UK especially doesn't bottle it with the Euro and the constitution.
Sounds goood. Maybe the US should join the EU as an overseas partner. That way we'll all be one big happy family again- we'll actually it would be the first time.
Feb 7th 2005, 7:25 pm
#29
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,577
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by Manc
I posted this before.
The idea of the American dream is long gone. It's puritan 200 years old and it doesn't relate to people any more. One cannot come to Ellis Island, work in a sweatshop for a few months and with the earnings go and buy 100 acres in West Virginia to be self sufficient. However the dream of self sufficiency still lives on, but now it's all greed, getting ahead of your fellow man whilst shoving him down whilst you're on your way up.
The past 10 years has seen a new European dream based on totally different values, secularism, diversity, social equality, communities, friendships and leisure time. The trouble is, the Europeans have an inferiority complex and are not as blatant about bragging about the great things in Europe. The new European dream needs to be ratified within two years with the signing of the EU constitution. If Europe bottles it, then the experiment has failed. But I ask you, is it not better to persue a dream of friendships, leisure time, communities and social well being over the persuit of money and materialistic ideals?
I think if you ask most people they'll say yes.
EU has the largest economy in the world, with 10.2 trillion dollars annually, and I reckon it is just a matter of time before OPEC starts trading in Euro's. Airbus has overtaken Boeing. 4 out of the 6 largest banks in the world are EU based.
The average EU worker has more production per man hour than the average US worker. They have more vacation time in the EU yet, still get the job done.
You cannot look at Europe simply as individual countries, because the youth of the EU are beginning to see themselves more and more as European and not Italian/Dutch/Danish etc etc.
America is good. But the American dream is dead. It was worth dying for, but the New European dream is worth living for. I just hope the UK especially doesn't bottle it with the Euro and the constitution.
The idea of the American dream is long gone. It's puritan 200 years old and it doesn't relate to people any more. One cannot come to Ellis Island, work in a sweatshop for a few months and with the earnings go and buy 100 acres in West Virginia to be self sufficient. However the dream of self sufficiency still lives on, but now it's all greed, getting ahead of your fellow man whilst shoving him down whilst you're on your way up.
The past 10 years has seen a new European dream based on totally different values, secularism, diversity, social equality, communities, friendships and leisure time. The trouble is, the Europeans have an inferiority complex and are not as blatant about bragging about the great things in Europe. The new European dream needs to be ratified within two years with the signing of the EU constitution. If Europe bottles it, then the experiment has failed. But I ask you, is it not better to persue a dream of friendships, leisure time, communities and social well being over the persuit of money and materialistic ideals?
I think if you ask most people they'll say yes.
EU has the largest economy in the world, with 10.2 trillion dollars annually, and I reckon it is just a matter of time before OPEC starts trading in Euro's. Airbus has overtaken Boeing. 4 out of the 6 largest banks in the world are EU based.
The average EU worker has more production per man hour than the average US worker. They have more vacation time in the EU yet, still get the job done.
You cannot look at Europe simply as individual countries, because the youth of the EU are beginning to see themselves more and more as European and not Italian/Dutch/Danish etc etc.
America is good. But the American dream is dead. It was worth dying for, but the New European dream is worth living for. I just hope the UK especially doesn't bottle it with the Euro and the constitution.
I think the US worker is more efficient than an EU worker. I saw the figures a few months ago, they went something like this;
Average company earnings per employee,
1. US -> $60,000
2. France -> $50,000
3. UK -> $45,000
I'll try to find a source on the Internet for it.
-tom
Feb 7th 2005, 7:30 pm
#30
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 808
Re: Preconceptions
Originally Posted by anotherlimey
Did you get this from the book 'European Dream'?
I think the US worker is more efficient than an EU worker. I saw the figures a few months ago, they went something like this;
Average company earnings per employee,
1. US -> $60,000
2. France -> $50,000
3. UK -> $45,000
I'll try to find a source on the Internet for it.
-tom
I think the US worker is more efficient than an EU worker. I saw the figures a few months ago, they went something like this;
Average company earnings per employee,
1. US -> $60,000
2. France -> $50,000
3. UK -> $45,000
I'll try to find a source on the Internet for it.
-tom