Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
Jun 25th 2016, 8:48 pm
#361
Banned
Joined: Dec 2015
Location: california
Posts: 6,035
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
So what now? Immigrants to be sent packing to wherever they came from ?
Jun 25th 2016, 8:53 pm
#362
Austin. TX.
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 5,930
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
This apparently from the Guardian comments section. Seems to make sense to me.
"From the guardians comments section:
If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.
Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.
With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.
How?
Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.
And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legistlation to be torn up and rewritten ... the list grew and grew.
The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.
The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?
Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?
Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-maneouvered and check-mated.
If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over - Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession ... broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.
The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.
When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was "never". When Michael Gove went on and on about "informal negotiations" ... why? why not the formal ones straight away? ... he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.
All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign."
This is the FB link that was shared https://www.facebook.com/tom.short.3...55134392909152
"From the guardians comments section:
If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.
Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.
With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.
How?
Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.
And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legistlation to be torn up and rewritten ... the list grew and grew.
The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.
The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?
Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?
Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-maneouvered and check-mated.
If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over - Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession ... broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.
The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.
When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was "never". When Michael Gove went on and on about "informal negotiations" ... why? why not the formal ones straight away? ... he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.
All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign."
This is the FB link that was shared https://www.facebook.com/tom.short.3...55134392909152
Jun 25th 2016, 9:10 pm
#363
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Portlandia Metro
Posts: 7,425
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
Invest in infrastructure or maybe civil unrest. But realistically immigration is going to happen, people just get upset when they feel hopeless and not heard. They don't see the benefits of immigration.
Jun 25th 2016, 9:10 pm
#364
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: East Seaxe
Posts: 72,572
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
This apparently from the Guardian comments section. Seems to make sense to me.
"From the guardians comments section:
If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.
Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.
With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.
How?
Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.
And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legistlation to be torn up and rewritten ... the list grew and grew.
The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.
The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?
Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?
Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-maneouvered and check-mated.
If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over - Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession ... broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.
The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.
When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was "never". When Michael Gove went on and on about "informal negotiations" ... why? why not the formal ones straight away? ... he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.
All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign."
This is the FB link that was shared https://www.facebook.com/tom.short.3...55134392909152
"From the guardians comments section:
If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.
Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.
With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.
How?
Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.
And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legistlation to be torn up and rewritten ... the list grew and grew.
The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.
The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?
Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?
Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-maneouvered and check-mated.
If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over - Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession ... broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.
The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.
When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was "never". When Michael Gove went on and on about "informal negotiations" ... why? why not the formal ones straight away? ... he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.
All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign."
This is the FB link that was shared https://www.facebook.com/tom.short.3...55134392909152
Jun 25th 2016, 9:31 pm
#365
Banned
Joined: Dec 2015
Location: california
Posts: 6,035
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
Trump however sees them as job stealers a political ploy used by rascals who seek the vote of the less affluent whites
Jun 25th 2016, 9:56 pm
#366
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: East Seaxe
Posts: 72,572
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
Remain failed to offer a case more convincing than "we know it isn't perfect, but it could be worse" - not much to capture the popular imagination there. Leave had catchy phrases like "get our country back" - their advertising agency must have been better. The gap between the catchy phrases and the reality of what people will get is huge, but that doesn't matter during an election, only afterwards.
Now we will just have a divided country full of pissed off people and none of the available options are likely to make it better. We are in for an interesting ride. Still, Cameron's gone, so that's a plus. I only hope we don't get the vile Boris instead.
Jun 25th 2016, 10:28 pm
#368
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Joined: Mar 2013
Location: Lehigh Valley, PA USA
Posts: 1,206
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
I'm not sure about this. Scare tactics abounded on both sides - they were just different. Leave employed fear of EU domination, immigrants, Germans, loss of sovereignty, and more.
Remain failed to offer a case more convincing than "we know it isn't perfect, but it could be worse" - not much to capture the popular imagination there. Leave had catchy phrases like "get our country back" - their advertising agency must have been better. The gap between the catchy phrases and the reality of what people will get is huge, but that doesn't matter during an election, only afterwards.
Now we will just have a divided country full of pissed off people and none of the available options are likely to make it better. We are in for an interesting ride. Still, Cameron's gone, so that's a plus. I only hope we don't get the vile Boris instead.
Remain failed to offer a case more convincing than "we know it isn't perfect, but it could be worse" - not much to capture the popular imagination there. Leave had catchy phrases like "get our country back" - their advertising agency must have been better. The gap between the catchy phrases and the reality of what people will get is huge, but that doesn't matter during an election, only afterwards.
Now we will just have a divided country full of pissed off people and none of the available options are likely to make it better. We are in for an interesting ride. Still, Cameron's gone, so that's a plus. I only hope we don't get the vile Boris instead.
Jun 25th 2016, 11:15 pm
#369
Heading for Poppyland
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: North Norfolk and northern New York State
Posts: 14,552
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
This reads like an absolutely accurate description of the US election, complete with catchy phrases about "Making America Great Again" and scare tactics by both sides. We will get a bitterly divided country full of pissed off people and none of the options to make it better.
Jun 26th 2016, 12:56 am
#370
Lost in BE Cyberspace
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Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Portlandia Metro
Posts: 7,425
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
What I see of immigrants are those working in fields under scorching heat picking strawberries or oranges cleaning motel rooms or private homes, working in restaurants as cooks or dishwashers. Jobs that no Anglo, black or Asian American would want or bother doing.
Trump however sees them as job stealers a political ploy used by rascals who seek the vote of the less affluent whites
Trump however sees them as job stealers a political ploy used by rascals who seek the vote of the less affluent whites
Jun 26th 2016, 2:08 am
#371
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: East Seaxe
Posts: 72,572
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
Left at primary schools. Thank you Nigel.
Apologies for the double post - I put this in one of the TIO threads too.
Reports of "No more Polish vermin" signs left outside primary schools in Huntingdon | Cambridge News
Jun 26th 2016, 2:23 am
#372
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Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Portlandia Metro
Posts: 7,425
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
The problem with the European unification model was that there is no common language like there is in the US. If people can't communicate, it's difficult.
Jun 26th 2016, 2:24 am
#373
Account Closed
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 2
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
Jun 26th 2016, 2:27 am
#374
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Portlandia Metro
Posts: 7,425
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
If some people have their way.
http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/imag...0062-large.jpg
Left at primary schools. Thank you Nigel.
Apologies for the double post - I put this in one of the TIO threads too.
Reports of "No more Polish vermin" signs left outside primary schools in Huntingdon | Cambridge News
http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/imag...0062-large.jpg
Left at primary schools. Thank you Nigel.
Apologies for the double post - I put this in one of the TIO threads too.
Reports of "No more Polish vermin" signs left outside primary schools in Huntingdon | Cambridge News
Jun 26th 2016, 2:38 am
#375
Austin. TX.
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 5,930
Re: Consequences of the UK leaving Europe
https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...rica?CMP=fb_gu
don't suppose the author is one of us?
This article explains how I am feeling quite well.
I'm not surprised about that awful racist sign left at a school Appalled yes, but no longer surprised.
don't suppose the author is one of us?
This article explains how I am feeling quite well.
I'm not surprised about that awful racist sign left at a school Appalled yes, but no longer surprised.