Re: 2020 Election
 

Tulsi and Sanders are my favorites.

Re: 2020 Election
 

I agree with the second part but not the first. Trump's been elected by the people, and it would be undemocratic for the Democrats (democracy's in their name) to remove him unless eg there was something that the people were not aware of when they voted for him, eg the collusion that Mueller looked for but couldn't find. It would look like the Democrats joining with the security services to overturn democracy and the people's vote. The way to remove Trump is democratically in the election next year.

Re: 2020 Election
 

There is now a Dem majority for impeachment.

Re: 2020 Election
 

I get your point. But the purpose of impeachment is to remove someone from their office based on their conduct in said office. So, yes, the voters should decide. But if the Democrats truly believe that Trump is not fit for the office and his conduct means he should be impeached, then why won't they pursue it?

Re: 2020 Election
 

Interesting debate last night. Good to see differences of opinion being aired. My thoughts, in no particular order:

- Biden did pretty well, and fended off Harris' and others attacks with relative ease. It will be really interesting seeing him debate Warren in September.

- Harris had a poor, possibly disastrous debate. Her sound was screwed up at the start and maybe that got her off on the wrong foot. Her attacks on Biden were too predictable and came across as angry rather than reasoned. Her position on health care seemed very confused. And she seemed very defensive when attacked. As someone who likes Harris, it was very disappointing.

- Booker did well, despite his disingenuous claims regarding the ACLU and his time as mayor of Newark. Clear, concise answers throughout the debate and some really effective zingers thrown in.

- I had Gillibrand dead and buried before the debate, but she rescued herself somewhat.

- Castro has done well in both debates and rattled Harris. I am really beginning to appreciate him..

Oh, and that "It's a GOP talking point" line that several used to try and shut down debate is so stupid. So what if it is?

Re: 2020 Election
 

Whoever they plump with should probably give Yang a call for some ideas, he's a smart cookie I think. He's got some off the wall stuff that won't fly, mainly because most of the electorate will not exert the effort to really understand them. His talking point on Healthcare is something I doubt many people have bothered to think about too much when they focus on the "socialism" thing - that companies are exerting effort and cost administering this "benefit" and would like nothing more than to release that burden. That should appeal a little towards some of the people in the middle of the debate - gives a bit of free market spin to why moving to a Universal system may well be a good idea. The more I thought on that, the more I thought just how messy life would have been in the UK if the NHS admin was done by my employers!

It is one of the oddest feelings I've had since being here, watching the debate. Imagine in the UK seeing 10 people debating about why getting rid of the NHS and replacing it with a fully private system is the right thing to do..........When you know the USA audience is feeling that in reverse you begin to understand how tricky that play is, but I don't think the Democrats shouldn't let Trump be a reason they avoid going for it this time. Maybe this one is a sacrificial lamb, but having it on the ticket probably starts to break down the wall. And who knows, it could just catch fire a little if they can get those Yang style ideas in the mix to re-frame it.

Re: 2020 Election
 

We should not forget one of the big winners of the last 2 nights - Trump.

Re: 2020 Election
 

I doubt very much this has any impact on Trump whatsoever. His strategy is clear, invoke a "they are coming to get you" type of fear that energises a certain subset of people and rely on the staunch Republicans to vote as they always do. He has no interest in any of the voters this lot are playing for. The Democrats have two options - try and appeal to the middle ground who won;t vote Trump but wouldn't vote Clinton either, or energise the opposite side of the base to turn out and rely on the staunch Demcrats - assuming they have a bigger overall base. For that reason, Republicans can rattle on about them all they like, it makes no difference what they think - they tried it in the mid terms around Immigration - that debate is not going to sway a single Democrat voter to vote Republican. The Democrats could stick that Author on the ticket and Trump would get precisely the same vote count in 2020 I imagine.

Trump is almost irrelevant in this - nobody is going to change their mind on him, not now.

Re: 2020 Election
 

Given the near uselessness of the UK Labour Party these days, they could do worse than fly Warren over I think.

Re: 2020 Election
 

That's a pretty horse-blinkered view.

The Democratic Party look like chaos. You have a group of incredibly liberal/crazy socialist idiots in one corner, and then Kamala and Biden and Sanders in the other. When a democratic candidate states they will 'decriminalize' border crossings, that's a pretty big f*ing win for Trump considering the amount of swing states and on the fence voters there are.

Re: 2020 Election
 

And they get free health care.

Re: 2020 Election
 

Forgot about that too.

But seriously, anyone that thinks Trump/GOP didn't also win last night clearly isn't looking at the bigger picture.

Re: 2020 Election
 

It was certainly a contrast to the night before. The first night was much more policy based and about ideological differences argued by candidates who actually knew what they were talking about policy wise. The second night was more about personal attacks on candidates' records.

I agree with you about Harris, she hasn't been clear about what her position on healthcare is since the start of the campaign, and it was clear tonight she really didn't know the details of her plan well enough to be able to defend it. For example, when Biden said it would cost $3T a year, the easy response is to point out what the current healthcare system costs, but she didn't do that. Also when Gabbard attacked her record on criminal justice with clear and precise examples of bad things she did, she dodged and attacked Gabbard as someone who just gives fancy speeches or whatever it was she said. Whatever you think of Gabbard, she is a veteran, so implying she has not had any skin in the game is pretty crass.

Biden did. a lot better than last time, but to be honest he couldn't have done much worse. That still didn't mean it was good. He stumbled over his answers several times and again on healthcare didn't know the details of his plan well enough. Also I thought Castro hit him pretty hard on immigration.

Speaking of Castro, I think his debate performances show he should be doing better in the polls. I don't know what his numbers are right now, but I hope he meets the threshold for the next debate.

I want to like Gillibrand, I really do, but many of her answers just seem to prepared and she just doesn't seem to do well off the cuff. Her attack on Biden over something bad he said about women fell flat because I don't really understand what she was trying to get at.

Booker was Booker, with his call for Democrats to not be divided, closely followed by another attack on Biden.

The "GOP talking points" thing had my eyes rolling. It's going to become the new "fake news" isn't it. When Sanders and Warren used it in the context of how CNN was framing all the healthcare questions from a right wing perspective it did kind of make sense. But last night it was just a dodge for any question that was hard.

Re: 2020 Election
 

I think I went more for Tulsi because she does not share some of the really stupid ideas and I have no idea how the likes of Casto etc would be able to walk their positions back should they win the nomination.

Quite why the Dems want to go through a process like this confuses me, seems totally masochistic, how does it benefit them?

Re: 2020 Election
 

That's the big thing for me, it's like a cattle auction honestly.