Originally Posted by UkWinds5353 (Post 12778094)

Zargof, I will give you this, you are a good person and you do care a great deal about your fellow man. And you have fight in you . If most democrats were similar to you then Trump would not be President. But many Democrats are easily distracted and Americans in general don't like dramatic change.

Look at what happened in the UK yesterday. Boris Johnson has now attained a firm grip on power because Socialist like Corbyn are misreading what the British truly want. Actual life long Labor party members voted for the Tories because the Conservatives are seen to offer the better governing plans. Socialist pretty much gave that election to Boris Johnson because they care more about their agenda than listening to what the people are actually wanting. Numerous Labor Party voters have been saying the European Union has harmed the lives of Brits by forcing born Brits to compete for jobs with foreigners. And Socialist like Corbyn ignored the will of the people and the people taught the Labor party a lesson. The Tories achieved their biggest win since 1987. Think about that. Look at what happens when you ignore the will of the voting public. Brit after Brit after Brit in the Labor party were shown on the news saying they wanted to vote Labor but the party was not listening to them about getting out of the Union and protecting British jobs. My wife and I were watching young people say they wanted to leave the Union and yet Socialist were swept away with Dogma thinking and tonight was a referendum on Socialism.

If Democrat voters like yourself don't get a grip and realize that Americans don't want Socialist change you will be dooming the Democrat Party to the same result in November. If Socialism can't win in the UK you obviously have no chance in gun rights cheering, flag waving America to turn our healthcare system into a European carbon copy. Socialism needs to be exchanged for moderate thinking.

Originally Posted by Boiler (Post 12778092)

Bernies policies having majority support.

Originally Posted by UkWinds5353 (Post 12778266)

Would you give up your livelihood and your ability to feed your children for Bernie Sanders' poorly thought out ideas? Most Americans will not. Yesterday's election in the UK proves Socialism is dying in GB but it doesn't even have a chance in America because Independent voters made the choice with their feet not to join Liberal political groups. Deciding to not join those affiliations speaks volumes. But you have to see past your Dogmatic believes to read their political thinking. I certainly can see how being raised a Socialist in a different country then moving to America, and wanting to see improvements there could make you think about a familiar solution. But Americans haven't any experience with wanting government to solve most of their financial needs and problems. It's just not reasonable to expect them to change from being members of a culture that promotes self reliance. And voters not reading the culture correctly could help re-elect Trump. But I think yesterday's election in the UK is a warning to all Democrats if you give your backing to a Socialist you will doom your party to losing the national election. And Bernie Sanders is America's Corbyn and that spells disaster because America is far more conservative than the UK.

Originally Posted by Jsmth321 (Post 12778035)

Cost of living and wages seemed to better align as well. My parents never went to college, but they had a decent life, we took trips, had a house, 2 cars, and they provided what we needed, the job my dad retired from now requires a college degree at minimum, and the starting level jobs are like $14/hr and casual now because its cheaper then full-time employees for the employer, my MIL worked at Sears in Canada (and whatever it was called before Sears) and raised 2 kids, and bought a house, not going to happen today working retail unless in management, store management and above.

Even skilled jobs don't always pay a wage that actually matches cost of living, nurses for example, their salary isn't sufficient for them to buy 1 million dollar houses which is what a basic old fixer upper will run these days, median income for a family is only 78,000 a year or so, closer to 50,000 for a single worker.

It's crazy really the costs of basics vs wages.

I would certainly have benefited if companies/employers did more training and relied less on college degrees but it is what it is, I doubt it will change in my lifetime, and at 40, have largely given up, low wage jobs never lead to anything in my experience unless you have the ability to get some sort of college education.

Originally Posted by zargof (Post 12778272)

Haha, I knew you were going to make the case that the UK election was analogous to the US election. It is so obviously a terrible comparison.

<snip>
6) You ignore the more obvious comparison with the Clinton/Trump election where Clinton lost because again it doesn't fit your narrative.

Originally Posted by UkWinds5353 (Post 12778083)

Can we just agree to be adult and not take everything to heart? After all what ever differences we do have it amounts to nothing in the big scheme of things.

Originally Posted by zargof (Post 12778297)

So what you're saying is that we should keep the inefficient system as it is so that people don't lose their jobs? This seems to be a complete antithesis to capitalism. Strange.

I've already addressed the rest of this nonsense comparisons to the UK election.

Originally Posted by Leslie (Post 12778322)

You're the one counting the days since I last "spoke" to you. Weirdo. :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by UkWinds5353 (Post 12778328)

We should keep the current system until a better idea can be developed of how to pay for covering all Americans. Putting the entire burden of healthcare on government and tax payers is not the electoral winning solution. But we have bigger problems than trying to create a whole new government funding healthcare system. We need to try and keep the current hard earned achievements in place.

Originally Posted by UkWinds5353 (Post 12778328)

It was announced yesterday that the Trump Administration is planning to kick millions of people off of social security benefits by changing their technical status. And they can get away with it because the American mentality of self reliance gives the Republicans political cover. It's similar to the "British" thing taking the piss. It's a cultural thing and going against or being upset by it only makes the target look bad, not the person who creates the joke. It's very difficult to make people let go of their culture. And obviously a way of speaking or manner and healthcare are two different subjects but both are cultural.

Originally Posted by Ingles (Post 12778160)

Fish Antibiotics ?
This is a very strong statement about the USA's Health System & costing's
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...er-than-doctor

Originally Posted by Jsmth321 (Post 12778470)

And people who abuse medications like that will be why the FDA eventually bans OTC medications for fish, Canada already has, and its become a major issue since people can't treat their fish now for very treatable diseases.

Originally Posted by zargof (Post 12778381)

There is no way to achieve universal coverage without more government involvement. It would theoretically be possible to achieve universal coverage with a public option, but while the insurance companies are involved in the process then they are going to do everything they can to keep maximizing their profits.

Originally Posted by Giantaxe (Post 12778489)

Switzerland and The Netherlands manage it with insurance companies involved, but, as I mentioned yesterday, insurance is way more regulated there than in the US. And that's a form of "government involvement", of course.

Originally Posted by Leslie (Post 12778313)

I've been laughing at all of the doomsday warning for Democrats since yesterday's UK elections. You better be worried! Look what happened in the UK! A right wing con-man will convince the working class to vote for him with populism. Wooo scary! WTF do they think happened 3 years ago? All I can see is that Johnson took a page from Trump's playbook and the it's the UK's turn now.