2020 Election
Dec 11th 2019, 9:51 pm
#1546
Banned
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,830
Re: 2020 Election
It's the nature of Democrat voters. They are easily distracted. They win elections and suddenly become satisfied with just the one win. While Republicans love the actual fight but the party is not good at governing. No wonder so many people lose hope for government to do the right thing.
Dec 11th 2019, 9:54 pm
#1547
I love my brick!
Joined: May 2007
Location: Peachy
Posts: 9,304
Re: 2020 Election
Try 1000 times more opposed!
Americans will not accept being told what to do by politicians unless the plan offered is welcomed change. Zargof who means well, don't really understand America society at all. Electing Bernie Sanders would never result in a European style health care system in America. The American judicial system would definitely rule Medicare for all unconstitutional. And it's a fact that Democrats are good leaders but their voters lose focus and don't show up at mid-term elections which gives my party the chance to stop the Democrat agenda. The country need to do all it can to improve Obama care.
Americans will not accept being told what to do by politicians unless the plan offered is welcomed change. Zargof who means well, don't really understand America society at all. Electing Bernie Sanders would never result in a European style health care system in America. The American judicial system would definitely rule Medicare for all unconstitutional. And it's a fact that Democrats are good leaders but their voters lose focus and don't show up at mid-term elections which gives my party the chance to stop the Democrat agenda. The country need to do all it can to improve Obama care.
It's not the average American who is going to be opposed to M4A, it's going to be the money interests. Which are of course very powerful, and it's going to be hard fight no doubt.
As for unconstitutional. Article 1 Section 8 says: we're good fam.
Oh and Democrats have terrible leaders who don't fight for anything, which is why we need more uncorrupted challengers from the left to gain more influence over the Democratic party.
Dec 11th 2019, 9:54 pm
#1548
WTF?
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: Homeostasis
Posts: 79,367
Re: 2020 Election
It's the nature of Democrat voters. They are easily distracted. They win elections and suddenly become satisfied with just the one win. While Republicans love the actual fight but the party is not good at governing. No wonder so many people lose hope for government to do the right thing.
Dec 11th 2019, 10:01 pm
#1549
WTF?
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: Homeostasis
Posts: 79,367
Re: 2020 Election
Wealth envy is a waste of time. The rich live their life styles and they'll never give you any of their money anyway so why bother about it. I pulled myself up by the boot straps and I'm no genius. My son in law, part Mexican likes to tell the story of his great grand parents who sneaked across the Rio Grande, hiked their way to California and worked in the farm fields. Their son fought in WW2 in Europe and was discharged as a master sergeant at the end. My S.in.Ls father served in the LAPD for many years and ended up as a detective lieutenant and his son, my daughter's husband became a Captain in the USAF.
Ah, lovely, anecdotal evidence - "I knew a guy whose brother's neighbor's cousin was born with no toes, yet he became a champion runner......" A couple on the other side of town won $50,000 in the state lottery, so that's PROOF that you will win if you play the lottery...... I heard of a woman somewhere who invented a better mop, and now she is a zillionaire....... "
Funny, isn't it, that the apologists never seem to remember all of the people who broke their backs working for 45 or 46 years and then got a debilitating illness for which they had no money to pay. Or about the woman who is 74 and has to go to work everyday since her late minister husband left her with inadequate financial resources on which to live. Or about the family in which a Downs Syndrome baby is born, and which takes up all of the financial resources. Or about the 20-year-old on a bike in the curb lane who gets sideswiped by a careless hit-and-run driver paying more attention to their cell phone than to their driving, and who thereon for the next 60+ years has permanent disabilities, not to mention huge, ongoing medical bills.
If you want to (incorrectly) accuse people of being envious of the wealthy, then you have to face facts and realize that you are indifferent of real human suffering, and the fact that in many ways life is itself a lottery, dishing out prizes and favors to some, while dealing others huge hardships. .
Funny, isn't it, that the apologists never seem to remember all of the people who broke their backs working for 45 or 46 years and then got a debilitating illness for which they had no money to pay. Or about the woman who is 74 and has to go to work everyday since her late minister husband left her with inadequate financial resources on which to live. Or about the family in which a Downs Syndrome baby is born, and which takes up all of the financial resources. Or about the 20-year-old on a bike in the curb lane who gets sideswiped by a careless hit-and-run driver paying more attention to their cell phone than to their driving, and who thereon for the next 60+ years has permanent disabilities, not to mention huge, ongoing medical bills.
If you want to (incorrectly) accuse people of being envious of the wealthy, then you have to face facts and realize that you are indifferent of real human suffering, and the fact that in many ways life is itself a lottery, dishing out prizes and favors to some, while dealing others huge hardships. .
FTFY
Dec 11th 2019, 10:23 pm
#1550
BE Forum Addict
Joined: May 2016
Location: Northern California
Posts: 2,277
Re: 2020 Election
Ah, lovely, anecdotal evidence - "I knew a guy whose brother's neighbor's cousin was born with no toes, yet he became a champion runner......" A couple on the other side of town won $50,000 in the state lottery, so that's PROOF that you will win if you play the lottery...... I heard of a woman somewhere who invented a better mop, and now she is a zillionaire....... "
Funny, isn't it, that the apologists never seem to remember all of the people who broke their backs working for 45 or 46 years and then got a debilitating illness for which they had no money to pay. Or about the woman who is 74 and has to go to work everyday since her late minister husband left her with inadequate financial resources on which to live. Or about the family in which a Downs Syndrome baby is born, and which takes up all of the financial resources. Or about the 20-year-old on a bike in the curb lane who gets sideswiped by a careless hit-and-run driver paying more attention to their cell phone than to their driving, and who thereon for the next 60+ years has permanent disabilities, not to mention huge, ongoing medical bills.
If you want to (incorrectly) accuse people of being envious of the wealthy, then you have to face facts and realize that you are indifferent of real human suffering, and the fact that in many ways life is itself a lottery, dishing out prizes and favors to some, while dealing others huge hardships. .
He and I grew up in post war Britain at a time when There were manufacturing jobs a plenty. A thriving economy. An automobile industry, Aircraft, commercial vehicles, motor cycles, steel, shipbuilding. Consumer products stamped "Made in England" Even British Television and Radios.
"The history of unemployment in the UK is central to both the economic and social history of the country."The 1950s and 1960s saw a very low rate of unemployment (around 3 per cent on average) as a result of the "postwar boom".
https://www.politics.co.uk/reference/unemployment
Last edited by Jerseygirl; Dec 12th 2019 at 1:15 pm. Reason: Quote
Dec 12th 2019, 3:35 am
#1551
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 12,865
Re: 2020 Election
And the UK is the only one that is almost wholly "single provider". Plus some are similar to the ACA where you're required to have insurance but receive financial help for it if you're low income. So, yeh, there is no "European style system". I'd say the two things that distinguish the US "system" are the extortionate cost of it all, and the mishmash of systems - employer provided, ACA, VA, Medicare, Medicaid - that form it. The two are probably related.
Dec 12th 2019, 4:32 am
#1552
Account Closed
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 0
Re: 2020 Election
It's not wealth envy for most, it's the simple fact wages are too low when compared to cost of living, things like housing and food are increasing in more and more city's far faster then rent.
Trades are great if you have the ability to do a trade, not everyone has that ability, trades at least here require a fair amount of schooling, so trades are not a way out of going to school, just a different form of schooling, but you still need the resources to attend, not everyone has those resources, government loans come nowhere close to funding education + living expenses, and many programs are more than full-time and no chance of passing if also working full-time.
I'd gladly do lineman job, but I am not qualified, and I am just not good enough at physics and math, its not exactly an entry level job anyone can do, need to know some basic stuff and abilities.
Luck and who you know plays a large role in getting good jobs, ever heard that saying "its not what you know, it's who you know." I have applied for hundreds of jobs over the years that paid well, no amount of hard work or effort ever paid off, hard work doesn't lead to high pay, no matter what some want to think.
Trades are great if you have the ability to do a trade, not everyone has that ability, trades at least here require a fair amount of schooling, so trades are not a way out of going to school, just a different form of schooling, but you still need the resources to attend, not everyone has those resources, government loans come nowhere close to funding education + living expenses, and many programs are more than full-time and no chance of passing if also working full-time.
I'd gladly do lineman job, but I am not qualified, and I am just not good enough at physics and math, its not exactly an entry level job anyone can do, need to know some basic stuff and abilities.
Luck and who you know plays a large role in getting good jobs, ever heard that saying "its not what you know, it's who you know." I have applied for hundreds of jobs over the years that paid well, no amount of hard work or effort ever paid off, hard work doesn't lead to high pay, no matter what some want to think.
Wealth envy is a waste of time. The rich live their life styles and they'll never give you any of their money anyway so why bother about it. I pulled myself up by the boot straps and I'm no genius. My son in law, part Mexican likes to tell the story of his great grand parents who sneaked across the Rio Grande, hiked their way to California and worked in the farm fields. Their son fought in WW2 in Europe and was discharged as a master sergeant at the end. My S.in.Ls father served in the LAPD for many years and ended up as a detective lieutenant and his son, my daughter's husband became a Captain in the USAF.
There is an actual shortage in such trades as welders, carpenters, bricklayers, roofers the manual trades that pay pretty well Young people these days after graduating from college prefer the more academic professions
Many junior colleges offer courses in the manual trades. The opportunities are there still. It just needs the will to make the effort
There is an actual shortage in such trades as welders, carpenters, bricklayers, roofers the manual trades that pay pretty well Young people these days after graduating from college prefer the more academic professions
Many junior colleges offer courses in the manual trades. The opportunities are there still. It just needs the will to make the effort
Last edited by scrubbedexpat091; Dec 12th 2019 at 4:34 am.
Dec 12th 2019, 4:39 am
#1553
Banned
Joined: Dec 2015
Location: california
Posts: 6,035
Re: 2020 Election
[QUOTE=johnwoo;12777459]
"The pulled myself up by my bootstraps" is laughable.
He and I grew up in post war Britain at a time when There were manufacturing jobs a plenty. A thriving economy. An automobile industry, Aircraft, commercial vehicles, motor cycles, steel, shipbuilding. Consumer products stamped "Made in England" Even British Television and Radios.
"The history of unemployment in the UK is central to both the economic and social history of the country."The 1950s and 1960s saw a very low rate of unemployment (around 3 per cent on average) as a result of the "postwar boom".
https://www.politics.co.uk/reference/unemployment
So you think that everyone was just peachy in those days do you Mr Woo? ha ha ha ! I can remember a. few people in the council estate I lived on standing outside their houses in the street with their furniture piled on the lawn. Couldn't pay the rent. Evicted and with kids. . Factory workers in some places in Sheffield were still living in Victorian "two ups and two downs" Retired miners were coughing up their insides with black lung. the air was full of smoke from the chimneys. Luckily the winds blew it away sometimes otherwise we'd all have been suffering from breathing disorders. The river Don which ran through part of the city was bright yellow from all the chemicals that were dumped in it from the factories. There were some bright moments. Our first TV set, a 17 inch screen Pye in 1954. Dad could never afford a car though. He got his first a second hand Morris Minor after we moved down south a few years later. I worked my balls off in 3 jobs to buy my first motor bike a brand new Triumph. Class distinction was alive and well. Ever bothered to read "Room at the top" or "Saturday night and Sunday morning" Joe Lampton and his pathetic attempts for acceptance in the "upper crusts" . Arthur Seaton trapped in the grinding world of mean streets and houses and a soul killing job. Very much a portrait of industrial Britain and the common man in the 1950s
Considering that I spent 16 years of my early life in those unhealthy environs I see myself as akin to the survival rat that developed an immune system which enabled it to remain strong and healthy in spite of.
Time to take off those rose colored specs man ! !
"The pulled myself up by my bootstraps" is laughable.
He and I grew up in post war Britain at a time when There were manufacturing jobs a plenty. A thriving economy. An automobile industry, Aircraft, commercial vehicles, motor cycles, steel, shipbuilding. Consumer products stamped "Made in England" Even British Television and Radios.
"The history of unemployment in the UK is central to both the economic and social history of the country."The 1950s and 1960s saw a very low rate of unemployment (around 3 per cent on average) as a result of the "postwar boom".
https://www.politics.co.uk/reference/unemployment
Considering that I spent 16 years of my early life in those unhealthy environs I see myself as akin to the survival rat that developed an immune system which enabled it to remain strong and healthy in spite of.
Time to take off those rose colored specs man ! !
Last edited by dc koop; Dec 12th 2019 at 5:37 am.
Dec 12th 2019, 5:20 am
#1554
Banned
Joined: Dec 2015
Location: california
Posts: 6,035
Re: 2020 Election
Try 1000 times more opposed!
Americans will not accept being told what to do by politicians unless the plan offered is welcomed change. Zargof who means well, don't really understand America society at all. Electing Bernie Sanders would never result in a European style health care system in America. The American judicial system would definitely rule Medicare for all unconstitutional. And it's a fact that Democrats are good leaders but their voters lose focus and don't show up at mid-term elections which gives my party the chance to stop the Democrat agenda. The country need to do all it can to improve Obama care.
Americans will not accept being told what to do by politicians unless the plan offered is welcomed change. Zargof who means well, don't really understand America society at all. Electing Bernie Sanders would never result in a European style health care system in America. The American judicial system would definitely rule Medicare for all unconstitutional. And it's a fact that Democrats are good leaders but their voters lose focus and don't show up at mid-term elections which gives my party the chance to stop the Democrat agenda. The country need to do all it can to improve Obama care.
Last edited by dc koop; Dec 12th 2019 at 5:22 am.
Dec 12th 2019, 5:56 am
#1555
Banned
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,830
Re: 2020 Election
You know, you really should stop trying to talk for all Americans as you're just embarrassing yourself now. You are after all the guy who thinks Democrats really want to nominate Mike Bloomberg or Deval Patrick for President.
It's not the average American who is going to be opposed to M4A, it's going to be the money interests. Which are of course very powerful, and it's going to be hard fight no doubt.
As for unconstitutional. Article 1 Section 8 says: we're good fam.
Oh and Democrats have terrible leaders who don't fight for anything, which is why we need more uncorrupted challengers from the left to gain more influence over the Democratic party.
It's not the average American who is going to be opposed to M4A, it's going to be the money interests. Which are of course very powerful, and it's going to be hard fight no doubt.
As for unconstitutional. Article 1 Section 8 says: we're good fam.
Oh and Democrats have terrible leaders who don't fight for anything, which is why we need more uncorrupted challengers from the left to gain more influence over the Democratic party.
But this really isn't about him or just one politician. The best reasonable healthcare plan will win over voters in the 2020 election. It is the biggest most important issue most voters will look at. And in regards to how the Supreme Court will factor in you are wrong to think they can't simply wipe away anything they want. Obama Care was decided Constitutional by just 1 vote. And mostly because the Chief Justice did not want to damage the Court by being too obviously partisan. But a healthcare system that takes everyone's rights away to have private insurance would not even survive lower court scrutiny.
It's a nice dream Zargof, but it's one better suited for a more progressive country. America is a central right country. And Socialist Bernie Sanders is probably running for President a century too soon for this country. One day a Socialist will not be seen as a kin to someone derogatory like a Communist. But to Independent voters in 2020 he would be the scary guy and crazy Trump will make sure of that. Trust me, it's much better to select a moderate candidate to advance the country incrementally. To ask to much of the American voter who tend to have the attention span of a toddler is to sabotage the achievements already gained. Do you really want to have current healthcare and social security slashed by a second term by Donald Trump because you were naïve enough to believe Independent voters are socialist people like you? You need to get on board with the idea of voting for a moderate who can actually win against Trump. There are still people that blame Bernie Sanders and his supporters for not supporting Hillary Clinton in the general election. That is one reason why a lot of people don't want to even consider Sanders again. It would be bad for the Democrat party and ultimately for the country if Trump wins again.
Dec 12th 2019, 5:57 am
#1556
Banned
Joined: Dec 2015
Location: california
Posts: 6,035
Re: 2020 Election
It's not wealth envy for most, it's the simple fact wages are too low when compared to cost of living, things like housing and food are increasing in more and more city's far faster then rent.
Trades are great if you have the ability to do a trade, not everyone has that ability, trades at least here require a fair amount of schooling, so trades are not a way out of going to school, just a different form of schooling, but you still need the resources to attend, not everyone has those resources, government loans come nowhere close to funding education + living expenses, and many programs are more than full-time and no chance of passing if also working full-time.
I'd gladly do lineman job, but I am not qualified, and I am just not good enough at physics and math, its not exactly an entry level job anyone can do, need to know some basic stuff and abilities.
Luck and who you know plays a large role in getting good jobs, ever heard that saying "its not what you know, it's who you know." I have applied for hundreds of jobs over the years that paid well, no amount of hard work or effort ever paid off, hard work doesn't lead to high pay, no matter what some want to think.
Trades are great if you have the ability to do a trade, not everyone has that ability, trades at least here require a fair amount of schooling, so trades are not a way out of going to school, just a different form of schooling, but you still need the resources to attend, not everyone has those resources, government loans come nowhere close to funding education + living expenses, and many programs are more than full-time and no chance of passing if also working full-time.
I'd gladly do lineman job, but I am not qualified, and I am just not good enough at physics and math, its not exactly an entry level job anyone can do, need to know some basic stuff and abilities.
Luck and who you know plays a large role in getting good jobs, ever heard that saying "its not what you know, it's who you know." I have applied for hundreds of jobs over the years that paid well, no amount of hard work or effort ever paid off, hard work doesn't lead to high pay, no matter what some want to think.
Last edited by dc koop; Dec 12th 2019 at 6:00 am.
Dec 12th 2019, 6:24 am
#1559
Banned
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,830
Re: 2020 Election
Democrats are good leaders you say? 60,000 living on the streets in LA alone. I'm not saying it's entirely their fault since California has become the place of choice for the homeless refuse from many other States but declaring LA a sanctuary city on top of that with thousands of less than dependent self supporting illegals hasn't helped matters either. While city government suffers from chronic inertia, private enterprise has stepped in to start some program for providing housing. Democrat government from the top down is presiding over the "slum-ification" not only of the Golden State but of Oregon and Washington also.