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Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

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Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

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Old May 24th 2013 | 2:03 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by notacontrathinker

But it has nothing to do with printing presses and and using the output to pay Government bills.
Are you being deliberately difficult?

The "printing press" is an analogy. Effectively they are creating money out of nothing, but they do it on a computer rather than by printing it

Of course we should be worried about it. QE increases inflation i.e. the cost of things while wages, pensions and savings remain the same, or fall relatively, so everything gets more expensive

The people who benefit are those with lots of debt, as QE keeps the cost of debt at low levels. Basically people with savings suffer as they are funding people to have cheap credit
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:08 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

[QUOTE=notacontrathinker;10722704]'Quantative Easing' AKA 'Printing Money' actually has nothing to do with printing presses. If it did it would take the whole of Eddie Izzard's fleet of trucks to move the billions around !

So that's why the UK economy can't get back on track Eddie Izzard is under cutting Eddie Stobbart what a nasty man he is
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:08 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Sorry couldn't resist
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:11 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by cricketman
Hmm, the US is busy printing lots of money, to the tune of $30 billion per month

Yet as we know, their welfare state is minimal. Is that not a hole in your argument?
I didn't mention the US, you did. But it's a good example, so I'll play along:

From what I understand, the most obvious difference between their welfare system and Spain's is that it's not obligatory to have health insurance in the US (yet). But few people like you realise that it's also illegal for public hospitals to refuse treatment on the basis of ability to pay. That's the problem, actually, billions are spent treating people with no ability to pay for it. That's what Obamacare sought to solve - until the republicans whittled it down into a piece of junk legislation.

Anyway, unemployed Americans receive basic unemployment benefits for some period of time (like Spain - and paltry, like Spain), welfare housing and food stamps and many similar benefits programs are also available, albeit not terribly generous, otherwise they could end up like us - paying a lot more tax, receiving little for it - and generally, economic stagnation - sound familiar?

Yet... (and here's the difference)

US taxation is a mere fraction of ours : income tax, VAT, energy taxes, etc, and frankly, more of the population actually pays tax in the US, AND most don't have nearly the aversion to paying it that we do.

Europeans are far more prolific adopters of tax avoidance schemes than Americans - Europeans don't have to be rich to have plenty of motivation to engage in tax avoidance or even evasion (many average Europeans demonstrably avoid tax at every opportunity), so tax collection is just more effective in the US. History shows that tax receipts increase when taxes are lower, because people are making more money and spending more money - and paying taxes on all of it, rather than making less, spending less, and necessarily doing everything to avoid paying tax.

Cost of living is lower in the US (and please don't waste your google bandwidth comparing costs of living in Manhattan or Beverly Hills with rural areas around Oviedo), standard of living is generally higher for the majority of Americans than it is for Europeans. I also find it curious that their current unemployment crisis of 7.8% is, by their standards, the worst since the great depression, whilst 27% here is the worst since what, 20 years? I'm not sure if it's the highest ever.

Lastly, why is it that despite being impoverished and zero health care, that Americans consistently exhibit very good health - every American I've ever known appears happy and healthy (e.g., I just read that Americans now have the lowest percentage of smokers per capita in the world).

And what is it with their teeth? Seems they consistently have excellent dental health. How is that possible if they have no health care?

On second thought, perhaps the US wasn't a very good example for you to bring up. If you want to start a pissing match, going into it blindly isn't particularly advisable.
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:14 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

[QUOTE=bobd22;10722743]
Originally Posted by notacontrathinker
'Quantative Easing' AKA 'Printing Money' actually has nothing to do with printing presses. If it did it would take the whole of Eddie Izzard's fleet of trucks to move the billions around !

So that's why the UK economy can't get back on track Eddie Izzard is under cutting Eddie Stobbart what a nasty man he is
and I thought Eddie Stobbart''s main rival was Norbert Dentressangle


but in these difficult times it is a good thing to own Southend Airport when you need to catch a plane to the villa in Spain
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:19 am
  #96  
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by amideislas
I didn't mention the US, you did. But it's a good example, so I'll play along:

From what I understand, the most obvious difference between their welfare system and Spain's is that it's not obligatory to have health insurance in the US (yet). But few people like you realise that it's also illegal for public hospitals to refuse treatment on the basis of ability to pay. That's the problem, actually, billions are spent treating people with no ability to pay for it. That's what Obamacare sought to solve - until the republicans whittled it down into a piece of junk legislation.

Anyway, unemployed Americans receive basic unemployment benefits for some period of time (like Spain - and paltry, like Spain), welfare housing and food stamps and many similar benefits programs are also available, albeit not terribly generous, otherwise they could end up like us - paying a lot more tax, receiving little for it - and generally, economic stagnation - sound familiar?

Yet... (and here's the difference)

US taxation is a mere fraction of ours : income tax, VAT, energy taxes, etc, and frankly, more of the population actually pays tax in the US, AND most don't have nearly the aversion to paying it that we do.

Europeans are far more prolific adopters of tax avoidance schemes than Americans - Europeans don't have to be rich to have plenty of motivation to engage in tax avoidance or even evasion (many average Europeans demonstrably avoid tax at every opportunity), so tax collection is just more effective in the US. History shows that tax receipts increase when taxes are lower, because people are making more money and spending more money - and paying taxes on all of it, rather than making less, spending less, and necessarily doing everything to avoid paying tax.

Cost of living is lower in the US (and please don't waste your google bandwidth comparing costs of living in Manhattan or Beverly Hills with rural areas around Oviedo), standard of living is generally higher for the majority of Americans than it is for Europeans. I also find it curious that their current unemployment crisis of 7.8% is, by their standards, the worst since the great depression, whilst 27% here is the worst since what, 20 years? I'm not sure if it's the highest ever.

Lastly, why is it that despite being impoverished and zero health care, that Americans consistently exhibit very good health - every American I've ever known appears happy and healthy (e.g., I just read that Americans now have the lowest percentage of smokers per capita in the world).

And what is it with their teeth? Seems they consistently have excellent dental health. How is that possible if they have no health care?

On second thought, perhaps the US wasn't a very good example for you to bring up. If you want to start a pissing match, going into it blindly isn't particularly advisable.
You are correct, I shouldnt have brought up the US because almost everything you have written here is incorrect and can be proved to be so quite easily - but I can't be bothered
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:21 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by cricketman
Are you being deliberately difficult?

The "printing press" is an analogy. Effectively they are creating money out of nothing, but they do it on a computer rather than by printing it

Of course we should be worried about it. QE increases inflation i.e. the cost of things while wages, pensions and savings remain the same, or fall relatively, so everything gets more expensive

The people who benefit are those with lots of debt, as QE keeps the cost of debt at low levels. Basically people with savings suffer as they are funding people to have cheap credit
This is where you are wrong ! You are confusing wealth with money. No extra wealth (Bonds + Money) is created.

That's where you go wrong on your $30 billion a month QE in the US. It is not extra spending by the Government.
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:25 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by bobd22
Originally Posted by notacontrathinker
'Quantative Easing' AKA 'Printing Money' actually has nothing to do with printing presses. If it did it would take the whole of Eddie Izzard's fleet of trucks to move the billions around !
So that's why the UK economy can't get back on track Eddie Izzard is under cutting Eddie Stobbart what a nasty man he is
Curse you, Google Predictive Text !

 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:26 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by notacontrathinker
Curse you, Google Predictive Text !

Sorry happens to us all lol
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:28 am
  #100  
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by cricketman
You are correct, I shouldnt have brought up the US because almost everything you have written here is incorrect and can be proved to be so quite easily - but I can't be bothered
It is true about the teeth though.

I watched a programme asking Americans what they thought about British teeth, most said horrible and yellow, and with that you can bung in a lot of Spanish gnashers too, missing horrible and yellow.

Lots of people are born with delicate teeth and uneven, and they seem to stay that way, whereas in the US they do seem to have much brighter smiles, and the people they surveyed all had a lovely set of teeth.

I think any TV crew in Spain or UK would be hard pressed to find such fine examples of pearlie whites that were so common in the US.
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 2:54 am
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by amideislas

And what is it with their teeth? Seems they consistently have excellent dental health. How is that possible if they have no health care?
I'm sure a mouthful of pearly white knashers is better than some yellow set, but I think some of them look equally ridiculous with a mouthful of glowing white teeth, far whiter than you would ever see naturally. And that's the same for UK, US or wherever. Especially set in between those pumped up lips the female stars seem to favour nowadays.
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 3:00 am
  #102  
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by agoreira
I'm sure a mouthful of pearly white knashers is better than some yellow set, but I think some of them look equally ridiculous with a mouthful of glowing white teeth, far whiter than you would ever see naturally. And that's the same for UK, US or wherever. Especially set in between those pumped up lips the female stars seem to favour nowadays.
Some look like high gloss units fitted by Schrieber...........but still better than the alternative, ie Tom Cruise before and after being veneering to within an inch of his life.

 
Old May 24th 2013 | 4:10 am
  #103  
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Originally Posted by me me
It is true about the teeth though.

I watched a programme asking Americans what they thought about British teeth, most said horrible and yellow, and with that you can bung in a lot of Spanish gnashers too, missing horrible and yellow.

Lots of people are born with delicate teeth and uneven, and they seem to stay that way, whereas in the US they do seem to have much brighter smiles, and the people they surveyed all had a lovely set of teeth.

I think any TV crew in Spain or UK would be hard pressed to find such fine examples of pearlie whites that were so common in the US.

You've never watched those Redneck Moonshiners in the TV Documentary series then ?

They'd make those hillbilly horrors out of Deliverance look like model material by comparison.
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 4:18 am
  #104  
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

I've got a friend who is working in Washington and he went to the dentist to have a couple of fillings replaced. The dentist checked him out and quoted 35,000 dollars. And that's absolutely true.
 
Old May 24th 2013 | 5:10 am
  #105  
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Default Re: Spain's insolvent - get your money out!

Doesn't sound possible! After the Dentist from hell in Spain ruined my teeth I got quotes and decided to have the work done in the US. whilst on holiday. I paid $2000 less than quoted in Spain.




http://www.boynton-beach-dentist.com...beach-florida/

Last edited by jackytoo; May 24th 2013 at 5:19 am.
 


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