NataHH

Just give border control an incentive like a bonus or some other monetary reward. Perhaps they will wake up and check entry and exit documents more thoroughly.

Red Eric

I still don't see why there's any relevance to it or why there appears to be this sense of grievance about the fact that the 2 operate vastly different regimes. I thought the point of Brexit was not being part of an arrangement whereby agreements were made multilaterally, so that the UK could act better in tailoring things to suit its own requirements. Surely this is just an example of that newfound ability to act unilaterally? Would reintroduction of reciprocity by the back door not be a betrayal of the Brexit vote?

Whatever has driven it, it must have been the at the UK's behest, since we were always told we held all the cards. I can't personally see any particular reason why the UK would want to complicate matters by having multiple regimes in place, each according to a bilateral agreement struck with an individual country.

rbs_gb

This is the number of UK Nationals expelled from or refused entry to the various EU member states in 2022
Belgium : 55, Bulgaria : 5, Czechia : 15, Denmark : 40, German : 30, Estonia : 5, Ireland : 0, Greece : 20, Spain : 0, France : 75, Croatia : 10, Italy : 0, Cyprus : 5, Latvia : 60, Lithuania : 20, Luxemborg : 0, Hungary : 0, Malta : 65, Netherlands : 355, Austria : 5, Poland : 20, Portugal : 0, Romania : 25, Slovenia : 0, Slovakia : 0, Finland : 45, Sweden : 375

Red Eric

I don't think they have to be particularly undesirable in order to fall foul of UK border control. Some may be, of course but there may well be plenty of others who simply fail to convince a border agent that they are entering for the sole purpose of tourism (or possibly study, if they're holding a visa for that).

Lou71

I doubt many EU nationals are interested in taking extended holidays in the UK. They might be interested in working in the UK but not six month holidays.

EES/ETIAS is not something that Schengen members are going to be able to opt out of. It's an integrated system that will register third country entry/exit from all participating states and the days of people slipping through the net and being 'let off' will be over unless there are extenuating circumstances like illness for example.

Interestingly, the UK had a lot of input and influence with setting up the EES/ETIAS scheme and the UK government were hugely in favour of it.

Stingychips

Someone told me the that Alicante border control is that laid back , you could show them a picture of Jesus Christ and they would still wave you through lol.

Stingychips

They can’t track people coming in and out of the massive schengen zone in real time. That’s why they have stamps. It’s a huge area and would require a good system to be able to do that. Hence the reason it keeps getting put off. Nice idea. But massively ambitious to try and track every single person coming in and out of All those EU countries in live time. For now , Europe has a full scale war in the east it needs to deal with.

Stingychips

how many years have you been talking about this ETIAS.

rbs_gb

I agree with you that ETIAS is ambitious and the whole idea of doing electronic facial recognition at EVERY point of entry in the EU seems massive.

Where I can't agree with you is "That's why we have stamps". Just think, in 2022 the UK border control refused entry to nearly 7000 travellers arriving just from Romania alone. Do you honestly think that was because of stamps in passports? If Border Control had to manually check EVERYONE entering into the UK via a system of looking at passport stamps, you'd be the first to complain that it took you hours or days to get through passport control. The API system forewarns border control of who is arriving so they can meet them at arrival (or departure if required). Passport control is more about checking you are who you say you are, rather than how many days you've stayed, and I suggest is more about creating a mind set that our borders are secure..

EDIT: If you think that stamps are bring checked at borders, tell me how e-Gates do it!

Stingychips

They can’t check how long someone has been in the schengen zone if all the systems are not linked. You could enter the schengen through France and leave through Spain. Spanish know it’s pointless trying to enforce. That’s why they are half hearted about doing it .

rbs_gb

So you now make the argument in favour of why ETIAS is necessary. And how do you reply to the eGates point?

Lou71

The whole point of EES/ETIAS is that it will be an integrated, joined up system so that they can check all Schengen entries and exits. It's a huge undertaking and they need to get it right, that is why it is taking a long time to set it up.

It's not going to be your problem though is it? You told us you are applying for an Irish passport so you will not be subjected to the new system for third country nationals will you. It was well over a year ago that you told us you were applying to the FBR so you must be almost there by now and in a position to apply for your Irish passport.

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Red Eric

Is it as long as the UK government have had to think about, and failed to implement, customs controls for goods coming from the EU?

dave7777

As of 2021 there were 3.4M EU nationals living in the UK, I am sure parents, grandparents, etc would quite often take an extended holiday in the UK to visit their families.

Stingychips

FBR average waiting time is two years. Maybe in a Year I’ll get my certificate. I’m in no rush. I might use it when I’m retired. At this moment I’m only going to Spain for holidays so I’m well within my allowance.