Moving to Spain
 

My husband and 3 daughters are planning to move to Spain as soon as we sell our home in the UK.
After visiting some of the other countries pages and seen all the positive offers of encouragement and help and then to come on to the Spain one and when there are posts about people moving to Spain (some of the posts are very positive) some of the posts here only seem to discourage. Why is that?

Re: Moving to Spain
 

I would guess that most people are wanting to relocate and make a living by finding some kind of a job. Fact is there are ( virtually) no jobs.
It is unfair to raise false hopes.
Pete

Re: Moving to Spain
 

I think the discouraging posts apply mainly to people who would be intending to look for a job or start a business when they move to Spain, and the negativity relates to the fact that Spain is in deep economic crisis with unemployment over 30% in some of the areas most popular with British people (eg Andalucia), and over 50% in the case of people aged 16-25 - which is relevant if people are moving here with teenage children as their prospects will be severely limited.

Those of us who have been living here for the past few years (6 in my case) will have all seen British couples and families have to return to the UK since the recession began, some of them in dire financial circumstances, and don't think it would be helpful to encourage others to come at this time.

However, if people have established businesses that can be run from anywhere; can commute to the UK or elsewhere for work; are retired and in receipt of pensions; or early retired with enough resources to support themselves, then it's a different story. I'm in the last category (early retired) and I'm very happy here. I'm always happy to see questions from people in any of these circumstances who are thinking of moving to Spain, because it offers a great quality of life. Not perfect, nowhere is!

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Thats a good point but many expats who have survived the last few years in Spain have probably experienced what we ourselves have. Before A Place in the Sun and the EEC when work permits and visas were necessary there were a few people who came to Spain to work or retire. Then there was an influx of people in the 80s who came with their families to live and work. This has continued. Most have the same dream but the harsh reality is very different.
A few stayed but most went back to the UK...reasons: childrens education, work, the need to see and be with family in the UK, money, accommodation and pressure on the relationship.
The problem about bringing children to Spain in itself is a that however well they learn Spanish they seldom feel Spanish and they loose their cultural roots. It's a tough choice to make on their behalf and most go back.
Sorry but for those of us who have seen it time and time again we have become cynical as there are only so many bright business ideas and new bars and restaurants that can be successful.
In our experience more than half the people we know have gone back and thats probably the same for most of the forum writers.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

As the others are saying, it isn't negativity and it isnt discouragement because this is our little pot of gold at the bottom of the rainbow. More that we are trying to tell the truth rather than have people sell up and move here to find the problems are insurmountable and go running home.

I believe many people over the past 20-30 years have come here because it has been seen as a place you can just pop into like a pub or cafe and everything will be fine. But they were unrealistic and found there werent the benefits and support networks of the UK.
But even though a major part of the EU with some preferential treatment, it isnt that simple. It is a foreign country and they have their own rules and regs they have spent centuries building up (the same as the UK)

Many people have come to BE Spain wanting to just pack a bag and catch a plane, thinking they can just walk into a job, or failing that work in a bar or even pay petty cash to buy one. Life isnt like that in any country.

All I would say to you is - how would you make the move, live, work, converse, play and learn if you went to another country that is on the BE country list. Some English is the main language but others it is second or even third and you may well spend all your time in an Expat Enclave. Read the Italy thread about the problems of living there.
It seems to make good press to write about the number of people returning from Spain - but similar numbers return from Oz!.

There is one hell of a lot of knowledge and experience available here at BE Spain, gained over many years - much of it is in the back file of the site.
But England with sun it isnt - Right now it has been raining almost continuously for 2 days, the temp is around 12c and it is only going to get worse.

I wish you well and look forward to you returning to discuss the options with those nice people at BE Spain.
kind regards

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Just believe the positive posts, the one's that tell you what you want to hear, and ignore all the negativity. Your post is unfortunately no different to many others that come here seeking advice, the replies are not what they want to hear. People offer the advice to hopefully save you making the same expensive mistake as thousands of others that have headed back to UK. If you have no kids, don't need a job, have plenty of money, it could well work, otherwise it'll be an uphill struggle. But you're free to ignore all the advice, it's is only that, advice.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Also now Spain has become very strict with its residencia requirements. You must prove an income and healthcare provision before you can become an official resident.

It is a harsh country and the days of "living the dream" are over. I guess the negativity is simply making sure folks realise that. But it is nice when folk have an independent income, no commitments and move over, they at least will spend in Spain and help the faltering economy a bit.

Jo xxx

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Thank you for all your comments, and I appreciate all your feedback. Money is not so much of an object, just really wanted some other types of advice if necessary.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Good luck with the move, where abouts in Spain will you be moving to ?

We have been here 9 years, our kids were 4 and 8 they picked up the Spanish well at school, but I am ashamed to say I still struggle a bit !

One thing we didn't realise was that in the area where we moved to ( inland of Alicante ) was that in school the kids are taught in Valenciano as well as Spanish.

Cheers Tony

Re: Moving to Spain
 

No jobs,no future,no confidence,very little help if you are in trouble here,minefield of paperwork,severe cutbacks,inflation,prices going up,cuts in all services,health,generic medicines prescriptions,corruption on a large scale,robberies,break ins,poor support and very long waiting lists for medical treatment on the spanish social security system,people begging for food,raiding wheelie bins in the town centres and supermarkets because they have lost their jobs and their home(middle class people!),it very sad to see,plus many suicides now.

Spain is a lovely country,people are very welcoming,BUT,a lot has changed here since the economic crisis,i came here 2006 it was ok then but now,forget it unless you have pots of money and are finacially independant,reality hurts,but that the way it is.

If you have done your homework and research which you MUST do its a no brainer coming to spain to live,people expats are flooding back to the uk a lot cannot sell their homes,or if they can losing 50-60% loss,so either the banks are repossesing their homes or they are just locking up their villas going back uk.also from france,so you now have the answer to your question (why people are discouraging you!).

Unfortunately its not anymore just about SUN,SEA,BLUE SKIES & SANGRIA,unless you are well off!

paris

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Hi madlass,

you say you are planning to move; why to Spain? what do you want from life? What are you hoping to get here that is better than the UK? It can work - BUT you need to be clear on your objectives and methodology.

I enjoy my life here - and have done so for nearly ten years; but my lifestyle is nowhere near what I predicted it would be. It has worked for me, or I have made it work for me more realistically.

Davexf

Re: Moving to Spain
 

we are planning a move to Spain end of 2013. and in our mid fifties, however I will be in receipt of a NHS pension plus we will have rental income, and a minimum of 2/3 years full funding in the bank, including private healthcare cover and we will own our own home.

we are moving because we wish to experience something different while we can, and anticipate that it is not going to be easy. But we have done our sums and still know we Will have got it wrong:eek: However if we had children, had to seek work, pay rent/mortgage etc i would not leave the UK for Spain. I suppose what I am saying is, even with our financial status IE fairly independent - not rich - but in a more fortunate position than some - we are still taking a risk but we are are taking that risk as fully informed as we can be and accepting of any outcomes . As an aside we are also taking Spanish lessons, I am studying for exams in Spanish.

Having said all of that if you can realise your dreams, having accepted all the associated risks then who am I to give advice, as i like you am still in the UK
best wishes:thumbsup:

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Good luck with the move.

You are right, it is better to try something ( even if it dose not work out )
than live the rest of your life thinking what if ?

Some good things I can think of about spain are

1 SUN
2 BLUE SKY
3 CHEEP BOOZE
4 CHEEP PROPERTY ( you can own a detached house with a pool and land for less than the price of a semi in the uk )

Tony

Re: Moving to Spain
 

To some extent I agree with both of you, you have to be prepared. Its no use planning such a big life changing event the same way as you would a week's holiday to Bournemouth.
OK if you are 20, want the life of a beach bum with nothing but a change of clothes and a surfboard, but bringing out young children whose lives could be irreparably damaged to the uncertainty, the potential massive rows tween husband and wife and possibility of divorce over this is not on.

However, Tony, considering I have a nice 3 bed semi on the edge of East Anglia/East Midlands which is now being rented out due to IMO the stupid price I was offered for it, £100k, exactly where are all these cheap detached houses with a pool and land for less than the price of a semi in the uk??

In our current search have found some very nice places, but always there is negative side heavily outweighing the positives.
One (English) couple tried to sell us their house on the side of a hill for a profit on what they bought it for 5 years ago (hearsay evidence indicates they have been trying to sell it since they bought it) and wouldnt drop the price.
Another (English) couple told us they wanted €200k for their (very nice) place when it is being advertised by a Spanish agent for €175k.

But we do have a tight spec, certain needs, including location and I suppose it is our fault........

Re: Moving to Spain
 

....But if you're not obsessed with the weather and cheap drink doesn't bother you, it doesn't have a lot going for it at the moment does it??

Re: Moving to Spain
 

not bothered about cheap booze, though I have to admit I feel better when the sun's shining

Spain's my home though, for all its faults & undeniable problems

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Yet we love living here. Amazing isnt it!

I recently had some visitors from the UK up here in Oviedo and they couldnt belive it. They said they saw no signs of a recession and there was a lot more life in the shops and bars than in the UK

There were expecting to see what they report on the UK news, empty bars and people begging for food

If you only see Spain as sun and cheap drink then you really shouldnt move to Spain

Re: Moving to Spain
 

agree

for us to cheap booze has not even appeared on our wish list.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

I think that was a tongue in cheek comment, otherwise why would you be here - or are you packing your bags ? ? :)

There are positives and negatives of living in any country, even the UK.

For me Spain seems to be more at ease with itself than the UK, yes it has problems, there can't be many places left that don't, despite the trumpeting of surveys on this and surveys on that. The only people that may be making money must be the ones publishing the surveys :frown:

Yes there is plenty of cheap booze - but you soon find it is the stuff the locals will add lemonade to. But good quality booze is available at a lower price than in the tax sodden UK.
But overall the value for your hard earned across the board seems to be heavily on the side of Spain.
:thumbsup:

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Hi OK our semi was on the out skirts of London so the value was a bit more,

However look at www.fabfincas.com there are some quite cheap properties
in the 100 to 200 thousand euro range

My kids were quite young when we moved out, it was hard for them at first but now both of them love Spain and the way of life

I can think back to when I was in the uk looking at some of the teenagers with their bad attitude and lack of respect, and am now glad my kids are in Spain where they have respect for their elders and seem to be able to grow up at a slower pace and enjoy their child hood


Cheers Tony

Re: Moving to Spain
 

I've got a question now for Paris Hilton:: If Spain is that BAD when are you moving back to the UK? It must be such a dreadful life for you over there :blink:
Your comment is exactly what I am talking about when I say about the lack of encouragement for people moving to Spain. Maybe you just want it all for yourself :rofl:
Seeing as you see the bad things first hand then maybe positive comments would be better so that when people do move then they are more equipped to deal with the things that are thrown at them. Just a thought.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

I am not obsessed with cheap booze or the weather and I am managing on an extremely low income, in an ordinary townhouse, in an ordinary town.

The most important thing that Spain has going for it is the people, for me they are the friendliest, warmest and most caring people that I have ever lived amongst so to my way of thinking Spain is rich in the best way possible.

Rosemary

Re: Moving to Spain
 

I have always found the Spanish people OK, but ditto in UK as well. Not sure where you came from, but a lot of people have moved from cities to some one horse town/village where people always will have more time for each other. I doubt you'd find any difference in any large European city, people just don't have time for each other, and village life anywhere is always much more relaxed, much friendlier. Here in UK, I don't live anywhere near a large city and I couldn't wish for better neighbours, people are so friendly. I often wonder what sort of area some of you came from in UK where everyone was so unfriendly.:confused: As as an avid reader of the Spanish press, I can assure you Brits are not universally loved by all the Spanish, indeed quite the reverse. It's an eye opener reading the forums, the comments sections etc.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

I did not say that people were unfriendly in the places that I have lived in the UK.

Rosemary

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Hi Madlass.

I think the problem is that some people feel trapped in Spain because they cant sell their properties.

But if you are intending to buy I think its a great time as house prices are so low, you can even go straight to the banks and buy cheap repositions

Is a buyers market !!!

Tony

Re: Moving to Spain
 

I've yet to see a cheap bank owned property that I would like to live in. They are still very much the worst properties on the market

Re: Moving to Spain
 

That's very much the case for friends of ours across the border in Portugal. Went out to live the dream, ended up the wife absolutely hates it (hubby doesn't mind it!) and can't wait to head back to UK. But they are trapped, need to sell to buy back in UK, but not a hope in hell of selling at the moment despite being on the market nearly 2 years. Hardly any viewings, and just one offer, nearly 50% below the asking price!

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Yes maybe for new comers to Spain it would be better to rent for a while so they could get an idea if they like it enough to buy.

Cheers Tony

Re: Moving to Spain
 

We moved here nearly 4 years ago with our young children, it has not been easy but we have received lots of help from the people in the town, we have learnt to go with the flow, live with the paperwork and slow down living life at a slower pace. The children were young enough to pick up the language and are doing well, but it was hard work and stressful in the first 6/9 months of them being in school. We also had a contingency fund for if income dried up which happened when the work my husband was promised in the UK dried up. Life is slower and more relaxed, the children are thriving, we tackle each situation as it comes along remembering that we chose to live here, sometimes things are frustrating but this is the way Spain does things, I think the world is going to be a very different place in 8 years time when my oldest leaves university, which I hope she wants to do we can plan for that making sure she has good grades and a good work ethic, which is exactly what we would do if we were in the UK. Plan well, depending on the age of your children factor in international school fees and be prepared for the challenging experience but do be cautious, if I was doing it again I would rent my house in the UK and rent a house here as a lifeline because when things went haywire for us I did feel scared and trapped until it was all sorted out.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

As someone said, moving to Spain is fine if you have an income but it's suicide for young families. Unemployment figures out today show another rise fo the third quarter (usually a time when it drops slightly) Nationally unemployment is now 25.2% but in Andalucia it's 35.42%:eek: Youth unemployment is over 52%. Not the place to consider if concerned about your childrens future!

Re: Moving to Spain
 

and many forget the other part that goes with young families, relationships.

living the dream is fine to get a large house on a large property up an unmade track, sometimes at 45degs slope, when you light the fire and send smoke signals to your nearest neighbour. But when you have to get the kids to the main road to be picked up by the bus, meet them when the bus drops them off, get the 4x4 out everytime they want to go anywhere, meet up with their friends, pick them up in the evening. Then there is the 2hrs plus to the airport to catch a flight, or pick up from.
this leads to strained relationships all round, something I have seen a number of times in the short time I have lived here.

come on folks whose dream and whose nightmare ??

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Then live in the middle of a city like we do. We love it!

Loads to see and do, can walk 15 minutes to anywhere, huge park next door

And five years in Spain and we both have lots of work and earning well!

Re: Moving to Spain
 

If I walk for 15 minutes I will have left the country ;)

Re: Moving to Spain
 

We live in the campo ( no mud track ) and really enjoy it.

I guess every body has their own idea of where they would like to live.

Tony

Re: Moving to Spain
 

That is why its so important to think everything through and the implications of where you live and the future when you move anywhere but more so when you move to another country far away from your family! Yes you can become mums taxi service for a few years, but equally when you are getting old and develop a health problem living in another country is also no fun, or if you have to have an operation and your family are far away its scary for you but terrifying for them this is happening with my niece at the moment her dad is here and needs surgery but she cannot get the time off, she is worried sick, he feels guilty.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Well thats us here in the UK But when we move want to be closure to village but for us that will be a big change
need new neighbours!!!!!
yep my idea of hell is a flat/apartment no outside space no views i could go on

yep this is what we have to give the biggest consideration to even though i have said i love rural/views etc we need to be thinking long term


Whats good for one is not good for another.

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Why do you have no views or outdoor space in a city? :blink:

We have five balconies and 20,000m2 of park straight out of our door. And a couple of square kms of pedestrain only city with every shop and restaurant you could ever need!

Re: Moving to Spain
 

Anyone wanting to enjoy the sun in a rural idyll is welcome to come round here and get a taste of reality!

It has rained almost incessantly for 48 hours, we've had at least four thunderstorms, the power is going on and off all the time, half the vegetable plot has been washed away or buried under mud, three of my hens have disappeared presumed drowned, I've run out of clean clothes, and its forecast to keep raining for another day at least.

I am not a happy bunny! :frown: Thank god for the cheap booze ...

Re: Moving to Spain
 

this is how bad it is...... if you don't believe us, perhaps you'll believe facts & figures from the International Press

it's still a lovely place to live if you have a decent income

but for the young there isn't much future - & if you don't have work there's little chance of finding any

my 16 year old daughter is considering returning to the UK next year to continue her education - something we never thought would happen, but the education system here is in crisis

my Spanish landlord's son (who has 3 degrees) is working as a gardener............ in Germany - after being unemployed here for 3 years

I could tell you of so many more like that

but as I said earlier - Spain is our home & we still love it

Re: Moving to Spain
 

A point that I've never seen made on here, is that an incredible one in three Spanish children go to fee paying schools - compare that to only 7% in the UK

Basically, anyone who can afford to pay for their children's education do so

There are some good completely free schools but the PP is completely squeezing the life out of them financially. I never thought I would pay for education (it is against my principals), but we are getting to the point where it would be irresponsible of us not to

As for the long term future. I dont worry about my chidrens' future at all. There are opportunities in every country, and time changes everything. The important thing is that stand out from the crowd