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Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by Jon-Bxl
(Post 7777511)
HI Mel
Now you are pushing my knowledge... My understanding The EUC are a group of people who are well known in Ayamonte and realise we are a cash cow and together they have come together to make a business of administering the common areas, cleaning it up, repairs etc. i.e the areas non ADA (or others) i.e non community + non inter community. So the verge, trees, gardens etc around the common roads etc. One could argue that the council should do this as we pay our property taxes, but that debate happened on the forum - and in the real world the EUC won. I suspect some people are getting richer as a result, but they are doing a service around CE. How good it is we'll see, and the value for money we'll see, but there are brand new cars with EUC on them and people working on the development... so it all has a veneer. I dont see an EUC equivalent around e.g Isla Canela, and apparentely it was Fadesa's responsibility for 14 years before they went bust. I dont think we can eventually claim back that money from them as part of the admin process however, so we pay. How we will receive our bills is interesting - what is also interesting is that they made these investments in people and vehicles ec well in advance (several months so) of billing - so I dont know where they got the money from, up front. Ive heard all sorts of rumours - but I am expecting to pay something like 20-25 a month for this - for a 3 bed appt. Ive heard much higher prices, so well see.... I'm suspicious of all this and hope that all the money put in by us - is actually used as it should be. We'll see...... That's about all I know, and I could have all this wrong, so if somebody out there knows better, please advise Thanks and regards Jon PS cant wait to see that donkey+calf! |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
When I was in CE in early July the Security in the car had stopped work due to non payment, although the gardeners were still working.
The story I heard was that the EUC admin company had not paid the people they had contracted to do the work. Hardly surprising given that they had not had any income from us with which to pay them. Hopefully some one can update us on this. |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Thanks so much for the replies. Yes, I was thinking who, what, how, where did the EUC get the money from to start up. Whilst we have not paid anything it is a mystery............did the Mayor, "council" ?? pay and if it was administered then by whom ? Not ADA so is there another admin company ?
I really don't want to have to be paying another lot of fees but accept that, to keep CE well maintained, we have to do so and trust they will be reasonable. Anybody on here know Steve Tipper and can he be approached to explain the system to us and the additional cost. I sincerely hope nobody will ask me to pay for vans (and the sign-writing on them) which are left on the verges doing nothing. I trust also we are not going to have a shock back-payment charge from ....whoever ? Please folks don't feel you have to reply as I am on my soap-box but if anybody can give a full explanation to us all...where are you Steve Tipper ?.....that would give some peace of mind. All the best Mel |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by MEL & JOHN
(Post 7778259)
Thanks so much for the replies. Yes, I was thinking who, what, how, where did the EUC get the money from to start up. Whilst we have not paid anything it is a mystery............did the Mayor, "council" ?? pay and if it was administered then by whom ? Not ADA so is there another admin company ?
I really don't want to have to be paying another lot of fees but accept that, to keep CE well maintained, we have to do so and trust they will be reasonable. Anybody on here know Steve Tipper and can he be approached to explain the system to us and the additional cost. I sincerely hope nobody will ask me to pay for vans (and the sign-writing on them) which are left on the verges doing nothing. I trust also we are not going to have a shock back-payment charge from ....whoever ? Please folks don't feel you have to reply as I am on my soap-box but if anybody can give a full explanation to us all...where are you Steve Tipper ?.....that would give some peace of mind. All the best Mel I am sure it is legal, but my suspicions remain that there are a bunch of people milking the 'rich Brits' who are never there. I am also not happy that the EUC meetings take place in Spanish - with no translator in real time, and Steve Tipper does not speak Spanish, or so Im told. So it hard for him to really preside over the meeting. He is always there, but if he doesnt fully understand the discussion - its hard to help. Also if the audience are not fluent then its no use being there. Advantage can be taken if, hypothetically, there are some unscrupulous people there. The ADA meetings CE wide are bi-lingual and I've already asked through my Manzana that we insist on bilingual meetings for EUC - both apply to all the residents. Sure its Spain, but we are the people paying and the large majority are Brits - so I think we should vote that in. In fact I recommend that each person insists on this and that this one thing is made a rule - so that we can have our president fully involved and the audience able to partake. Please contact your president(s) Its our dosh - we have the right to this - if we want to protect our money!!! Regards Jon PS Mel Steve sent an email out CE wide - but I couldnt find it, otherwise I would PM you his email address - sorry. If anybody else has a better filing system than me please can you PM us - thanks |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
EUC
John & Cath are correct. The EUC is legal, and established. The President is the Mayor of Ayamonte, and Steven Tipper (President of the VISTA ESURI Inter Community (ie RAGO 2)), is a member. The EUC has engaged a contractor (Confit Servi) to look after Security, and to do whatever gardening and repair work that is needed, on those areas of Costa Esuri that are outside the individual Community and Inter-Community Areas. My understanding is that the funding for this contract is currently being provided by the Ayamonte Council, and will be recovered from Costa Esuri residents via a supplement to their local authority tax. This size of the supplement will be proportional to the rateable value of their property, be this a villa, house, apartment, or plot. I also understand that this could be 20€ approx per month or thereabouts. I don't think Mel & John need to be quite as pessimistic about the misuse of funds. Steve Tipper has the sort of personality which will ensure that our interests are being fully looked after, and he will not allow his lack of Spanish to be exploited (In any event, his wife is fully conversant in Spanish). I also believe that it is very incorrect to say that the "large majority" of CE residents are Brits. In any case, the Spanish are just as keen as the Brits with regard to ensuring value for money. Its time we started regarding the Spanish as being with us, rather than being in a separate camp. It would also appear that some people are unaware of their obligations to pay local authority taxes. All CE owners are liable for such a tax. In Spanish law, it is the responsibility of the individual to ensure that the tax is paid; its not acceptable to try and blame the local authority for not seeking it in the first place. Furthermore, there is a automatic penalty payment for not paying the tax on time. The close involvement of the Ayamonte Council with CE means that it will not take then long to find out who is paying and who is not. Whether or not we should be paying this supplement, additional to the normal local authority tax, is a debateable point. However, if the amount involved remains as low as is currently predicted, then the benefit of ensuring that the general standards at CE remain at their current level, thereby helping to preserve the value of individual properties, makes its payment a worthwhile investment. Taff |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by CAROL TAFF
(Post 7780692)
EUC
John & Cath are correct. The EUC is legal, and established. The President is the Mayor of Ayamonte, and Steven Tipper (President of the VISTA ESURI Inter Community (ie RAGO 2)), is a member. The EUC has engaged a contractor (Confit Servi) to look after Security, and to do whatever gardening and repair work that is needed, on those areas of Costa Esuri that are outside the individual Community and Inter-Community Areas. My understanding is that the funding for this contract is currently being provided by the Ayamonte Council, and will be recovered from Costa Esuri residents via a supplement to their local authority tax. This size of the supplement will be proportional to the rateable value of their property, be this a villa, house, apartment, or plot. I also understand that this could be 20€ approx per month or thereabouts. I don't think Mel & John need to be quite as pessimistic about the misuse of funds. Steve Tipper has the sort of personality which will ensure that our interests are being fully looked after, and he will not allow his lack of Spanish to be exploited (In any event, his wife is fully conversant in Spanish). I also believe that it is very incorrect to say that the "large majority" of CE residents are Brits. In any case, the Spanish are just as keen as the Brits with regard to ensuring value for money. Its time we started regarding the Spanish as being with us, rather than being in a separate camp. It would also appear that some people are unaware of their obligations to pay local authority taxes. All CE owners are liable for such a tax. In Spanish law, it is the responsibility of the individual to ensure that the tax is paid; its not acceptable to try and blame the local authority for not seeking it in the first place. Furthermore, there is a automatic penalty payment for not paying the tax on time. The close involvement of the Ayamonte Council with CE means that it will not take then long to find out who is paying and who is not. Whether or not we should be paying this supplement, additional to the normal local authority tax, is a debateable point. However, if the amount involved remains as low as is currently predicted, then the benefit of ensuring that the general standards at CE remain at their current level, thereby helping to preserve the value of individual properties, makes its payment a worthwhile investment. Taff Thanks for the detail here, please note that I am not criticising our EUC president, however whether his wife is fluent or not, I do think meetings should be bi-lingual - it does seem strange to me that he is there, as president, whilst all the discussions are going on and he cant understand them! I want to repeat, up front, that I am not criticising anyone... just trying to change the meetings themselves. Being able to understand, to make real time discussion points and have a real debate must be better - in ANY meeting, surely! The ADA meetings are bi-lingual (as are our own separate community meetings are in our Manzana) - its not at all a precedent I am asking for. I am suggesting/recommending that each Brit there pushes for it. I remain convinced this is only reasonable in this case. I dont see why there should be any problem with the EUC being bi-lingual - like the rest of them. It wasnt Mel+John that was concerned about potential misuse, it was me, and I do feel that we are a cash cow. Its for this that I want open meetings that all can understand. Sure its OK for the Spanish, who dont want to throw money away, but I want the Brits also to be able to follow the meetings, and partake in real time debate (I thought/think we were in a big majority in CE, you say I'm wrong, OK but it surprises me, Im not sure ) Great points about the council tax and also the additional payment they will ask for for the EUC - thanks. It can also be set up by Direct Debit, so one wont miss it or pay a penalty, if one is OK with the whole billing process/accuracy. Im waiting to see how much they will charge me before I make comment about the value we get. Regards Jon |
Costa Esuri - Ayamonte
Originally Posted by CAROL TAFF
(Post 7780692)
EUC
My understanding is that the funding for this contract is currently being provided by the Ayamonte Council, and will be recovered from Costa Esuri residents via a supplement to their local authority tax. This size of the supplement will be proportional to the rateable value of their property, be this a villa, house, apartment, or plot. I also understand that this could be 20€ approx per month or thereabouts. ITaff On that point,last year we paid cash for our IBI bill and set up a direct debit mandate for subsequent years. Does anyone know when the Council actually takes the money?? We should see then if anything has been tagged on. |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by shirley and anthony hide
(Post 7780957)
On that point,last year we paid cash for our IBI bill and set up a direct debit mandate for subsequent years.
Does anyone know when the Council actually takes the money?? We should see then if anything has been tagged on. Not sure about the cost being added to the IBI the EUC and the Ayuntamiento are entirley separate. The council were funding works at CE from the time when MF went into Administration before the EUC was activated. There was only one car thro April May and June and what it was supposed to do I do not know the Maxi security firm had 2 or 3 cars funded by the major builders. |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by CAROL TAFF
(Post 7780692)
EUC
John & Cath are correct. The EUC is legal, and established. The President is the Mayor of Ayamonte, and Steven Tipper (President of the VISTA ESURI Inter Community (ie RAGO 2)), is a member. The EUC has engaged a contractor (Confit Servi) to look after Security, and to do whatever gardening and repair work that is needed, on those areas of Costa Esuri that are outside the individual Community and Inter-Community Areas. My understanding is that the funding for this contract is currently being provided by the Ayamonte Council, and will be recovered from Costa Esuri residents via a supplement to their local authority tax. This size of the supplement will be proportional to the rateable value of their property, be this a villa, house, apartment, or plot. I also understand that this could be 20€ approx per month or thereabouts. I don't think Mel & John need to be quite as pessimistic about the misuse of funds. Steve Tipper has the sort of personality which will ensure that our interests are being fully looked after, and he will not allow his lack of Spanish to be exploited (In any event, his wife is fully conversant in Spanish). I also believe that it is very incorrect to say that the "large majority" of CE residents are Brits. In any case, the Spanish are just as keen as the Brits with regard to ensuring value for money. Its time we started regarding the Spanish as being with us, rather than being in a separate camp. It would also appear that some people are unaware of their obligations to pay local authority taxes. All CE owners are liable for such a tax. In Spanish law, it is the responsibility of the individual to ensure that the tax is paid; its not acceptable to try and blame the local authority for not seeking it in the first place. Furthermore, there is a automatic penalty payment for not paying the tax on time. The close involvement of the Ayamonte Council with CE means that it will not take then long to find out who is paying and who is not. Whether or not we should be paying this supplement, additional to the normal local authority tax, is a debateable point. However, if the amount involved remains as low as is currently predicted, then the benefit of ensuring that the general standards at CE remain at their current level, thereby helping to preserve the value of individual properties, makes its payment a worthwhile investment. Taff Karma sent. |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by Jon-Bxl
(Post 7780771)
Hi Taff
Thanks for the detail here, please note that I am not criticising our EUC president, however whether his wife is fluent or not, I do think meetings should be bi-lingual - it does seem strange to me that he is there, as president, whilst all the discussions are going on and he cant understand them! I want to repeat, up front, that I am not criticising anyone... just trying to change the meetings themselves. Being able to understand, to make real time discussion points and have a real debate must be better - in ANY meeting, surely! The ADA meetings are bi-lingual (as are our own separate community meetings are in our Manzana) - its not at all a precedent I am asking for. I am suggesting/recommending that each Brit there pushes for it. I remain convinced this is only reasonable in this case. I dont see why there should be any problem with the EUC being bi-lingual - like the rest of them. It wasnt Mel+John that was concerned about potential misuse, it was me, and I do feel that we are a cash cow. Its for this that I want open meetings that all can understand. Sure its OK for the Spanish, who dont want to throw money away, but I want the Brits also to be able to follow the meetings, and partake in real time debate (I thought/think we were in a big majority in CE, you say I'm wrong, OK but it surprises me, Im not sure ) Great points about the council tax and also the additional payment they will ask for for the EUC - thanks. It can also be set up by Direct Debit, so one wont miss it or pay a penalty, if one is OK with the whole billing process/accuracy. Im waiting to see how much they will charge me before I make comment about the value we get. Regards Jon Do you have anything that substantiates your claim that EUC meeting are in Spanish only? I'd assumed that they had an interpreter and were conducted in both languages, as with the Rago 2 Inter-community meetings. In any event, there has been much not exactly democratic about the way the EUC has been run so far. The installing meeting was certainly held without prior notification of all involved owners. Decisions on services and their financing appear to be made again without reference to owners. Similarly, the EUC committee was self appointed, and contrary to John and Kath's statement, I don't believe we have been invited to any meetings, nor given the capability of voting down proposals. All that said, with such a large and diverse set of owners, I think it would be impossible to run things truly democratically. I have sufficient faith in Steven Tipper (he's a member, but not the EUC president) to believe that he will ensure that the autocratic system that will run things will be sufficiently benevolent to satisfy me. Time will tell; if I feel in future that the funds required are too high in respect of the quality of service, then I may change my mind and try and do something about it. In the meantime, I will let things progress without interference. Its clear that you do pay your local authority tax. However, I got the impression from this blog that, maybe, some others don't. As such, I felt that a word of warning was warranted. Taff |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by John & Kath
(Post 7781017)
It really is an odd system you cannot pay before 1st July and it must be paid before 30th September. I left it with my bank with the instruction to pay on the 30/09/2008 and thats what they did. Tried to pay this year in June and they said no not until September.
Not sure about the cost being added to the IBI the EUC and the Ayuntamiento are entirley separate. The council were funding works at CE from the time when MF went into Administration before the EUC was activated. There was only one car thro April May and June and what it was supposed to do I do not know the Maxi security firm had 2 or 3 cars funded by the major builders. So 2 possibillities. 1) EUC forms an adhoc payment to existing IBI bill 2) EUC is completely seperate bill issued by EUC adminstrators. I am going over tomorrow so I shall try to pop into tax offiec at some stage and get copy of my bill. Might gleen something from that.Will report back later. |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by CAROL TAFF
(Post 7781062)
Hello Jon,
Do you have anything that substantiates your claim that EUC meeting are in Spanish only? I'd assumed that they had an interpreter and were conducted in both languages, as with the Rago 2 Inter-community meetings. In any event, there has been much not exactly democratic about the way the EUC has been run so far. The installing meeting was certainly held without prior notification of all involved owners. Decisions on services and their financing appear to be made again without reference to owners. Similarly, the EUC committee was self appointed, and contrary to John and Kath's statement, I don't believe we have been invited to any meetings, nor given the capability of voting down proposals. All that said, with such a large and diverse set of owners, I think it would be impossible to run things truly democratically. I have sufficient faith in Steven Tipper (he's a member, but not the EUC president) to believe that he will ensure that the autocratic system that will run things will be sufficiently benevolent to satisfy me. Time will tell; if I feel in future that the funds required are too high in respect of the quality of service, then I may change my mind and try and do something about it. In the meantime, I will let things progress without interference. Its clear that you do pay your local authority tax. However, I got the impression from this blog that, maybe, some others don't. As such, I felt that a word of warning was warranted. Taff |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Anyone who wants to contact theEUC can do so by email in English at
[email protected] this is a firm of solicitors in Huelva and is not the "EUC" or confiserv. |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Originally Posted by CAROL TAFF
(Post 7781062)
Hello Jon,
Do you have anything that substantiates your claim that EUC meeting are in Spanish only? I'd assumed that they had an interpreter and were conducted in both languages, as with the Rago 2 Inter-community meetings. In any event, there has been much not exactly democratic about the way the EUC has been run so far. The installing meeting was certainly held without prior notification of all involved owners. Decisions on services and their financing appear to be made again without reference to owners. Similarly, the EUC committee was self appointed, and contrary to John and Kath's statement, I don't believe we have been invited to any meetings, nor given the capability of voting down proposals. All that said, with such a large and diverse set of owners, I think it would be impossible to run things truly democratically. I have sufficient faith in Steven Tipper (he's a member, but not the EUC president) to believe that he will ensure that the autocratic system that will run things will be sufficiently benevolent to satisfy me. Time will tell; if I feel in future that the funds required are too high in respect of the quality of service, then I may change my mind and try and do something about it. In the meantime, I will let things progress without interference. Its clear that you do pay your local authority tax. However, I got the impression from this blog that, maybe, some others don't. As such, I felt that a word of warning was warranted. Taff Firstly in order to save any possible miscommunication, let me once again thank you for the great post you did and the information about the tax, for example, which I also thanked you for in my reply. Its this type sharing of information, from great people that take the time to do so, that has made this forum very valuable for me. Also the discussion that ensues after the kind of post that you did is very interesting for all. I'm wrong that Mr Tipper is the president, for some reason I thought he was - and I hope that it was very clear that I was in no way criticising him personally. I would never do something like that in a public forum. I cant substantiate this except to say that I know someone very well who is fluent who attends these meetings and told me that they are in Spanish only. I trust this person implicitly. Your reply actually adds meat to the discussion, to help me and some others that are reading this. (E.g. I had no idea that the EUC charge would be added to the council tax) You know more about the EUC than I do. To summarise: 1) You thought the meetings had an interpreter, so we are on the same page about bi-lingual meetings. In fact in the last meeting, I'm told, the wife of one of the members offered to do so (for a charge). I don't believe this was noted down in the minutes. I have misplaced the mail I got, but I don't recall even seeing minutes, just an overall discussion 2) I remain suspicious about the EUC, and the fact that we are a cash cow. We were in CE when the last meeting was held, that was NOT publicised, we heard by accident through this friend, and e.g actually informed John+Kath about it, who as plot owners didn't know. There's not much that they don't know about CE et al ! :) All the rest that you say about non-democratic decisions, not informing people of meetings, self appointed boards etc etc, simply underlines my suspicion about the whole thing. When I hear that its non-English, it just adds fuel to the fire, for me. Nothing is perfect as you say - and we cant expect a perfect democratic organisation for something like this. However to return to the main point that I want to make, that we agree on I think: The least we can do about this is to ensure bi-lingual meetings, with an interpreter (like all others), so that EVERYBODY, board members to the concerned owner-audience can understand what's going on and partake in the discussion. I'll pay up of course, but I want to make sure we are not setting up a system to 'line someone's pocket' ..... too much. For me, openness is key to this, and its early enough to try and make sure the system is as secure as possible. Hopefully this discussion will help us get some way there Thanks again Jon |
Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte Part 6
Why not ask a kind mod to pull all the posts about EUC out and start a specific thread for them, then there will be an easy way to search and retrieve the information instead of getting lost in this mish mash thread ?
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