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Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Old Aug 6th 2013, 4:17 pm
  #376  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

The country is still as drunk as ever, which helps when your tax dollar is being used to subsidise a failed banking industry. Cameron and his cronies refuse to stimulate the economy and are transferring more public wealth to the private sector with the impending sale of the profitable Royal Mail. This might temporarily plug a small hole in the public finances caused by Osborne's slavish adherence to the discredited economic theory of Rogoff and Rheinhart. Meanwhile, the PR machines we call daily papers mostly try and convince a gullible public nursing hangovers each morning that beneficiaries have caused the current recession and that running an economy is like running the household budget. Just a few cuts and hey-ho the books are balanced.

In short, the Anglo-Saxon disease of fleecing the public and transferring wealth into fewer and fewer hands is alive and well in the UK. Still, musn't grumble.
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Old Aug 6th 2013, 4:29 pm
  #377  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Policy remains to "privatise the profits and nationalise the debts".
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Old Aug 6th 2013, 4:52 pm
  #378  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Quiet you in Scotland. Just hand over whisky and oil, ok? London knows best.
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Old Aug 6th 2013, 5:08 pm
  #379  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Kiwi Ex-pat View Post
Quiet you in Scotland. Just hand over whisky and oil, ok? London knows best.
Only if you take the wind farms too. And the fish (Salmon and Sturgeon).
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Old Aug 6th 2013, 5:10 pm
  #380  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by dunroving View Post
Only if you take the wind farms too. And the fish (Salmon and Sturgeon).
I wish!!!
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Old Aug 6th 2013, 7:32 pm
  #381  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Just so long as Scotland keeps its banks (and financial geniuses) too.

Royal Bank of Scotland, Bank of Scotland, Scottish Widows, Scottish Life etc etc

Oh and Gordon and the Morons.

I'm out
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Old Aug 6th 2013, 10:03 pm
  #382  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Kiwi Ex-pat View Post
The country is still as drunk as ever, which helps when your tax dollar is being used to subsidise a failed banking industry. Cameron and his cronies refuse to stimulate the economy and are transferring more public wealth to the private sector with the impending sale of the profitable Royal Mail. This might temporarily plug a small hole in the public finances caused by Osborne's slavish adherence to the discredited economic theory of Rogoff and Rheinhart. Meanwhile, the PR machines we call daily papers mostly try and convince a gullible public nursing hangovers each morning that beneficiaries have caused the current recession and that running an economy is like running the household budget. Just a few cuts and hey-ho the books are balanced.

In short, the Anglo-Saxon disease of fleecing the public and transferring wealth into fewer and fewer hands is alive and well in the UK. Still, musn't grumble.
That's ironic coming from a New Zealander
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Old Aug 7th 2013, 1:31 am
  #383  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Kiwi Ex-pat View Post
The country is still as drunk as ever, which helps when your tax dollar is being used to subsidise a failed banking industry. Cameron and his cronies refuse to stimulate the economy and are transferring more public wealth to the private sector with the impending sale of the profitable Royal Mail. This might temporarily plug a small hole in the public finances caused by Osborne's slavish adherence to the discredited economic theory of Rogoff and Rheinhart. Meanwhile, the PR machines we call daily papers mostly try and convince a gullible public nursing hangovers each morning that beneficiaries have caused the current recession and that running an economy is like running the household budget. Just a few cuts and hey-ho the books are balanced.

In short, the Anglo-Saxon disease of fleecing the public and transferring wealth into fewer and fewer hands is alive and well in the UK. Still, musn't grumble.

This grubby little 'disease' is international; you know it; I know it; we all know it. The woman who came into power in the UK in (may she rest in pieces) '78 was the doyen of 'greed is good'.
This philosophy has spread like a cancer globally. It has been so effective that so many endorse it, and refer to those who suffer by it; just plain object to it;-as 'leftards' (or whatever other cretinous adjective their pea brains can generate).

I cannot see this as an indictment of the UK today. Polishituns are so entrenched in this ethic globally, they don't hide it.

I look forward to the same withering contempt for these greedy self serving bozo's in the UK as I do here.
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Old Aug 7th 2013, 3:11 am
  #384  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by TheEmperorIsNaked View Post
This grubby little 'disease' is international; you know it; I know it; we all know it.
Totally correct. It is actually an American way of doing things. The grand old British way (that had a sense of fair play) died out a while ago, hence the UK and ex-colonies - especially NZ are in a world of shit. It really is dog eats dog now. I'd actually say the UK is not in as bad a position as some of the colonies, i.e. Aus and NZ.

Affordability and a fair crack at things have gone out of the window. Everything is now so driven by greed that you end up with people owning over 20 properties while the majority can't even manage to get on the housing ladder.
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Old Aug 7th 2013, 6:38 am
  #385  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by davros1984 View Post
Totally correct. It is actually an American way of doing things. The grand old British way (that had a sense of fair play) died out a while ago, hence the UK and ex-colonies - especially NZ are in a world of shit. It really is dog eats dog now. I'd actually say the UK is not in as bad a position as some of the colonies, i.e. Aus and NZ.

Affordability and a fair crack at things have gone out of the window. Everything is now so driven by greed that you end up with people owning over 20 properties while the majority can't even manage to get on the housing ladder.
Yes I'm inclined to agree with this. The business about US hyper-capitalism Vs. a gentler British model, and certainly the point about affordability.
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Old Aug 7th 2013, 9:47 am
  #386  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by davros1984 View Post
Totally correct. It is actually an American way of doing things. The grand old British way (that had a sense of fair play) died out a while ago, hence the UK and ex-colonies - especially NZ are in a world of shit. It really is dog eats dog now. I'd actually say the UK is not in as bad a position as some of the colonies, i.e. Aus and NZ.

Affordability and a fair crack at things have gone out of the window. Everything is now so driven by greed that you end up with people owning over 20 properties while the majority can't even manage to get on the housing ladder.
It's about reverting to a very Victorian model of capitalism, one that very much arose out of the circumstances of Britain prior to and during the industrial revolution. Instead of the East India Trading Company breaking open borders and buggering the place for the locals we have Shell and BP doing it. This presumes no slight against the citizens of the UK, now or then, for those who for some reason role the people into the politics. We are all victims of history.

Misty-eyed notions such as "fair play" and talking of greed turn matters into a morality play, as if human nature has suddenly changed over the last 50 years. What changed was a concerted effort by the financial sector to convince us all that there was a force of historical inevitability called globalisation that made it ridiculous for the citizenry to resist the powers of free trade, removal of tarriffs, loss of diversity of industry, privatisation, reduction in working conditions and the funneling of assets and wealth upwards into fewer and fewer hands. People have stayed the same; circumstances have changed, democracy, really, is failing, as election turn outs are showing. Interesting that those who rode the greatest advancements in material well being should turn out to be the generation determined to deny the benefits to future generations.

Emperor: of course it is international but the thread is about the UK...
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Old Aug 7th 2013, 9:59 am
  #387  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Kiwi Ex-pat View Post
It's about reverting to a very Victorian model of capitalism, one that very much arose out of the circumstances of Britain prior to and during the industrial revolution. Instead of the East India Trading Company breaking open borders and buggering the place for the locals we have Shell and BP doing it. This presumes no slight against the citizens of the UK, now or then, for those who for some reason role the people into the politics. We are all victims of history.

Misty-eyed notions such as "fair play" and talking of greed turn matters into a morality play, as if human nature has suddenly changed over the last 50 years. What changed was a concerted effort by the financial sector to convince us all that there was a force of historical inevitability called globalisation that made it ridiculous for the citizenry to resist the powers of free trade, removal of tarriffs, loss of diversity of industry, privatisation, reduction in working conditions and the funneling of assets and wealth upwards into fewer and fewer hands. People have stayed the same; circumstances have changed, democracy, really, is failing, as election turn outs are showing. Interesting that those who rode the greatest advancements in material well being should turn out to be the generation determined to deny the benefits to future generations.

Emperor: of course it is international but the thread is about the UK...
My distinction is between pre and post 1980 neoliberal economics, dereg, Big Bang, etc.
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Old Aug 7th 2013, 10:46 am
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

The weather today isnt as good as it has been of late, the village still looks lovely though. People out walking their dogs, I will have to join them soon he is getting a bit restless and I cant use the w word without him jumping around excitedly. Maybe a spot of gardening later but I hate gardening and find it hard to get motivated about it, the problem with having a big garden is it doesnt look after itself.
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Old Aug 7th 2013, 11:22 am
  #389  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by Kiwi Ex-pat View Post
It's about reverting to a very Victorian model of capitalism, one that very much arose out of the circumstances of Britain prior to and during the industrial revolution. Instead of the East India Trading Company breaking open borders and buggering the place for the locals we have Shell and BP doing it. This presumes no slight against the citizens of the UK, now or then, for those who for some reason role the people into the politics. We are all victims of history.

Misty-eyed notions such as "fair play" and talking of greed turn matters into a morality play, as if human nature has suddenly changed over the last 50 years. What changed was a concerted effort by the financial sector to convince us all that there was a force of historical inevitability called globalisation that made it ridiculous for the citizenry to resist the powers of free trade, removal of tarriffs, loss of diversity of industry, privatisation, reduction in working conditions and the funneling of assets and wealth upwards into fewer and fewer hands. People have stayed the same; circumstances have changed, democracy, really, is failing, as election turn outs are showing. Interesting that those who rode the greatest advancements in material well being should turn out to be the generation determined to deny the benefits to future generations.

Emperor: of course it is international but the thread is about the UK...
human nature has changed significantly in the past 50 years. key values of 50 years ago have gone out the window. Now its all about making as much money as you can, not doing things because they're right or because they make a difference. that's what the British were all about. people will walk all over each other now to get ahead, the old way of keeping people in jobs and the system balancing itself out has fast disappeared.this is not misty eye stuff. I work for a customer that acts more like an old government agency or community business. where actually they'd rather do things right and keep people in jobs and employ people where they can. this is different with every other job I've had and the vast majority of clients I have worked for where its all about bonuses for the fatcats at the top.

Globalisation will be the death of us, I believe this alone and the greed that is has created is far worse than anything the Victorians did. before joining the EU, Britain had a great sense of integrity, doing things the British way and believing in and buying British. the same could be said for her colonies, especially the English speaking ones. I don't disagree that we did some bad things, but the sad truth today is that we lost our way and this is what has happened to the world.

I feel awfully sorry for NZ and kiwis. Up until the mid 80s it had a caring and somewhat fairer society. now its a country that its people obsess about house prices and greed. surely there's more to life than that. we need to learn to live with less, live more frugally, be a more helpful society and most of all, buy local. communities need to become more self sustaining.
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Old Aug 7th 2013, 11:36 am
  #390  
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Default Re: Is the situation in the UK really that bad?

Originally Posted by davros1984 View Post
human nature has changed significantly in the past 50 years. key values of 50 years ago have gone out the window. Now its all about making as much money as you can, not doing things because they're right or because they make a difference. that's what the British were all about. people will walk all over each other now to get ahead, the old way of keeping people in jobs and the system balancing itself out has fast disappeared.this is not misty eye stuff. I work for a customer that acts more like an old government agency or community business. where actually they'd rather do things right and keep people in jobs and employ people where they can. this is different with every other job I've had and the vast majority of clients I have worked for where its all about bonuses for the fatcats at the top.

Globalisation will be the death of us, I believe this alone and the greed that is has created is far worse than anything the Victorians did. before joining the EU, Britain had a great sense of integrity, doing things the British way and believing in and buying British. the same could be said for her colonies, especially the English speaking ones. I don't disagree that we did some bad things, but the sad truth today is that we lost our way and this is what has happened to the world.

I feel awfully sorry for NZ and kiwis. Up until the mid 80s it had a caring and somewhat fairer society. now its a country that its people obsess about house prices and greed. surely there's more to life than that. we need to learn to live with less, live more frugally, be a more helpful society and most of all, buy local. communities need to become more self sustaining.
I think we are somewhat in agreement. I don't see people as having changed, I just see them responding in a human way to a world of rapid change. In situations of instability and absent a convincing ideology people will act in their own interest. I note avarice and envy in NZ that was not present 30 years ago; I don't think Kiwis have changed but they are responding to being set adrift from their formerly paternal government.

The discussion on British imperial history and its consequences is very well documented elsewhere, and lived by some of those who inhabit the colonies.
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