An American view.
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:03 am
#76
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Posts: 2,195
From: Beautiful Dorset, UK
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:08 am
#77
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From: In a darkened room somewhere.............
Re: An American view.
Ah. A beautiful area in most parts, but also not the most affluent and one of the hardest hit by unemployment etc, plus among the lowest wages in the UK - which may explain the comments about benefit claimants etc. I think most of Devon was designated an 'assisted area' earlier in the year, meaning it would get regional aid to help try and improve things, but I guess that could take a while to take effect. 
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:19 am
#78
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Re: An American view.
Amongst other things, s(he)'s alluding to the high rate of teenage pregnancy in the UK (and it is very high in comparison to other western European countries). The weird thing is that s(he) has moved from a country with a far higher rate of teenage pregnancy:
http://sites.stedwards.edu/psyc23070...px-1xk17fn.jpg
http://sites.stedwards.edu/psyc23070...px-1xk17fn.jpg
You might see those UK numbers drop. The EU found that the EU countries with the best benefits for single parents, had the highest number of single parents (like we need to be told that). Change of government and the UK has now stopped paying benefits to single, non working, EU citizen parents and now basically just keep Brits and Irish until their youngest is 5 (soon to be age 1). Many were hit hard when the welfare cap came in and had to move to cheaper areas if they refused to work.
Last edited by formula; Sep 16th 2014 at 4:26 am.
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:28 am
#79
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,294
Re: An American view.
The OP, London1947. I've edited it to make it clearer. Coming to the UK on retirement in their mid 60s, seems to be too much for his wife. And him too after 30 years in the US? Perhaps they are missing their US life too much and will never be happy here, especailly as his wife misses her country so much?
That's why I asked if they could get free healthcare if they return to the US.
If they moved to the UK because they wanted to be given free healthcare in old age, but hate being in the UK, it seems they are in for a long, miserable retirement. Some things aren't worth it.
That's why I asked if they could get free healthcare if they return to the US.
If they moved to the UK because they wanted to be given free healthcare in old age, but hate being in the UK, it seems they are in for a long, miserable retirement. Some things aren't worth it.
Last edited by formula; Sep 16th 2014 at 4:55 am.
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:35 am
#80
Lost in BE Cyberspace
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Posts: 41,517
Re: An American view.
Amongst other things, s(he)'s alluding to the high rate of teenage pregnancy in the UK (and it is very high in comparison to other western European countries). The weird thing is that s(he) has moved from a country with a far higher rate of teenage pregnancy:
http://sites.stedwards.edu/psyc23070...px-1xk17fn.jpg
http://sites.stedwards.edu/psyc23070...px-1xk17fn.jpg
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:36 am
#81
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Forum Regular
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 175
From: Devon
Re: An American view.
My experience of the UK is very different to the one Mr & Mrs London1947 describe, I love it there.
However, I can understand how when you are unhappy somewhere and feel you have made a big mistake by moving there and, if you feel you might not be able to afford to correct that mistake, it can be hard to see any of the good things and very easy to make sweeping statements. It is just so stressful to be unhappy in your location and to feel trapped there, I think that is something so many of us here can relate to? When we are stressed/unhappy we tend not to always be the most balanced in our view, so personally I always cut people in that situation a lot of slack.
I have followed London1947 posts over the last couple of years and I think he and his wife would probably agree that at least part of their unhappiness in the UK relates to it being much more expensive to live there (especially accommodation) than they had anticipated. No matter where you live it is very stressful when money is a constant worry.
It is easy to say "bog off home" how many of expats have heard that from citizens of our new country? The trouble is that these moves are not easy when funds are limited. How many of us who want to move back to the UK have had to delay or put away plans to move home simply because our finances make it extremely difficult/impossible?
Also the older we get the harder it is to cope with stress and the more isolated we can be (no work colleagues, no chatting with other parents at the school gates etc.).
Having been in a similar position my heart always goes out to anyone who feels "stuck" somewhere they don't want to be or homesick for where they do want to be. I know that, except for the very financially secure, it is rarely as easy as "if you don't like it go back to where you were".
Absolutely, I think many of the posts from London1947 are sweeping and at times rude (Brits are pigs) but I also can hear a lot of pain and unhappiness in those posts so choose not to get offended.
I have seen London1947 lash out at some other posters purely because they are sharing their own much happier experience of the UK and I'm not saying that is okay but I think what happens is that each one feels the other is saying they are somehow "lying" about the UK when actually each one is just living a different experience to the other - they are both true in that it is how it is for each of them. When we are happy we more easily overlook the less rosy aspects of a country and when we are unhappy we can not see the good aspects.
That said I think the Daily Fail should be banned! Just because it's in a newspaper does not make it true. Obviously some of the statements Mrs London1947 made are just not factually true but clearly her unhappiness and homesickness is very real and frames her view of the UK in general.
I am constantly hungry for posts about people's experiences of moving back to the UK and I am always so grateful when people take the time to post here to share their stories. Every single one of those posts is valuable and as I read them I try to frame them within the context of the individuals situation (as much of it as I know) and I bear that in mind with regard to how similar my own experience of moving back may or may not be.
I hope no-one on here stops sharing their experience of moving back to the UK just because someone else tells them they are too positive or too negative in their view and I hope it is okay for us to also reply with the opposite view when someones says the UK is a hell hole or alternatively heaven on earth.
I love checking BE to see if anyone has posted any little crumb of information about their experience, its all just so helpful for those of us looking to make the move too.
I really hope that either Mr & Mrs London1947 can find a way to access and enjoy some of the wonderful things the UK has to offer or are able to find a way to return to the US without putting themselves in great financial hardship. I wish them all the luck in the world.
However, I can understand how when you are unhappy somewhere and feel you have made a big mistake by moving there and, if you feel you might not be able to afford to correct that mistake, it can be hard to see any of the good things and very easy to make sweeping statements. It is just so stressful to be unhappy in your location and to feel trapped there, I think that is something so many of us here can relate to? When we are stressed/unhappy we tend not to always be the most balanced in our view, so personally I always cut people in that situation a lot of slack.
I have followed London1947 posts over the last couple of years and I think he and his wife would probably agree that at least part of their unhappiness in the UK relates to it being much more expensive to live there (especially accommodation) than they had anticipated. No matter where you live it is very stressful when money is a constant worry.
It is easy to say "bog off home" how many of expats have heard that from citizens of our new country? The trouble is that these moves are not easy when funds are limited. How many of us who want to move back to the UK have had to delay or put away plans to move home simply because our finances make it extremely difficult/impossible?
Also the older we get the harder it is to cope with stress and the more isolated we can be (no work colleagues, no chatting with other parents at the school gates etc.).
Having been in a similar position my heart always goes out to anyone who feels "stuck" somewhere they don't want to be or homesick for where they do want to be. I know that, except for the very financially secure, it is rarely as easy as "if you don't like it go back to where you were".
Absolutely, I think many of the posts from London1947 are sweeping and at times rude (Brits are pigs) but I also can hear a lot of pain and unhappiness in those posts so choose not to get offended.
I have seen London1947 lash out at some other posters purely because they are sharing their own much happier experience of the UK and I'm not saying that is okay but I think what happens is that each one feels the other is saying they are somehow "lying" about the UK when actually each one is just living a different experience to the other - they are both true in that it is how it is for each of them. When we are happy we more easily overlook the less rosy aspects of a country and when we are unhappy we can not see the good aspects.
That said I think the Daily Fail should be banned! Just because it's in a newspaper does not make it true. Obviously some of the statements Mrs London1947 made are just not factually true but clearly her unhappiness and homesickness is very real and frames her view of the UK in general.
I am constantly hungry for posts about people's experiences of moving back to the UK and I am always so grateful when people take the time to post here to share their stories. Every single one of those posts is valuable and as I read them I try to frame them within the context of the individuals situation (as much of it as I know) and I bear that in mind with regard to how similar my own experience of moving back may or may not be.
I hope no-one on here stops sharing their experience of moving back to the UK just because someone else tells them they are too positive or too negative in their view and I hope it is okay for us to also reply with the opposite view when someones says the UK is a hell hole or alternatively heaven on earth.
I love checking BE to see if anyone has posted any little crumb of information about their experience, its all just so helpful for those of us looking to make the move too.
I really hope that either Mr & Mrs London1947 can find a way to access and enjoy some of the wonderful things the UK has to offer or are able to find a way to return to the US without putting themselves in great financial hardship. I wish them all the luck in the world.
Your post is well balanced and pretty much hit's the nail on the head and it's appreciated. To fully fill you on my circumstances would take many, many pages, but here is a little information. My sign in name will give you my age. Anyway when I was 23 my first daughter passed away at the sweet age of 5 years old due to some minor surgery that went wrong here in the UK. It was a time when my life was in a black hole, a hole that took years to drag myself out of. My then first wife we had another daughter and when my second daughter was 6 years old her Mother my Wife died of cancer at the age of 31. Leaving me with my young daughter. The black hole became much larger and went through a terrible time.
I met my second wife here in the UK about a year later, she is English but went through a divorce with her American husband and decided to come back to the UK. So long story short we married and as she was at that time a (green card holder) she sponsored my daughter and I so to the US we went. Green card holders at that time could sponsor but not anymore.
Fast forward now. In the US we worked hard and watched my daughter grow up into a fine woman that she is now. We had what could be called
( The American Dream) that dream became a nightmare after being married for 30 years she just got up and left and she returned to the UK to be with some guy she met on the internet and now lives in a caravan, just cohabiting. I'm finding this difficult to carry on, so I will leave it at that for now.
Thanks
John
Next chapter will be meeting my now American wife. I might send it to you in a PM as I don't think the general poster's would be interested.
Ps On reflection I should have replied to you in a private message.
Last edited by London1947; Sep 16th 2014 at 5:05 am.
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:44 am
#82
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 13,212
From: San Francisco
Re: An American view.
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:45 am
#83
seenbeendonenocriesnowhys
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 747
From: Woellstein, Germany
Re: An American view.
I dont mind anyone , from around the world having a dig, at our green and pleasant land.
We can learn from other countries......but I expect that anyone to do his/her homework on
and within the states ( counties) of their chosen land of high pedastal before they start out with
unbalanced, incompetent facts as tools for comparison.
Furnished, unfurnished property are to be found all over the States.Same as utility meters, in USA like UK not all upto modern day expectations.The rest of the infrastructure in USA, like Buses, trains, ferries, in-flights, can be a godsend or nightmare.
Customer service, I must say prefer USA, but the Brit in me dislikes the tipping mentality.
Dont like being made to feel guilty, if tip, doesnt come up to expectations, not the customers fault
if Employer doesnt find it necessary to pay a decent wage.That said service wins hands down, in USA in all trades.
Education: mmmm I am a typical grumpy old man, so UK youth is being let down, but USA has its fill of blackholes that swallow up all types of youths chances of decent education.
Not only in ethnic, black, hispanic areas also in major white rural/city areas.
Denying it is a bigger crime.
300+ mill compared to 65+ mil. WITH an economy clout 2nd to none, USA is letting the masses
down far more than, whatever developed country you want to compare with.
That said, I havent or wouldnt put my land of origin, or the one where I am host, up for ridicule with poor comparisons.
USA loves comparing its richest and successfull side, forgets the other 80%.which includes also middle-class strugglers, as well as satisfied citizens.
We can learn from other countries......but I expect that anyone to do his/her homework on
and within the states ( counties) of their chosen land of high pedastal before they start out with
unbalanced, incompetent facts as tools for comparison.
Furnished, unfurnished property are to be found all over the States.Same as utility meters, in USA like UK not all upto modern day expectations.The rest of the infrastructure in USA, like Buses, trains, ferries, in-flights, can be a godsend or nightmare.
Customer service, I must say prefer USA, but the Brit in me dislikes the tipping mentality.
Dont like being made to feel guilty, if tip, doesnt come up to expectations, not the customers fault
if Employer doesnt find it necessary to pay a decent wage.That said service wins hands down, in USA in all trades.
Education: mmmm I am a typical grumpy old man, so UK youth is being let down, but USA has its fill of blackholes that swallow up all types of youths chances of decent education.
Not only in ethnic, black, hispanic areas also in major white rural/city areas.
Denying it is a bigger crime.
300+ mill compared to 65+ mil. WITH an economy clout 2nd to none, USA is letting the masses
down far more than, whatever developed country you want to compare with.
That said, I havent or wouldnt put my land of origin, or the one where I am host, up for ridicule with poor comparisons.
USA loves comparing its richest and successfull side, forgets the other 80%.which includes also middle-class strugglers, as well as satisfied citizens.
Last edited by fuchs01; Sep 16th 2014 at 4:52 am.
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:48 am
#85
BE Site Lead
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 92,276
From: MA, USA
Re: An American view.
Most don't include toaster/microwave/kettle.
Some other areas, they might.
Then again, rent is massively variable too, down my way, $1500 a month gets you a pokey, shit little apartment, but $900 can get you a decent sized house up in Maine.
So you really can't have a one size fits all answer to this.
Or for most of the points the OP brings up, because they're all pretty local, except the taxes. Then again, I think you get far more for your money in the UK, or at least it's more transparent, as where I am at least, there's far more stealth taxes hidden away, in everything and you get nothing in return for it.
Sep 16th 2014 | 4:49 am
#86
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 41,517
Re: An American view.
It seems this is more to do with personal pain, for which Britain is being blamed as a whole. Probably best to leave it.
Sep 16th 2014 | 5:00 am
#87
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,294
Re: An American view.
It seems from you new wife's renting comments and from her comments on taxes and utility prices, that money is tight for you both? Is this making things worse do you think? If she got a job, that would help her settle and would give you more income and she might make some friends.
I would hate to move away to another country, away from my family. I would miss them too much.
It might just be that you need to bite the bullet and return home to the US where your wife is happy. Life is too short. I thought Obama was doing something about healthcare???
Last edited by formula; Sep 16th 2014 at 5:13 am.
Sep 16th 2014 | 5:52 am
#88
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 369
From: USA
Re: An American view.
I was one of the people that encouraged the OP to post his (and wife's I guess) negative experiences so that those of us who are not in the UK can get a balanced view because you can't base it all memories or the media. I have to say I wasn't expecting that. With the background information detailing the Op's journey I see how he may feel the way he does.
I have to say it made me take a second look at my views on the US which are mostly negative and see how I may come across to an American (aside from my hubby - he might as well be a Brit). I have not had any qualifying event that I can pin point to make me feel this way. Everything in our lives in the US is in place - job, house etc, but there is that 'pang' called belonging that pokes at you and you cannot ignore it.
I truly believe there is no utopia so we all have to gauge what is most important to us and live out our limited years on earth as happily as we can.
I have to say it made me take a second look at my views on the US which are mostly negative and see how I may come across to an American (aside from my hubby - he might as well be a Brit). I have not had any qualifying event that I can pin point to make me feel this way. Everything in our lives in the US is in place - job, house etc, but there is that 'pang' called belonging that pokes at you and you cannot ignore it.
I truly believe there is no utopia so we all have to gauge what is most important to us and live out our limited years on earth as happily as we can.
Sep 16th 2014 | 10:01 am
#89
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 235
From: Taipei, Taiwan
Re: An American view.
Amongst other things, s(he)'s alluding to the high rate of teenage pregnancy in the UK (and it is very high in comparison to other western European countries). The weird thing is that s(he) has moved from a country with a far higher rate of teenage pregnancy:
http://sites.stedwards.edu/psyc23070...px-1xk17fn.jpg
http://sites.stedwards.edu/psyc23070...px-1xk17fn.jpg
Sep 16th 2014 | 11:07 am
#90
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 603
Re: An American view.
London1947,
I'm so sorry for the loss of loved ones that you have suffered. I am interested to hear the next part of your story but by all means send a PM if you do not feel comfortable posting, although I suspect quite a few people here would also be interested to hear it.
I'm sorry its been difficult for you and your wife since you moved to the UK and I know how easy it is to spiral into depression when stressed for a long time. I read that you are going to visit the US for a few weeks perhaps you could talk the situation over with your daughter and see what her thoughts are on what your options are.
As others have said it does seem that you have landed in a particularly hard up part of the UK, do you have any chance of making a move to a different part of the UK?
Chip up, sometimes things are darkest just before the sun comes out.
I'm so sorry for the loss of loved ones that you have suffered. I am interested to hear the next part of your story but by all means send a PM if you do not feel comfortable posting, although I suspect quite a few people here would also be interested to hear it.
I'm sorry its been difficult for you and your wife since you moved to the UK and I know how easy it is to spiral into depression when stressed for a long time. I read that you are going to visit the US for a few weeks perhaps you could talk the situation over with your daughter and see what her thoughts are on what your options are.
As others have said it does seem that you have landed in a particularly hard up part of the UK, do you have any chance of making a move to a different part of the UK?
Chip up, sometimes things are darkest just before the sun comes out.
