"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:09:05 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >I know you are now going to say that after such a low price I can afford
the
> >60 Euro and you will be right.
>
> I wasn't, but you have a good point. :-)
>
> If you are going to Vlissingen it will be cheaper to go back to Belgium
when you
> need to fill up your tank.
>
> >My point was not to complain about the tax but to wonder how they can
> >enforce it. Maybe I was being a bit obtuse. :-)
>
> Is something similar in Oz? Car hire was the main cost of our last holiday
in
> Oz. About half the hire charge was insurance.
> --
>

Unfortunately for you the answer is no. Mind you now that we have 10% GST
(=VAT or BTW) there is no more sales tax which was around 25% for cars so it
should not be as expensive as it is. Once again the car hire sharks are
biting really well.
And as for insurance, apart from the fact that the insurance companies are
also sharklike, I reckon that the hire companies rake off a large portion of
what they call insurance premium.
If you were to be in Oz for a reasonably long period, say 2 months, it may
pay to actually buy a bomb and sell when you leave. At $60 a day you would
be up for $3600 anyway and a bomb need not cost you any more than say $1000
(but don't go too far off the beaten track :-) ) BTW buy in Victoria they
don't have a state stamp duty tax.

Gerrit

"gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

>
> "Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> On Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:32:22 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >I have leased on three different occasions and believe me the
>> >vehicle is registered in my name and with my address.
>>
>> I don't see how it can be, you need to be a resident to have a car
> registered
>> exclusively in your name.
>> --
>>
>
> Courtesy the French government who allow non European residents to
> buy/lease a brand new car "TAX FREE"
>
> The cost is much less than renting from sharks like AVIS and HERZ but
> you do have to lease for a minimum period.
> Checkout: http://www.eurodrive.renault.com/cms/australie/
>
> When I arrive I sign a Visa card slip for the total price of the car
> in case I nick it.

> The rego papers are only in my name.
>
> I know you are now going to say that after such a low price I can
> afford the 60 Euro and you will be right.
> My point was not to complain about the tax but to wonder how they can
> enforce it. Maybe I was being a bit obtuse. :-)

Well, it would be nice if you go to a country that you abide by thier
laws, no?

In Switzerland, you don't often have "controls" for the vignette.
Sometimes you will see police at the end of the exit ramp checking. BUt
that is mostly at the end of February when we need to have the new
vignette in place.

They also check at the borders or if you happen to cross a police on the
highway. Other than that it's really a bit like the honor system.

If you get pulled over, they ask you to pay up front & if you can't they
send you the bill which is more expensive than if paying right away. I
imagine if they see you are from Australia & your car is registered with
your Australian address, they might insist you pay up front.

"gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

>
> "Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news[email protected]...
>> On 15 Jan 2007 21:13:31 +0100, mini Mini <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >Ok, I'm confused. If the french & italians have toll roads & the
>> >austrians have vignettes, why can't the belgians have a vignette
>> >system?
>>
>> Because for some reason the Dutch despise them. Something to do with
>> the Belgians having real supermarkets and the ability to cook and
>> brew real
> beer
>> perhaps.
>> --
>>
> I gather the difference is that in France and Italy as in Switzerland
> the charge is only for actual use of the toll roads/motorway system.
> If you don't use these you don't have to pay/buy a vignet.
> In Belgium the proposed system will be for all roads so users cannot
> opt out.
>
> Gerrit

I still don't see the big deal. If we use the roads, it's only fair to
pay to help maintain them. & hopefully, if there is extra money left
over it can be used to clean up the environmental waste produced by using
the car in the first place. (Just a little idealist dream!)

On Jan 16, 1:53 am, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in messagenews51oq29c8j65dt80u4s4ob08srjbfp0dsk@4ax .com...> On 15 Jan 2007 21:13:31 +0100, mini Mini <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > >Ok, I'm confused. If the french & italians have toll roads & the
> > >austrians have vignettes, why can't the belgians have a vignette system?
>
> > Because for some reason the Dutch despise them. Something to do with the
> > Belgians having real supermarkets and the ability to cook and brew real
> beer
> > perhaps.
> > --I gather the difference is that in France and Italy as in Switzerland the
> charge is only for actual use of the toll roads/motorway system.
> If you don't use these you don't have to pay/buy a vignet.
> In Belgium the proposed system will be for all roads so users cannot opt
> out.
>
> Gerrit

...the use of the technology also means that 'big brother' will know
who is coming and going from Belgium

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:53:14 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news[email protected].. .
>> On 15 Jan 2007 21:13:31 +0100, mini Mini <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >Ok, I'm confused. If the french & italians have toll roads & the
>> >austrians have vignettes, why can't the belgians have a vignette system?
>>
>> Because for some reason the Dutch despise them. Something to do with the
>> Belgians having real supermarkets and the ability to cook and brew real
>beer
>> perhaps.
>> --
>>
>I gather the difference is that in France and Italy as in Switzerland the
>charge is only for actual use of the toll roads/motorway system.
>If you don't use these you don't have to pay/buy a vignet.
>In Belgium the proposed system will be for all roads so users cannot opt
>out.

You can always opt out by going via UK or Germany.

I don't think the details have been finalised yet. In this morning's newspaper I
saw stuff about EUR 10 for up to ten days in Belgium and probably a bit more for
a month, but less than EUR 60.
The ones complaining most seem to be those on the border, who use the Belgian
motorways most and a tight fisted Australian :-)
Odd?
--

Martin

"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:53:14 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >news[email protected].. .
> >> On 15 Jan 2007 21:13:31 +0100, mini Mini <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> >Ok, I'm confused. If the french & italians have toll roads & the
> >> >austrians have vignettes, why can't the belgians have a vignette
system?
> >>
> >> Because for some reason the Dutch despise them. Something to do with
the
> >> Belgians having real supermarkets and the ability to cook and brew real
> >beer
> >> perhaps.
> >> --
> >>
> >I gather the difference is that in France and Italy as in Switzerland the
> >charge is only for actual use of the toll roads/motorway system.
> >If you don't use these you don't have to pay/buy a vignet.
> >In Belgium the proposed system will be for all roads so users cannot opt
> >out.
>
> You can always opt out by going via UK or Germany.
>
> I don't think the details have been finalised yet. In this morning's
newspaper I
> saw stuff about EUR 10 for up to ten days in Belgium and probably a bit
more for
> a month, but less than EUR 60.
> The ones complaining most seem to be those on the border, who use the
Belgian
> motorways most and a tight fisted Australian :-)
> Odd?

Correction: Australian who was born in Pernis! :-) Mind you he was not
complaining so much as pointing out that there may be more to it.

Gerrit

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:08 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected].. .
>> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:53:14 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> >news[email protected].. .
>> >> On 15 Jan 2007 21:13:31 +0100, mini Mini <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >Ok, I'm confused. If the french & italians have toll roads & the
>> >> >austrians have vignettes, why can't the belgians have a vignette
>system?
>> >>
>> >> Because for some reason the Dutch despise them. Something to do with
>the
>> >> Belgians having real supermarkets and the ability to cook and brew real
>> >beer
>> >> perhaps.
>> >> --
>> >>
>> >I gather the difference is that in France and Italy as in Switzerland the
>> >charge is only for actual use of the toll roads/motorway system.
>> >If you don't use these you don't have to pay/buy a vignet.
>> >In Belgium the proposed system will be for all roads so users cannot opt
>> >out.
>>
>> You can always opt out by going via UK or Germany.
>>
>> I don't think the details have been finalised yet. In this morning's
>newspaper I
>> saw stuff about EUR 10 for up to ten days in Belgium and probably a bit
>more for
>> a month, but less than EUR 60.
>> The ones complaining most seem to be those on the border, who use the
>Belgian
>> motorways most and a tight fisted Australian :-)
>> Odd?
>
>Correction: Australian who was born in Pernis! :-)

Under the smoke and flames of *hell? :-)

>Mind you he was not
>complaining so much as pointing out that there may be more to it.

:-)
--

Martin

Let is be knownst that on 16 Jan 2007 01:16:10 -0800, "J. Walker"
<[email protected]> writted:

>
>
>On Jan 16, 1:53 am, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in messagenews51oq29c8j65dt80u4s4ob08srjbfp0dsk@4ax .com...> On 15 Jan 2007 21:13:31 +0100, mini Mini <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> > >Ok, I'm confused. If the french & italians have toll roads & the
>> > >austrians have vignettes, why can't the belgians have a vignette system?
>>
>> > Because for some reason the Dutch despise them. Something to do with the
>> > Belgians having real supermarkets and the ability to cook and brew real
>> beer
>> > perhaps.
>> > --I gather the difference is that in France and Italy as in Switzerland the
>> charge is only for actual use of the toll roads/motorway system.
>> If you don't use these you don't have to pay/buy a vignet.
>> In Belgium the proposed system will be for all roads so users cannot opt
>> out.
>>
>> Gerrit
>
>...the use of the technology also means that 'big brother' will know
>who is coming and going from Belgium

Surely not the most valuable nugget of information!
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:08 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >Correction: Australian who was born in Pernis! :-)
>
> Under the smoke and flames of *hell? :-)
>
Why do you think my parents left in 1952?

Gerrit

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 23:49:55 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news[email protected].. .
>> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:08 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> >Correction: Australian who was born in Pernis! :-)
>>
>> Under the smoke and flames of *hell? :-)
>>
>Why do you think my parents left in 1952?

Probably for the same reasons my parents that my parents thought of doing the
same in 1952. Your parents were more decisive. Mine talked about it for 20 years
before doing it.
--

Martin

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:21:51 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:

... On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 23:49:55 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
...
... >
... >"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
... >news[email protected].. .
... >> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:08 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
... >>
... >> >Correction: Australian who was born in Pernis! :-)
... >>
... >> Under the smoke and flames of *hell? :-)
... >>
... >Why do you think my parents left in 1952?
...
... Probably for the same reasons my parents that my parents thought of doing the
... same in 1952.

Re-reading needed!

Your parents were more decisive. Mine talked about it for 20 years
... before doing it.

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:27:12 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:21:51 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>
> ... On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 23:49:55 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
> ...
> ... >
> ... >"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> ... >news[email protected].. .
> ... >> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:08 +0900, "gerrit" <[email protected]> wrote:
> ... >>
> ... >> >Correction: Australian who was born in Pernis! :-)
> ... >>
> ... >> Under the smoke and flames of *hell? :-)
> ... >>
> ... >Why do you think my parents left in 1952?
> ...
> ... Probably for the same reasons that my parents thought of doing the
> ... same in 1952.
>
>Re-reading needed!

re-Reading?

We rely totally on you Magda :-)
--

Martin

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:42:30 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:


... > ... Probably for the same reasons that my parents thought of doing the
... > ... same in 1952.
... >
... >Re-reading needed!
...
... re-Reading?
...
... We rely totally on you Magda :-)

We can't rely on your English, though. We wish.

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:37:22 +0100, Deeply Filled Mortician
<deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote:

>>...the use of the technology also means that 'big brother' will know
>>who is coming and going from Belgium
>
>Surely not the most valuable nugget of information!

I was expecting Greg to mention that you can hear Joson coming without new
technology.
--

Martin

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:05:28 +0100, Magda <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:42:30 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>
>
> ... > ... Probably for the same reasons that my parents thought of doing the
> ... > ... same in 1952.
> ... >
> ... >Re-reading needed!
> ...
> ... re-Reading?
> ...
> ... We rely totally on you Magda :-)
>
>We can't rely on your English, though. We wish.

Oh no you don't, you love it.
--

Martin