B Vaughan

On 12 May 2005 09:21:23 -0700, "Sudipto" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >1.Our air tickets are such that we would be arriving at Frankfurt &
    >departing via Amsterdam.
    >2. Approx. 10 days in between
    >3. We would be travelling with a 5y old kid & a 6 months old baby. So
    >would like to do everything in a relaxed manner.
....

    >1. General itinerary I have in mind is to arrive in Frankfurt & go
    >directly to Rhine valley to Rudesheim. Spend 2-3 days.
    >2. Travel south & spend 3 days on the Romantic Road taking in some
    >castles.
    >3. From here on I am not sure whether to go on to spend some time in
    >Munich or skip Munich & go on to Strausbug,Austria & say spend 2 days
    >there. Then go on to Vienna & spend 2 more days. Or just choose only
    >one place out of Vienna & Strausburg.

I would choose one of Salzburg, Munich and Vienna. Vienna is a much
longer trip than the other two. Both Salzburg and Munich are very
nice; Salzburg is "prettier", but Munich is a very pleasant city.

I would be prepared to cut back on the travelling around if the kids
don't adapt well. They would be just as happy, maybe happier, spending
the whole 10 days in one place.
--
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup

B Vaughan

On Thu, 12 May 2005 20:11:41 +0000 (UTC), Juliana L Holm
<[email protected]> wrote:

    > ... I suspect that Salzburg
    >would be as nice if not nicer than Munich scenery wise. I know Munich has
    >fun stuff for kids to do and would be nice.

Salzburg is a smaller city and is more scenic than Munich, but I think
this trip already has lots of scenery. Munich is a very nice city with
lots to do. I don't know about things for the kids. One is 5 and the
other is 6 months. I think the 5-year-old isn't going to see much
difference between Salzburg and Munich, unless there's something in
one or the other city that is of special interest to him/her. I expect
the boat ride on the Rhine will be fun, unless it's too long. The
6-month-old won't be impressed with anything. Probably both kids will
be happier if there's not too much driving.


--
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup

Sudipto

Agreed. Probably will stick to Munich. It does make logistics a lot
easier for me.

Helmut Uttenthaler

"Sudipto" <[email protected]> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:[email protected] ups.com
    > That's great info LG.
    > If I do decide to go to Vienna instead of Munich then I
    > can probably return the car in Salzburg, take the train
    > to Vienna, spend couple of days there & fly back to
    > Amsterdam.


In this case I recommend to go back to Amsterdam by train.

There are no low cost flights between Wien and the Netherlands. A one-way
flight for your familiy (2 adults, 1 child, 1 baby) costs around 1300 EUR.
It's cheaper to book a return flight, but this also costs at least 800 EUR.




You can take an overnight train from Vienna to Cologne, where you can change
to a ICE high speed train to Amsterdam.

Timetable:

Vienna 20:28 - Cologne 8:43
Cologne 10:18 - Amsterdam 13:37

It's of course a long trip, but you can get a comfortable sleeping car cabin
between Vienna and Cologne. It will be defintive an interesting experience.




With your familiy discount card (called "Vorteilscard", 45-50% discount in
Austria, 25% discount in Germany and the Netherlands) the ticket for 2
adults only costs 215,4 EUR.

Your 5 year old is travelling free in Austria and Germany (you have to ask
for the "TEE family card" (1) at the station in Austria, it's free). For the
Dutch section you'll need a children ticket, it costs 10,8 EUR.

Maybe it's necessary to split the ticket and buy a ticket Wien - Oberhausen
(2 adults with Vorteilscard/Railplus (1) discount, 1 children free ticket)
and Oberhausen - Amsterdam (2 adults with Vorteilscard/Railplus discount, 1
children) , as the free ticket for your child is only available on bilateral
tickets Austria - Germany. Oberhausen is the last station in Germany before
travelling into the Netherlands.



For the overnight trip I recommend to buy a sleeping car supplement. There
are several options:

Small double bed cabin: 2 supplements at 49,5 EUR each
http://www.citynightline.ch/-S:PtVOS..._economy.shtml

Deluxe double bed cabin: 2 supplements at 99,5 EUR each. Private toilet and
shower.
http://www.citynightline.ch/-S:PtVOS...w_deluxe.shtml

In both cases you have to share the bed with your children. They don't need
a supplement.


There are also 4-bed-cabins: 4 supplements at 39,5 EUR (sleeping car) or
29,5 EUR (couchette car) each. In this case you also need a ticket for your
baby, but this is free due to the "TEE family card".
Sleeping car:
http://www.citynightline.ch/-S:PtVOS..._economy.shtml
Couchette card:
http://www.citynightline.ch/-S:PtVOS...egewagen.shtml

In any case a small breakfast is included in the supplement.



You'll also need seat reservations for the ICE high speed train from Cologne
to Amsterdam. This should cost around EUR 10 (3 reservations).

Totally you shouldn't spend more than 400 EUR (incl. sleeping car
supplements).



(1)
I should explain something about the different discount cards:

"Vorteilscard Familie": It's a discount card offered by the Austrian
railwaya. It costs EUR 19,9 and is valid one year. With this discount card
the parents and children over 15 get a discount of at least 45% in Austria.
Children under 15 travel free.
To use the discounts at least one child and one adult have to travel
together.
To get the "Vorteilscard Familie" you have to fill out a form at the sation.
I don't know if it's in English to, but the railway staff should help you.

"TEE family card": It's a offer of the railways in Austria, Germany and
Switzerland. With this card your children travel free on international
trips. The "TEE family card" doesn't cost anything, you have just to ask for
it at the station.

"Railplus": Railplus offers a 25% discount on most cross-border rail trips
in Europe. It's automatically included in your "Vorteilscard Familie".



Hope that helps.

Best regards,


Helmut

Dave Smith

Sudipto wrote:

    > 1. General itinerary I have in mind is to arrive in Frankfurt & go
    > directly to Rhine valley to Rudesheim. Spend 2-3 days.
    > 2. Travel south & spend 3 days on the Romantic Road taking in some
    > castles.
    > 3. From here on I am not sure whether to go on to spend some time in
    > Munich or skip Munich & go on to Strausbug,Austria & say spend 2 days
    > there. Then go on to Vienna & spend 2 more days. Or just choose only
    > one place out of Vienna & Strausburg.

I enjoyed Rotenburg ob der Tauber on one of my trips there. If you are not
interested in museums and such you might prefer small towns to big
cities. Scoot down a little past Munich to Garmische-Patenkirchen. The
scenery ins incredible, and I experienced the warmest, friendliest
hospitality there.

    > So could people comment on the above. Specially my questions are :-
    > 1. Is it more convinient to rent a car or rely on the train. How about
    > the cost angle ?

It depends on the fares and what they charge for the kids. It may be
cheaper to rent a car than to pay multiple fares. The biggest problem with
a car is finding parking in cities, and that is not a problem in the
smaller towns. It gives you the added flexibility of working around kids'
cycles.

    > 2. How to do the Romantic Road. Should I base myself at a place & do
    > short day trips. If so where do I base myself.

I would not recommend that. You end up seeing the same things twice. Go an
a circuit and see more with the same amount of travel.

    > 3. How about the Austrian leg of the tour ? Should I go to Vienna,
    > Strausburg or just skip Austria & stay in Germany going someplace
    > North. If so where ?

From Garmische-Partenkirchen you are just a few kilometers from Austria
and you are already in the Alps.

    > Would really appreciate help in planning the above. This is our first
    > trip to Germany so probably would be more intrested in the touristy
    > stuff. However not much interest in big cities.

Wise choice IMO.

Claim Guy

"Jens Arne Maennig" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Sudipto wrote:
    > > go on to Strausbug,Austria
    > I'd go directly to Strausbug and spend the rest of my life there. It's
    > such a beautiful place.
    > Jens

Du bist ein lustiger Kerl, Jens!

Claim Guy

"Sudipto" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] oups.com...

    > 1. General itinerary I have in mind is to arrive in Frankfurt & go
    > directly to Rhine valley to Rudesheim. Spend 2-3 days.

If you like big brown barge right of ways twin tracked with railways - by
all means enjoy the Rhine. It iss the only place in Germany that has
disappointed me and it did so on a grand scale.

    > 2. Travel south & spend 3 days on the Romantic Road taking in some
    > castles.

Shweet. Stay in Rothenburg as a base - it is special after the tour busses
leave. Take the Night Watchman tour.


    > 3. From here on I am not sure whether to go on to spend some time in
    > Munich or skip Munich & go on to Strausbug,Austria & say spend 2 days
    > there. Then go on to Vienna & spend 2 more days. Or just choose only
    > one place out of Vienna & Strausburg.


I would use the time saved from the Rhine and do Munich and Salzburg. But
then again, if you don't want to see museums, Munich is not the most scenic
old European place.

    > So could people comment on the above. Specially my questions are :-
    > 1. Is it more convinient to rent a car or rely on the train. How about
    > the cost angle ?

CAR!


    > 2. How to do the Romantic Road. Should I base myself at a place & do
    > short day trips. If so where do I base myself.

Rothenburg ob der Tauber.


    > 3. How about the Austrian leg of the tour ? Should I go to Vienna,
    > Strausburg or just skip Austria & stay in Germany going someplace
    > North. If so where ?

Do see Salzburg - it is a fantastic city. Vienna might be a bit far and it
is a sophisticated museum kind of place. The sights between the Romantic
Road and Salzburg - Alps, Berchtedgaden, etc. are absolutely worth it.

Bb

On Thu, 12 May 2005 20:06:15 -0400, Claim Guy wrote:

    > I would use the time saved from the Rhine and do Munich and Salzburg. But
    > then again, if you don't want to see museums, Munich is not the most scenic
    > old European place.

He's got a point. The Rhine is a big draw for wine-lovers, but it is a lot
of barges and trains, with just a few towns that are quaint (but certainly
no more than what you'll see later). It was cool to see the castles &
vineyards, but I'm glad I didn't spend days there.

--
-BB-
To e-mail me, unmunge my address

Luigi Donatello Asero

"BB" <[email protected]> skrev i meddelandet
news:[email protected]...
    > On Thu, 12 May 2005 20:06:15 -0400, Claim Guy wrote:
    > > I would use the time saved from the Rhine and do Munich and Salzburg.
But
    > > then again, if you don't want to see museums, Munich is not the most
scenic
    > > old European place.
    > He's got a point. The Rhine is a big draw for wine-lovers, but it is a lot
    > of barges and trains, with just a few towns that are quaint (but certainly
    > no more than what you'll see later). It was cool to see the castles &
    > vineyards, but I'm glad I didn't spend days there.
    > --


The train connection might be much better now but they were not so good from
April 1995 ( and probably before) until august 1998 between Germersheim am
Rhein and the nearest big towns ( for example Karslruhe, Mannheim and
Heidelberg)


--
Luigi ( un italiano che vive in Svezia)
https://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/de/uebersetzung.php

Juliana L Holm

Sudipto <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Thanks Julie, now I understand why you suggested that I spend the night
    > in Rothenburg. Will do accordingly.

    > For staying at Burg Stahlek do I have to join the youth hostel
    > association ?

I believe so. However, they have reasonable family membership rates.

Julie

--
Julie
**********
Check out the blog of my 9 week Germany adventure at www.blurty.com/users/jholm
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm

Juliana L Holm

B Vaughan <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Salzburg is a smaller city and is more scenic than Munich, but I think
    > this trip already has lots of scenery. Munich is a very nice city with
    > lots to do. I don't know about things for the kids. One is 5 and the
    > other is 6 months. I think the 5-year-old isn't going to see much
    > difference between Salzburg and Munich, unless there's something in
    > one or the other city that is of special interest to him/her.

The Glockenspiel is fascinating to kids, and the ZAM (Center for Unusual
Museums) has a couple of toy museums that would be of interest.

I expect
    > the boat ride on the Rhine will be fun, unless it's too long. The
    > 6-month-old won't be impressed with anything. Probably both kids will
    > be happier if there's not too much driving.

Hard to say. When mine were little they loved going places in a car. Depends
on the kid. I agree with you about the boat ride, though. Take a train to
Koblenz, then the boat back via the Rhine Gorge, which is the most scenic
portion of the Rhine. It's about 3-4 hours. That will be more than enough for the little ones.

Julie
    > --
    > Barbara Vaughan
    > My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
    > I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup

--
Julie
**********
Check out the blog of my 9 week Germany adventure at www.blurty.com/users/jholm
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm

George

Sudipto wrote:
Specially my questions are :-

1. Is it more convinient to rent a car or rely on the train. How about
the cost angle ?
2. How to do the Romantic Road. Should I base myself at a place & do
short day trips. If so where do I base myself.
3. How about the Austrian leg of the tour ? Should I go to Vienna,
Strausburg or just skip Austria & stay in Germany going someplace
North. If so where ?

I would definitely rent a car. It would certainly be easier than
coping with small children and luggage on a train, and it would
simplify visiting many of the places you want to go. If oneway car
rental is too expensive with the dropoff fee, just return it where you
originated and then take the train to Amsterdam.

If you visit Rothenburg ob der Tauber, make sure you drive to the river
valley below for the excellent view upwards of the walled city.

I definitely would not miss Salzburg, it is one of my favorite cities
in Europe. There are plenty of fun interesting things to do there
besides the excellent old fortress and town that your whole family
should enjoy (except for the baby, which would be hard where ever you
go). The fun bishop's water garden was designed to play tricks with
water on his guests, you can visit an underground salt mine as well as
the ice caves near Werfen, go up in the Alps by gondola, or perhaps
take a boat ride on the Koenigsee and its magnificent mountain scenery.
Between Salzburg and Munich is Bavarian King Ludwig's copy of
Versailles on an island in the Chiemsee.

Depending how travel with your children goes, you might alternatively
consider renting an apartment in one place for your entire stay and
then use it for a base to visit local attractions which might not even
require having a car. Having lived in Stuttgart now for nine months, I
realize that there are too many interesting places within a two hour
drive that I could never hope to see them all in a life time. I'm sure
that there are many other similar cities throughout Germany that could
serve as your base, and then you can actually experience living in
Europe instead of visiting it.

George

Luca Logi

Sudipto <[email protected]> wrote:

    > 3. We would be travelling with a 5y old kid & a 6 months old baby. So
    > would like to do everything in a relaxed manner.
    > 4. Primarily intrested in scenic stuff. Zero interest in museums (plan
    > to visit none).

Generally speaking, Austria is one of the places more geared for
children. Salzburg has a toy museum where you could spend an hour.
Probably the boy would appreciate the water jokes at Hellbrunn castle
(be ready to get out completely wet, so leave the 6-months old out).
Probably he would like also the salt mines, but they are definitely too
cold for the poor little baby.

I second the idea that Munich-Amsterdam (or Salzburg-Amsterdam, let
alone Vienna) is a very long trip by car. You should try to find some
connecting flight. Or trying to do it in two stages, that would cut out
a day from your sightseeing itinerary.

--
Luca Logi - Firenze - Italy e-mail: [email protected]
Home page: http://www.angelfire.com/ar/archivarius
(musicologia pratica)

B Vaughan

On Fri, 13 May 2005 01:18:20 +0000 (UTC), Juliana L Holm
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >B Vaughan <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> Salzburg is a smaller city and is more scenic than Munich, but I think
    >> this trip already has lots of scenery. Munich is a very nice city with
    >> lots to do. I don't know about things for the kids. One is 5 and the
    >> other is 6 months. I think the 5-year-old isn't going to see much
    >> difference between Salzburg and Munich, unless there's something in
    >> one or the other city that is of special interest to him/her.
    >The Glockenspiel is fascinating to kids, and the ZAM (Center for Unusual
    >Museums) has a couple of toy museums that would be of interest.

However, this poster said he had zero interest in museums and didn't
plan on visiting any.


--
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup

Nitram

On Thu, 12 May 2005 19:30:57 +0200, Jens Arne Maennig
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >Sudipto wrote:
    >> go on to Strausbug,Austria
    >I'd go directly to Strausbug and spend the rest of my life there. It's
    >such a beautiful place.

Are you posting from Strausburg, Jens?