Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
Apr 11th 2007, 8:54 am
#46
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, in rec.travel.europe, Alan S <[email protected]>
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
...
... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
...
... >I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
... >admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
... >life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
...
... As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
... what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
...
... There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
... friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
... tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
... I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
... put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
... into the economy.
...
... For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
... CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
... and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
... Chinese.
...
... In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
... Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
... understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
... things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
... hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
... signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
... were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
...
... But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
... were so famous every child is aware of them - the
... authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
... their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
... don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
... smoke it."
Yes! They are home. They do as they like. I applaud them.
Because they know that, if you only ever visit
... Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
... Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
If you can only visit Europe once in your life, you better prepare your trip accordingly -
or miss it.
(I really don't know how Germany copes... The museums have all the tags written in German
only. The Louvre is not wanting visitors and all the tags are in French. If some museums
are bilingual in Italy, I surely missed them.)
... So, while all (or nearly all) the Italians and Greeks that I
... met were marvellous, the major cities at the bottom of our
... "friendly authorities" index were Athens, Rome, Florence and
... Pisa. Even Paris scored higher. The only North American city
... down at the bottom was Montreal - where the antipathy for
... non-French speaking visitors was almost tangible.
OTOH, it seems that you are not welcome in Flanders if you speak French - although I'm
still waiting for this point to be proven.
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
...
... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
...
... >I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
... >admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
... >life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
...
... As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
... what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
...
... There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
... friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
... tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
... I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
... put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
... into the economy.
...
... For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
... CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
... and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
... Chinese.
...
... In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
... Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
... understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
... things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
... hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
... signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
... were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
...
... But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
... were so famous every child is aware of them - the
... authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
... their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
... don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
... smoke it."
Yes! They are home. They do as they like. I applaud them.
Because they know that, if you only ever visit
... Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
... Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
If you can only visit Europe once in your life, you better prepare your trip accordingly -
or miss it.
(I really don't know how Germany copes... The museums have all the tags written in German
only. The Louvre is not wanting visitors and all the tags are in French. If some museums
are bilingual in Italy, I surely missed them.)
... So, while all (or nearly all) the Italians and Greeks that I
... met were marvellous, the major cities at the bottom of our
... "friendly authorities" index were Athens, Rome, Florence and
... Pisa. Even Paris scored higher. The only North American city
... down at the bottom was Montreal - where the antipathy for
... non-French speaking visitors was almost tangible.
OTOH, it seems that you are not welcome in Flanders if you speak French - although I'm
still waiting for this point to be proven.
Apr 11th 2007, 9:01 am
#47
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 10:54:30 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
>On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, in rec.travel.europe, Alan S <[email protected]>
>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>
> ... was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
> ...
> ... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
> ...
> ... >I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
> ... >admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
> ... >life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
> ...
> ... As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
> ... what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
> ...
> ... There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
> ... friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
> ... tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
> ... I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
> ... put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
> ... into the economy.
> ...
> ... For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
> ... CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
> ... and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
> ... Chinese.
> ...
> ... In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
> ... Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
> ... understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
> ... things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
> ... hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
> ... signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
> ... were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
> ...
> ... But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
> ... were so famous every child is aware of them - the
> ... authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
> ... their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
> ... don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
> ... smoke it."
>
>Yes! They are home. They do as they like. I applaud them.
>
> Because they know that, if you only ever visit
> ... Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
> ... Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
>
>If you can only visit Europe once in your life, you better prepare your trip accordingly -
>or miss it.
>
>(I really don't know how Germany copes... The museums have all the tags written in German
>only. The Louvre is not wanting visitors and all the tags are in French. If some museums
>are bilingual in Italy, I surely missed them.)
Schiphol is the place, nearly all signs are only in English.
--
Martin
>On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, in rec.travel.europe, Alan S <[email protected]>
>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>
> ... was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
> ...
> ... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
> ...
> ... >I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
> ... >admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
> ... >life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
> ...
> ... As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
> ... what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
> ...
> ... There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
> ... friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
> ... tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
> ... I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
> ... put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
> ... into the economy.
> ...
> ... For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
> ... CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
> ... and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
> ... Chinese.
> ...
> ... In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
> ... Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
> ... understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
> ... things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
> ... hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
> ... signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
> ... were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
> ...
> ... But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
> ... were so famous every child is aware of them - the
> ... authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
> ... their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
> ... don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
> ... smoke it."
>
>Yes! They are home. They do as they like. I applaud them.
>
> Because they know that, if you only ever visit
> ... Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
> ... Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
>
>If you can only visit Europe once in your life, you better prepare your trip accordingly -
>or miss it.
>
>(I really don't know how Germany copes... The museums have all the tags written in German
>only. The Louvre is not wanting visitors and all the tags are in French. If some museums
>are bilingual in Italy, I surely missed them.)
Schiphol is the place, nearly all signs are only in English.
--
Martin
Apr 11th 2007, 9:07 am
#48
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 11:01:10 +0200, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 10:54:30 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
...
... >On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, in rec.travel.europe, Alan S <[email protected]>
... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... >
... > ... was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
... > ...
... > ... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
... > ...
... > ... >I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
... > ... >admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
... > ... >life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
... > ...
... > ... As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
... > ... what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
... > ...
... > ... There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
... > ... friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
... > ... tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
... > ... I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
... > ... put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
... > ... into the economy.
... > ...
... > ... For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
... > ... CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
... > ... and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
... > ... Chinese.
... > ...
... > ... In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
... > ... Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
... > ... understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
... > ... things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
... > ... hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
... > ... signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
... > ... were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
... > ...
... > ... But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
... > ... were so famous every child is aware of them - the
... > ... authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
... > ... their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
... > ... don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
... > ... smoke it."
... >
... >Yes! They are home. They do as they like. I applaud them.
... >
... > Because they know that, if you only ever visit
... > ... Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
... > ... Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
... >
... >If you can only visit Europe once in your life, you better prepare your trip accordingly -
... >or miss it.
... >
... >(I really don't know how Germany copes... The museums have all the tags written in German
... >only. The Louvre is not wanting visitors and all the tags are in French. If some museums
... >are bilingual in Italy, I surely missed them.)
...
... Schiphol is the place, nearly all signs are only in English.
Tourists' Paradise?
pp
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 10:54:30 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
...
... >On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, in rec.travel.europe, Alan S <[email protected]>
... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
... >
... > ... was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
... > ...
... > ... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
... > ...
... > ... >I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
... > ... >admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
... > ... >life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
... > ...
... > ... As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
... > ... what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
... > ...
... > ... There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
... > ... friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
... > ... tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
... > ... I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
... > ... put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
... > ... into the economy.
... > ...
... > ... For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
... > ... CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
... > ... and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
... > ... Chinese.
... > ...
... > ... In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
... > ... Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
... > ... understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
... > ... things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
... > ... hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
... > ... signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
... > ... were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
... > ...
... > ... But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
... > ... were so famous every child is aware of them - the
... > ... authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
... > ... their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
... > ... don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
... > ... smoke it."
... >
... >Yes! They are home. They do as they like. I applaud them.
... >
... > Because they know that, if you only ever visit
... > ... Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
... > ... Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
... >
... >If you can only visit Europe once in your life, you better prepare your trip accordingly -
... >or miss it.
... >
... >(I really don't know how Germany copes... The museums have all the tags written in German
... >only. The Louvre is not wanting visitors and all the tags are in French. If some museums
... >are bilingual in Italy, I surely missed them.)
...
... Schiphol is the place, nearly all signs are only in English.
Tourists' Paradise?
pp
Apr 11th 2007, 9:08 am
#49
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
"Deeply Filled Mortician" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote
in message news:[email protected]...
> Make credence recognised that on Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, Alan S
> <[email protected]> has scripted:
>
> I was in Pisa last weekend and it seemed friendly enough to me. What
> aspect didn't you enjoy?
I thought Rome once did have a perception as being tourist-unfriendly but
has done much to dispel that in recent years. The Forum area is much
improved in terms of signage and the Colosseum seems no longer the no-go
area it felt like in the 1980s. Apart from those stupid legionaries and
mimes, of course. Certainly there is more English spoken nowadays and more
Romans were willing to listen to my execrable Italian - albeit with their
faces in a tortured squint - than simply walking away as they once did.
Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore
in message news:[email protected]...
> Make credence recognised that on Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, Alan S
> <[email protected]> has scripted:
>
> I was in Pisa last weekend and it seemed friendly enough to me. What
> aspect didn't you enjoy?
I thought Rome once did have a perception as being tourist-unfriendly but
has done much to dispel that in recent years. The Forum area is much
improved in terms of signage and the Colosseum seems no longer the no-go
area it felt like in the 1980s. Apart from those stupid legionaries and
mimes, of course. Certainly there is more English spoken nowadays and more
Romans were willing to listen to my execrable Italian - albeit with their
faces in a tortured squint - than simply walking away as they once did.
Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore
Apr 11th 2007, 9:10 am
#50
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 11:07:11 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
>On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 11:01:10 +0200, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>
> ... On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 10:54:30 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
> ...
> ... >On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, in rec.travel.europe, Alan S <[email protected]>
> ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
> ... >
> ... > ... was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
> ... > ...
> ... > ... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
> ... > ...
> ... > ... >I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
> ... > ... >admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
> ... > ... >life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
> ... > ... what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
> ... > ... friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
> ... > ... tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
> ... > ... I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
> ... > ... put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
> ... > ... into the economy.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
> ... > ... CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
> ... > ... and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
> ... > ... Chinese.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
> ... > ... Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
> ... > ... understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
> ... > ... things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
> ... > ... hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
> ... > ... signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
> ... > ... were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
> ... > ... were so famous every child is aware of them - the
> ... > ... authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
> ... > ... their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
> ... > ... don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
> ... > ... smoke it."
> ... >
> ... >Yes! They are home. They do as they like. I applaud them.
> ... >
> ... > Because they know that, if you only ever visit
> ... > ... Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
> ... > ... Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
> ... >
> ... >If you can only visit Europe once in your life, you better prepare your trip accordingly -
> ... >or miss it.
> ... >
> ... >(I really don't know how Germany copes... The museums have all the tags written in German
> ... >only. The Louvre is not wanting visitors and all the tags are in French. If some museums
> ... >are bilingual in Italy, I surely missed them.)
> ...
> ... Schiphol is the place, nearly all signs are only in English.
>
>Tourists' Paradise?pp
Make the best of it while you can. After complaints in the Dutch parliament
Dutch will be added to all signs. Good that they worry about the 2% Dutch
minority using Schiphol.
--
Martin
>On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 11:01:10 +0200, in rec.travel.europe, Martin <[email protected]>
>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>
> ... On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 10:54:30 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
> ...
> ... >On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, in rec.travel.europe, Alan S <[email protected]>
> ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
> ... >
> ... > ... was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
> ... > ...
> ... > ... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
> ... > ...
> ... > ... >I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
> ... > ... >admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
> ... > ... >life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
> ... > ... what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
> ... > ... friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
> ... > ... tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
> ... > ... I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
> ... > ... put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
> ... > ... into the economy.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
> ... > ... CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
> ... > ... and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
> ... > ... Chinese.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
> ... > ... Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
> ... > ... understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
> ... > ... things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
> ... > ... hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
> ... > ... signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
> ... > ... were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
> ... > ...
> ... > ... But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
> ... > ... were so famous every child is aware of them - the
> ... > ... authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
> ... > ... their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
> ... > ... don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
> ... > ... smoke it."
> ... >
> ... >Yes! They are home. They do as they like. I applaud them.
> ... >
> ... > Because they know that, if you only ever visit
> ... > ... Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
> ... > ... Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
> ... >
> ... >If you can only visit Europe once in your life, you better prepare your trip accordingly -
> ... >or miss it.
> ... >
> ... >(I really don't know how Germany copes... The museums have all the tags written in German
> ... >only. The Louvre is not wanting visitors and all the tags are in French. If some museums
> ... >are bilingual in Italy, I surely missed them.)
> ...
> ... Schiphol is the place, nearly all signs are only in English.
>
>Tourists' Paradise?
ppMake the best of it while you can. After complaints in the Dutch parliament
Dutch will be added to all signs. Good that they worry about the 2% Dutch
minority using Schiphol.
--
Martin
Apr 11th 2007, 9:12 am
#51
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
Make credence recognised that on Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, Alan S
<[email protected]> has scripted:
>was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
>
>On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
>
>>I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
>>admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
>>life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
>
>As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
>what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
>
>There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
>friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
>tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
>I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
>put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
>into the economy.
>
>For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
>CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
>and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
>Chinese.
That figures. There's bugger all in the way of tourist drawcards in
Brisbane!
>In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
>Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
>understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
>things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
>hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
>signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
>were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
>
>But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
>were so famous every child is aware of them - the
>authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
>their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
>don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
>smoke it." Because they know that, if you only ever visit
>Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
>Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
If you think those places don't give a damn about tourists, try
Russia!! The Russians actively make any trip unnecessarily hard work,
and next to nothing is written in English.
>So, while all (or nearly all) the Italians and Greeks that I
>met were marvellous, the major cities at the bottom of our
>"friendly authorities" index were Athens, Rome, Florence and
>Pisa. Even Paris scored higher. The only North American city
>down at the bottom was Montreal - where the antipathy for
>non-French speaking visitors was almost tangible.
I was in Pisa last weekend and it seemed friendly enough to me. What
aspect didn't you enjoy?
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--
<[email protected]> has scripted:
>was Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
>
>On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 23:22:15 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
>
>>I'm sure you are the first foriner who has ever had this idea. It would be about time to
>>admit that the Greeks are at home and do what they want. If they don't want to make your
>>life easier, put it in your pipe and smoke it.
>
>As we travelled, one of the little things we noticed was
>what we came to think of as the "friendly cities" index.
>
>There seemed to be an inverse relationship between the
>friendliness of a city's bureaucracy and the fame of their
>tourist drawcards. By friendliness I don't mean the people.
>I mean the effort that the local city and state authorities
>put into being helpful to the tourists bringing their cash
>into the economy.
>
>For example, here in Oz many of the street signs in the
>CBD's of Brisbane and the Gold Coast are bilingual - English
>and Japanese. Over the next few years they may even add
>Chinese.
That figures. There's bugger all in the way of tourist drawcards in
Brisbane!
>In cities like Madrid, Granada, Prague and London and even
>Budapest the little extras, like multilingual or clearly
>understood direction and traffic signs were there. Little
>things, like indicators to the location of facilities, or
>hotels etc. In the Alhambra many languages appeared on the
>signs and the walk-around recorded multilingual guide booths
>were obvious and promoted. Similarly in Istanbul.
>
>But in cities where the ancient ruins attracting visitors
>were so famous every child is aware of them - the
>authorities gave the distinct impression that if you came to
>their city and got confused and frustrated then "If they
>don't want to make your life easier, put it in your pipe and
>smoke it." Because they know that, if you only ever visit
>Europe once in your life, you can't leave Athens, or The
>Forum, or Pisa or Florence or Venice off the itinerary.
If you think those places don't give a damn about tourists, try
Russia!! The Russians actively make any trip unnecessarily hard work,
and next to nothing is written in English.
>So, while all (or nearly all) the Italians and Greeks that I
>met were marvellous, the major cities at the bottom of our
>"friendly authorities" index were Athens, Rome, Florence and
>Pisa. Even Paris scored higher. The only North American city
>down at the bottom was Montreal - where the antipathy for
>non-French speaking visitors was almost tangible.
I was in Pisa last weekend and it seemed friendly enough to me. What
aspect didn't you enjoy?
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--
Apr 11th 2007, 9:26 am
#52
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
Following up to "grusl" <[email protected]> :
> Not to mention the Cyprus highway
>exits marked "Exodus."
they're all the ones that lead to Turkish Cyprus?
--
Tim C.
> Not to mention the Cyprus highway
>exits marked "Exodus."
they're all the ones that lead to Turkish Cyprus?
--
Tim C.
Apr 11th 2007, 9:32 am
#53
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 11:26:52 +0200, Tim C. <[email protected]> wrote:
>Following up to "grusl" <[email protected]> :
>
>> Not to mention the Cyprus highway
>>exits marked "Exodus."
>
>
>they're all the ones that lead to Turkish Cyprus?
Last Exit to ...
--
Martin
>Following up to "grusl" <[email protected]> :
>
>> Not to mention the Cyprus highway
>>exits marked "Exodus."
>
>
>they're all the ones that lead to Turkish Cyprus?
Last Exit to ...
--
Martin
Apr 11th 2007, 9:33 am
#54
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
"Deeply Filled Mortician" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote
in message news:[email protected]...
>
> Romans also speak execrable Italian.
It's those Elision fields.
Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore
in message news:[email protected]...
>
> Romans also speak execrable Italian.
It's those Elision fields.
Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore
Apr 11th 2007, 9:35 am
#55
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
"Tim C." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Following up to "grusl" <[email protected]> :
>
>> Not to mention the Cyprus highway
>>exits marked "Exodus."
>
>
> they're all the ones that lead to Turkish Cyprus?
From what I hear of the population shifts, it's probably the opposite.The
northern bit sounds economically dire, though I didn't get there myself.
Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore
news:[email protected]...
> Following up to "grusl" <[email protected]> :
>
>> Not to mention the Cyprus highway
>>exits marked "Exodus."
>
>
> they're all the ones that lead to Turkish Cyprus?
From what I hear of the population shifts, it's probably the opposite.The
northern bit sounds economically dire, though I didn't get there myself.
Cheers,
George W Russell
Bangalore
Apr 11th 2007, 9:37 am
#56
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
Make credence recognised that on Wed, 11 Apr 2007 14:38:54 +0530,
"grusl" <[email protected]> has scripted:
>
>"Deeply Filled Mortician" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote
>in message news:[email protected]...
>> Make credence recognised that on Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, Alan S
>> <[email protected]> has scripted:
>>
>> I was in Pisa last weekend and it seemed friendly enough to me. What
>> aspect didn't you enjoy?
>
>I thought Rome once did have a perception as being tourist-unfriendly but
>has done much to dispel that in recent years. The Forum area is much
>improved in terms of signage and the Colosseum seems no longer the no-go
>area it felt like in the 1980s. Apart from those stupid legionaries and
>mimes, of course. Certainly there is more English spoken nowadays and more
>Romans were willing to listen to my execrable Italian
Romans also speak execrable Italian.
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--
"grusl" <[email protected]> has scripted:
>
>"Deeply Filled Mortician" <deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote
>in message news:[email protected]...
>> Make credence recognised that on Wed, 11 Apr 2007 03:10:08 GMT, Alan S
>> <[email protected]> has scripted:
>>
>> I was in Pisa last weekend and it seemed friendly enough to me. What
>> aspect didn't you enjoy?
>
>I thought Rome once did have a perception as being tourist-unfriendly but
>has done much to dispel that in recent years. The Forum area is much
>improved in terms of signage and the Colosseum seems no longer the no-go
>area it felt like in the 1980s. Apart from those stupid legionaries and
>mimes, of course. Certainly there is more English spoken nowadays and more
>Romans were willing to listen to my execrable Italian
Romans also speak execrable Italian.
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--
Apr 11th 2007, 2:04 pm
#57
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Friendly City Authorities
Alan S wrote:
>
> So, while all (or nearly all) the Italians and Greeks that I
> met were marvellous, the major cities at the bottom of our
> "friendly authorities" index were Athens, Rome, Florence and
> Pisa. Even Paris scored higher. The only North American city
> down at the bottom was Montreal - where the antipathy for
> non-French speaking visitors was almost tangible.
>
It's well over ten years since I last visited Montreal, but as a
non-French-speaker, I found the French-speaking locals very welcoming
and extremely helpful. I did master a few useful phrases, of course,
and I can understand a little bit, both written and spoken slowly.
How long ago were you there?
Sheila
>
> So, while all (or nearly all) the Italians and Greeks that I
> met were marvellous, the major cities at the bottom of our
> "friendly authorities" index were Athens, Rome, Florence and
> Pisa. Even Paris scored higher. The only North American city
> down at the bottom was Montreal - where the antipathy for
> non-French speaking visitors was almost tangible.
>
It's well over ten years since I last visited Montreal, but as a
non-French-speaker, I found the French-speaking locals very welcoming
and extremely helpful. I did master a few useful phrases, of course,
and I can understand a little bit, both written and spoken slowly.
How long ago were you there?
Sheila
Apr 11th 2007, 3:51 pm
#58
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 12:42:19 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 12:05:54 +0200, in rec.travel.europe, Martin
>><[email protected]>
>>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>>
>> ... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 11:55:51 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
>> ...
>> ... >On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 11:51:25 +0200, in rec.travel.europe, Martin
>> <[email protected]>
>> ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>> ... >
>> ... > ... >I never understood why they don't insist on making all the
>> signs
>> ... > ... >bilingual.
>> ... > ...
>> ... > ... Like in Japanese and Greek?
>> ... > ...
>> ... > ... I never understood why people don't make the minimum effort to
>> learn the Greek
>> ... > ... alphabet before going to Greece.
>> ... >
>> ... >Same here. I never understood how they have the nerve to complain,
>> either!!
>> ...
>> ... Yes! They have no shame
)
>>
>>No, really! How hard is it to learn an alphabet of 20 something letters?
>
> Trivial if you learnt most of them in maths already.
> --
My husband and I both studied math, so we already knew the letters, both
upper and lower case (so more than 20). However, on one occasion, the bus
left before we'd finished sounding out its destination.
Marianne
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 12:42:19 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 12:05:54 +0200, in rec.travel.europe, Martin
>><[email protected]>
>>arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>>
>> ... On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 11:55:51 +0200, Magda <magda@eu> wrote:
>> ...
>> ... >On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 11:51:25 +0200, in rec.travel.europe, Martin
>> <[email protected]>
>> ... >arranged some electrons, so they looked like this:
>> ... >
>> ... > ... >I never understood why they don't insist on making all the
>> signs
>> ... > ... >bilingual.
>> ... > ...
>> ... > ... Like in Japanese and Greek?
>> ... > ...
>> ... > ... I never understood why people don't make the minimum effort to
>> learn the Greek
>> ... > ... alphabet before going to Greece.
>> ... >
>> ... >Same here. I never understood how they have the nerve to complain,
>> either!!
>> ...
>> ... Yes! They have no shame
)>>
>>No, really! How hard is it to learn an alphabet of 20 something letters?
>
> Trivial if you learnt most of them in maths already.
> --
My husband and I both studied math, so we already knew the letters, both
upper and lower case (so more than 20). However, on one occasion, the bus
left before we'd finished sounding out its destination.
Marianne
Apr 11th 2007, 4:10 pm
#59
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 08:51:38 -0700, "Mimi" <[email protected]> wrote:
>My husband and I both studied math, so we already knew the letters, both
>upper and lower case (so more than 20). However, on one occasion, the bus
>left before we'd finished sounding out its destination.
)
--
Martin
>My husband and I both studied math, so we already knew the letters, both
>upper and lower case (so more than 20). However, on one occasion, the bus
>left before we'd finished sounding out its destination.
)--
Martin
Apr 11th 2007, 8:10 pm
#60
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Greek Vacation...HELP PLEASE!
On Mon, 9 Apr 2007 14:59:25 +0100, [email protected] wrote
(in article <[email protected]. com>):
> Thanks all!
>
> At this point, based on some advice I have gotten, and things I have
> been reading, our plans have changed. We are now going to try to book
> this trip on our own.
> Before we were going through a travel agent and I suspected the
> pricing we were getting was high...I just didn't know how high it was.
> We have discovered that by booking our air/hotel/trips ourselves we
> can save a LOT.
> Now our plan is to book Air and 2 nights in Athens from here and
> secure a car rental for the next few days of the trip. We plan to
> drive north to Meteora with lots of stopping between.
> The money we think we will be saving not doing a package deal and
> driving ourselves should allow us to do at least the nearby islands
> (maybe Hydra) or even Santorini if time premits. The basic framework
> for the trip still stands but now we will be able to go where and when
> we want around the country.
> I am still a bit nervous about driving in Greece after all I have
> heard about it not being the safest place to drive but the freedom to
> explore more than offsets this slight worry. Even my more nervous wife
> agrees.
> The bottom line is that we are NOT package tour travelers. We explored
> Ireland by car last year and had the time of our lives, mainly due to
> the fact that we were free to change our plans whenever we wanted and
> include or exclude destinations as we learned more about them from the
> locals and info we couldn't get from home.
>
> What do you all think of this? Just an example of the pricing
> difference I am talking about; the travel agent was trying to book us
> passage to Santorini and had us on flights that were $429 to & $379
> return (that's over $800 if you're counting). I was able to get quotes
> of $169 ROUND TRIP by going directly to airlines and ferry companies
> in Greece. I tried this because I read that local booking is the best
> way to get around Greece. So far, that seems to be VERY true.
>
You don't mention when you are planning to go. If possible I would suggest
that you avoid the months of July and August - all the tourist spots in
Greece get very crowded then, accommodation is more expensive and difficult
to find, and the weather is really too hot for pleasurable sight-seeing.
Ferry is the normal way to travel to the islands. I would avoid flying, it
can save a bit of time (but not much considering the time spent waiting for
flights), and Athens airport is not a pleasant place to wait. There is no
need to book ferry tickets in advance, just turn up and go. This applies to
accommodation as well (unless you're going in July/August).
I wouldn't worry about driving in Greece. I have heard and read many
traveller's tales about driving in various countries in Europe. Each one is
described as having the most dangerous, fastest, or reckless drivers
anywhere. In my experience it is just not true. Greek drivers are not
aggressive or particularly fast. If possible I would avoid driving in Athens
however. The traffic is horrendous and parking is impossible.
Considering the very short time you have, I would suggest that you don't try
to do islands, and the mainland, as well as Athens. It's just too much in 10
days. Travelling between the islands by ferry is one of the great Greek
experiences in my opinion. In 10 days you could do 2 or 3 and still leave
time for a day or two in Athens. I would recommend three islands in the
Argo-Saronic group which go south along the Peloponnese coast - Poros, Hydra
and Spetses. They are all within a few hours by ferry from Piraeus, all
totally different in character, and all delightful. There are regular
hydrofoils going between these, but I would recommend the ordinary ferry. It
takes twice the time but is half the price and much more pleasant.
--
Mike Lane (UK North Yorkshire)
To contact me replace invalid with mike underscore lane
(in article <[email protected]. com>):
> Thanks all!
>
> At this point, based on some advice I have gotten, and things I have
> been reading, our plans have changed. We are now going to try to book
> this trip on our own.
> Before we were going through a travel agent and I suspected the
> pricing we were getting was high...I just didn't know how high it was.
> We have discovered that by booking our air/hotel/trips ourselves we
> can save a LOT.
> Now our plan is to book Air and 2 nights in Athens from here and
> secure a car rental for the next few days of the trip. We plan to
> drive north to Meteora with lots of stopping between.
> The money we think we will be saving not doing a package deal and
> driving ourselves should allow us to do at least the nearby islands
> (maybe Hydra) or even Santorini if time premits. The basic framework
> for the trip still stands but now we will be able to go where and when
> we want around the country.
> I am still a bit nervous about driving in Greece after all I have
> heard about it not being the safest place to drive but the freedom to
> explore more than offsets this slight worry. Even my more nervous wife
> agrees.
> The bottom line is that we are NOT package tour travelers. We explored
> Ireland by car last year and had the time of our lives, mainly due to
> the fact that we were free to change our plans whenever we wanted and
> include or exclude destinations as we learned more about them from the
> locals and info we couldn't get from home.
>
> What do you all think of this? Just an example of the pricing
> difference I am talking about; the travel agent was trying to book us
> passage to Santorini and had us on flights that were $429 to & $379
> return (that's over $800 if you're counting). I was able to get quotes
> of $169 ROUND TRIP by going directly to airlines and ferry companies
> in Greece. I tried this because I read that local booking is the best
> way to get around Greece. So far, that seems to be VERY true.
>
You don't mention when you are planning to go. If possible I would suggest
that you avoid the months of July and August - all the tourist spots in
Greece get very crowded then, accommodation is more expensive and difficult
to find, and the weather is really too hot for pleasurable sight-seeing.
Ferry is the normal way to travel to the islands. I would avoid flying, it
can save a bit of time (but not much considering the time spent waiting for
flights), and Athens airport is not a pleasant place to wait. There is no
need to book ferry tickets in advance, just turn up and go. This applies to
accommodation as well (unless you're going in July/August).
I wouldn't worry about driving in Greece. I have heard and read many
traveller's tales about driving in various countries in Europe. Each one is
described as having the most dangerous, fastest, or reckless drivers
anywhere. In my experience it is just not true. Greek drivers are not
aggressive or particularly fast. If possible I would avoid driving in Athens
however. The traffic is horrendous and parking is impossible.
Considering the very short time you have, I would suggest that you don't try
to do islands, and the mainland, as well as Athens. It's just too much in 10
days. Travelling between the islands by ferry is one of the great Greek
experiences in my opinion. In 10 days you could do 2 or 3 and still leave
time for a day or two in Athens. I would recommend three islands in the
Argo-Saronic group which go south along the Peloponnese coast - Poros, Hydra
and Spetses. They are all within a few hours by ferry from Piraeus, all
totally different in character, and all delightful. There are regular
hydrofoils going between these, but I would recommend the ordinary ferry. It
takes twice the time but is half the price and much more pleasant.
--
Mike Lane (UK North Yorkshire)
To contact me replace invalid with mike underscore lane