What do you expect?? The flights are often 50p and sometimes free!

You get what you pay for. If you don't like it - go BA or some other carrier!

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 17:49:26 GMT, [email protected] (Jim Ley) wrote:

    >On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 17:13:26 GMT, "Col" <[email protected]>
    >wrote:
    >>As for the increase - yeah I'd pay it, £50 or so added for an extra 3 inch
    >>or £100 for double,
    >100quid is about what I spend on a weekend away all in, you may be
    >willing to pay it, but most people aren't.

Exactly. Most people aren't.

Which leaves me with no sympathy with those who _demand_ that their
idea of comfort should take precedence over mine.

And even less sympathy with those who pretend that (a) they fit in a
standard size seat, *and* (b) if the seat in front reclines, they'll
suffer grievous injury.

Economy class travel isn't particularly fun or comfortable for most of
us. The market has decided that cheap wins over good.

    >Jim.

Malc.

Miss L. Toe wrote:

    > "Hilary" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    >
    >>>Well said Malc, the last couple of long hauls I took I just wanted to
    >
    > get
    >
    >>my
    >>>head down and skipped the first 'meal' entirely. I reclined the seat
    >
    > just
    >
    >>a
    >>>bit so as not to intrude too much on the person sat behind but enough
    >
    > for
    >
    >>me
    >>>to relax a bit.
    >>>As for the increase - yeah I'd pay it, £50 or so added for an extra 3
    >
    > inch
    >
    >>>or £100 for double, giving 40 inches or so, no problem with me.
    >>But who should pay ?
    >>Me for wanting to recline or the person behind me for wanting knee room ?
    >>and on that subject do the seats in BA WT+ and VS Premium economy (or
    >
    > other
    >
    >>carriers economy+) actually recline any more than their standard seats ?
    >
    >
    >>According to one of my colleagues, all you get is more legroom. So this
    >>means you can politely recline your seat all the way without infringing
    >>too much on the personal space of the person behind you.
    >
    >
    > wrong - its my personal space that my seat was designed to recline into -
    > the person behind is infringing my liberty if he stops me using it :-)
    >
    >


Thus the need for seats that don't recline.


Still I feel that my personal space includes the space immediately above
my person when it is seated in a seat provided by the airline. You have
as much responsibility to respect my personal space as I have to respect
yours. In any case, when you try to drive your seat into my body expect
a response.

britchicknyc <member25442@british_expats.com> wrote:

    >What do you expect?? The flights are often 50p and sometimes free!
    >You get what you pay for. If you don't like it - go BA or some
    >other carrier!

I think that's pretty well what the OP said: she doesn't like it and
intends to use other carriers.

--
PB
The return address has been MUNGED

"Frank F. Matthews" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

    > Thus the need for seats that don't recline.
    > Still I feel that my personal space includes the space immediately above
    > my person when it is seated in a seat provided by the airline. You have
    > as much responsibility to respect my personal space as I have to respect
    > yours. In any case, when you try to drive your seat into my body expect
    > a response.
It is to be hoped that those who recline thier seats get a taste of from the
person in front of them on thier next flight. Just try to go to the
toilet when they have thier seat back into your face.

--
Regards,
David
<><
Please reply to News Group.

"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Just try to go to the
    > toilet when they have thier seat back into your face.
    > --

Of course I should have said get out your seat to go the toilet.

--
Regards,
David
<><
Please reply to News Group.

"David" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >"David" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    > Just try to go to the
    >> toilet when they have thier seat back into your face.
    >> --
    >Of course I should have said get out your seat to go the toilet.

I preferred the first version.

--
PB
The return address has been MUNGED

On Tue, 7 Dec 2004 10:44:34 -0000, "Miss L. Toe"
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >I had the misfortune last weekend to travel on one of those new Ryanair
    >planes with the non-reclining seats, and no-seat back pockets.
    >It was a real pain in the neck ! Especially when trying to have a nap.
    >Also they handed out those plastic coated 'menus', and, with no seat back
    >pocket people put them on the floor and then put their shoes on them, which
    >no doubt had previously trodden in dog-poo at some time. I wonder if they
    >get disinfected after every leg ?
    >The safety announcement even said to read the safety leaflet in the seat
    >back pocket in front of you !
    >Well that was enough for me - that was my last voluntary Ryanair flight.
    >Bye Bye MOL.
You actually want to recline , and - have a nap, on a Ryanscare
flight?
Ryanscare dont fly to anywhere long enough to need a nap, is only a
shorthaul Euro flight, and if you can put up with anything up to
3hours flying without having a nap, then find a full fare carrier and
go business class. Gawds what people want for a next to nil fare.
You ought to have been made to fly Dan Dare and Caledonian 707
Charters to Hong Kong at 189 TOB. then you would have known what
cheap seat flying really was like. You get what you pays for.,

On Tue, 7 Dec 2004 17:42:14 -0000, "Miss L. Toe"
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >"Hilary" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> > Well said Malc, the last couple of long hauls I took I just wanted to
    >get
    >> my
    >> > head down and skipped the first 'meal' entirely. I reclined the seat
    >just
    >> a
    >> > bit so as not to intrude too much on the person sat behind but enough
    >for
    >> me
    >> > to relax a bit.
    >> >
    >> > As for the increase - yeah I'd pay it, £50 or so added for an extra 3
    >inch
    >> > or £100 for double, giving 40 inches or so, no problem with me.
    >> But who should pay ?
    >> Me for wanting to recline or the person behind me for wanting knee room ?
    >> and on that subject do the seats in BA WT+ and VS Premium economy (or
    >other
    >> carriers economy+) actually recline any more than their standard seats ?
    >>According to one of my colleagues, all you get is more legroom. So this
    >>means you can politely recline your seat all the way without infringing
    >>too much on the personal space of the person behind you.
    >wrong - its my personal space that my seat was designed to recline into -
    >the person behind is infringing my liberty if he stops me using it :-)
I wish I was behind you sometime, I would ensure your liberty was
infringed, you would be sent flying forward, and fast - very often,
as I constantly got up to go to the bathroom or for a drink from the
back.

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 21:35:25 GMT, Martin WY <[email protected]> wrote:

    >On Tue, 7 Dec 2004 10:44:34 -0000, "Miss L. Toe"
    ><[email protected]> wrote:
    >>I had the misfortune last weekend to travel on one of those new Ryanair
    >>planes with the non-reclining seats, and no-seat back pockets.
    >>It was a real pain in the neck ! Especially when trying to have a nap.
    >>Also they handed out those plastic coated 'menus', and, with no seat back
    >>pocket people put them on the floor and then put their shoes on them, which
    >>no doubt had previously trodden in dog-poo at some time. I wonder if they
    >>get disinfected after every leg ?
    >>The safety announcement even said to read the safety leaflet in the seat
    >>back pocket in front of you !
    >>Well that was enough for me - that was my last voluntary Ryanair flight.
    >>Bye Bye MOL.
    >You actually want to recline , and - have a nap, on a Ryanscare
    >flight?
    >Ryanscare dont fly to anywhere long enough to need a nap, is only a
    >shorthaul Euro flight, and if you can put up with anything up to
    >3hours flying without having a nap, then find a full fare carrier and
    >go business class. Gawds what people want for a next to nil fare.
    >You ought to have been made to fly Dan Dare

Dan Dare Toulouse-London had the best short haul business class in
Europe, the planes consumed more champagne per mile than kerosene.
--
Martin

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 18:37:19 GMT, "Frank F. Matthews"
<[email protected]> wrote:

[ Snip ]

    >>>According to one of my colleagues, all you get is more legroom. So this
    >>>means you can politely recline your seat all the way without infringing
    >>>too much on the personal space of the person behind you.
    >>
    >>
    >> wrong - its my personal space that my seat was designed to recline into -
    >> the person behind is infringing my liberty if he stops me using it :-)

    >Thus the need for seats that don't recline.

Strange (i.e. utterly bogus) use of the word "need".


    >Still I feel that my personal space includes the space immediately above
    >my person when it is seated in a seat provided by the airline. You have
    >as much responsibility to respect my personal space as I have to respect
    >yours. In any case, when you try to drive your seat into my body expect
    >a response.

Welcome to the whining!

Malc.

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Dan Dare Toulouse-London had the best short haul business class in
    > Europe, the planes consumed more champagne per mile than kerosene.
    > --
    > Martin

Dan Dare used to fly a Comet between NCL and LGW and, where I worked near the
flight path to NCL at the time it went overhead rattling like a bagful of
hammers. Later they replaced it with one of the first BAE146s, on which route I
flew frequently, and that was a very comfortable aircraft.

JohnT

Ryanair is a class on its own. Self defining.

FWIW
Non reclining seats - at the amount of room that is allowed I prefer not to
have the one in front of me recline.
No basket netting / pockets - inconvenient but I can see why.
Harsh colour schemes and hard surfaces - I can see why but if they want the
plane to look like an old-fashioned corporation bus they are succeeding.

OTOH
I get off planes and I look at the carnage around some seats as I leave. I
doubt that animals could leave as much mess as some passengers.
I suggest to Mr Ryanair that he initiates a 'respect' deposit scheme which
would let the operator give us a 'happy' rebate, perhaps at the point at
which we are queing through inadequately staffed passport control or
awaiting a delayed baggage line.



--
John Owens


Fax 44 1509 89 08 22
www.GoodViews.co.uk

"RaT" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > There is a choice and it is called Premium Economy, World Traveller Plus
    > etc etc. As usual every one complains about the seat but is not prepared
    > to pay for seats with more room....You get what you pay for with the
    > airline seats just like everything in this world...and no I don't fly
    > first class everywhere. I have had the pleasure of first class on both
    > shorthaul and longhaul, however this is when on business and the company
    > is paying. I regularly fly longhaul on holidays and I travel economy. On
    > certain routes you can choose an airline with better seat pitch/service
    > over another. Some routes you have no choice in economy but there is
    > always premium. If you don't like it don't fly economy

I fully agree. I've flown Premium Economy on Virgin Atlantic between
Washington and London, and it was well worth about $150 more than straight
steerage. And I've flown Business Class on several airlines to Europe as
well - all on my own nickel. I've flown First Class to Australia from LAX
on Qantas as well and all experiences have been (obviously) excellent. But
if I have a choice of premium economy or straight economy, I'll always pay
for the better legroom and seat width.
    > ">
    >>> NO - minimum seat measurements should be sufficient to allow 99.5% of
    >> adults
    >>> to sit comfortably when the seat in front is fully reclined.
    >> But whilst they are not please spare a thought for me sat behind you.
    >> --
    >

"Hilary" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    >> There is a choice and it is called Premium Economy, World Traveller Plus
    >> etc
    >> etc.
    > On some carriers on some routes. Most routes do *not* have a premium
    > economy service so you're left with economy (a few hundred) or business
    > class (a couple of thousand). Big difference.
True. But that is one consideration when choosing an airline on a given
route. British Airways, BMI, Virgin Atlantic and Eva Air all offer a
"Premium Economy" section, and United still has "Economy Plus" (extra
legroom only). That is a definite consideration for me when flying
internationally.

Jeff

    > Hilary
    >