Americans in Europe
Mar 11th 2004, 1:47 am
#61
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Re: Americans in Europe
On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:43:02 +0200, Markku Grönroos wrote:
>
> "devil" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news
[email protected]...
>> On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:43:21 +0000, nick wrote:
>> > it was not plain text. rich text != plaintext.
>> It was *plain* text. See the header: text/plain. Rich text is some
>> nonstandard Microsoft crap that does not go into Usenet. Certainly not in
>> her article anyway.
> What do you mean by that? RTF is not non standard and it ports into a great
> number of platforms and it is perfectly posssible to send whatever crap in
> whatever format into the Usenet. And some of her texts WERE sent as
> formatted.
rtf is nonstandard. It's proprietary Microsoft crap. Sure it's text.
But no, her article was not rtf. Was not formatted. See the header.
Specifies the article was *plain text.* Using a Korean character set. My
guess is that there must be braindead newsreaders that do weird things in
that situation.
(I look at articles as text. Whenever it's html, it comes to me with all
the tags and all the crap. I don't recall ever have that happen with rtf
tags. Her article came as plain text. Which is what she used, with a
Unix-based newsreader, tin.)
>
> "devil" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news
[email protected]...>> On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:43:21 +0000, nick wrote:
>> > it was not plain text. rich text != plaintext.
>> It was *plain* text. See the header: text/plain. Rich text is some
>> nonstandard Microsoft crap that does not go into Usenet. Certainly not in
>> her article anyway.
> What do you mean by that? RTF is not non standard and it ports into a great
> number of platforms and it is perfectly posssible to send whatever crap in
> whatever format into the Usenet. And some of her texts WERE sent as
> formatted.
rtf is nonstandard. It's proprietary Microsoft crap. Sure it's text.
But no, her article was not rtf. Was not formatted. See the header.
Specifies the article was *plain text.* Using a Korean character set. My
guess is that there must be braindead newsreaders that do weird things in
that situation.
(I look at articles as text. Whenever it's html, it comes to me with all
the tags and all the crap. I don't recall ever have that happen with rtf
tags. Her article came as plain text. Which is what she used, with a
Unix-based newsreader, tin.)
Mar 11th 2004, 1:48 am
#62
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:09:36 +0100, Magda wrote:
> On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:24:50 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Mxsmanic <[email protected]>
> arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :
>
> ... Juliana L Holm writes:
> ...
> ... > It is considered a very romantic city in the US.
> ...
> ... Paris is considered a very romantic city by most of the world.
>
> By those who have chosen to live there ! :-)
I suppose it depends upon one's nose?
> On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:24:50 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Mxsmanic <[email protected]>
> arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :
>
> ... Juliana L Holm writes:
> ...
> ... > It is considered a very romantic city in the US.
> ...
> ... Paris is considered a very romantic city by most of the world.
>
> By those who have chosen to live there ! :-)
I suppose it depends upon one's nose?
Mar 11th 2004, 1:57 am
#63
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
devil <[email protected]> wrote:
> rtf is nonstandard. It's proprietary Microsoft crap. Sure it's text.
> But no, her article was not rtf. Was not formatted. See the header.
> Specifies the article was *plain text.* Using a Korean character set. My
> guess is that there must be braindead newsreaders that do weird things in
> that situation.
> (I look at articles as text. Whenever it's html, it comes to me with all
> the tags and all the crap. I don't recall ever have that happen with rtf
> tags. Her article came as plain text. Which is what she used, with a
> Unix-based newsreader, tin.)
I am posting from tin on a unix box. It cannot post rtf. Can Not
What I think happened is that I replied to something with those fields in the
header, and the fields got carried into my reply.
And yes, some newsreader is seeing that in the header and just assuming I am
posting in some other manner. Or presenting it as html or rtf, and picking
up the thing from the header.
No, I don't check my full headers every time I reply to a post.
Julie
--
Julie
**********
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
> rtf is nonstandard. It's proprietary Microsoft crap. Sure it's text.
> But no, her article was not rtf. Was not formatted. See the header.
> Specifies the article was *plain text.* Using a Korean character set. My
> guess is that there must be braindead newsreaders that do weird things in
> that situation.
> (I look at articles as text. Whenever it's html, it comes to me with all
> the tags and all the crap. I don't recall ever have that happen with rtf
> tags. Her article came as plain text. Which is what she used, with a
> Unix-based newsreader, tin.)
I am posting from tin on a unix box. It cannot post rtf. Can Not
What I think happened is that I replied to something with those fields in the
header, and the fields got carried into my reply.
And yes, some newsreader is seeing that in the header and just assuming I am
posting in some other manner. Or presenting it as html or rtf, and picking
up the thing from the header.
No, I don't check my full headers every time I reply to a post.
Julie
--
Julie
**********
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
Mar 11th 2004, 2:39 am
#64
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Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
"devil" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
> rtf is nonstandard. It's proprietary Microsoft crap. Sure it's text.
> But no, her article was not rtf. Was not formatted. See the header.
> Specifies the article was *plain text.* Using a Korean character set. My
> guess is that there must be braindead newsreaders that do weird things in
> that situation.
It may be so that my reader is interpreting some of the 8-bit korean
characters as functions and parameters.
news
[email protected]...> rtf is nonstandard. It's proprietary Microsoft crap. Sure it's text.
> But no, her article was not rtf. Was not formatted. See the header.
> Specifies the article was *plain text.* Using a Korean character set. My
> guess is that there must be braindead newsreaders that do weird things in
> that situation.
It may be so that my reader is interpreting some of the 8-bit korean
characters as functions and parameters.
Mar 11th 2004, 3:08 am
#65
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
Markku Grönroos writes:
> What do you mean by that? RTF is not non standard and it ports into a great
> number of platforms and it is perfectly posssible to send whatever crap in
> whatever format into the Usenet. And some of her texts WERE sent as
> formatted.
RTF is very esoteric. If you need precise layout, use PDF. If you
don't, use plain text.
--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.
> What do you mean by that? RTF is not non standard and it ports into a great
> number of platforms and it is perfectly posssible to send whatever crap in
> whatever format into the Usenet. And some of her texts WERE sent as
> formatted.
RTF is very esoteric. If you need precise layout, use PDF. If you
don't, use plain text.
--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.
Mar 11th 2004, 3:09 am
#66
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Re: Americans in Europe
Tim Challenger writes:
> Except by those who have been there.
They are often among the most convinced. At least they keep coming
back.
--
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> Except by those who have been there.
They are often among the most convinced. At least they keep coming
back.
--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.
Mar 11th 2004, 3:09 am
#67
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Re: Americans in Europe
Magda writes:
> By those who have chosen to live there !
And by the 25,000,000 people who visit the city each year.
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> By those who have chosen to live there !
And by the 25,000,000 people who visit the city each year.
--
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Mar 11th 2004, 3:10 am
#68
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Re: Americans in Europe
Tim Challenger writes:
> The four hours I spent in New York were four hours too many. The view from
> the top of the WTC was impressive though, and the mounted policemen were a
> nice touch.
The WTC must have had large elevators, or the police officers had very
well trained horses.
--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.
> The four hours I spent in New York were four hours too many. The view from
> the top of the WTC was impressive though, and the mounted policemen were a
> nice touch.
The WTC must have had large elevators, or the police officers had very
well trained horses.
--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.
Mar 11th 2004, 5:12 am
#69
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Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
IF you are going to the Alps, arguably there isn't much else to compare
in the rest of Europe................ After the Alps the next stop
would be the Canadian Rockies I would think.
Similarly, after the Grand Canyon, not much else in the US can compare,
except perhaps the Collegiate Peaks Wilderness Area of Colorado.
--
wf.
Juliana L Holm wrote:
>
> New York and the Grand Canyon at least, are two of the highlights of this
> country, although judging the United States by that would be like judging
> Europe by Paris and the Alps. Think of how much you would miss.
> Julie
> --
> Julie
> **********
> Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
> http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
--
wf.
Wayne Flowers
Randee Greenwald
[email protected]
in the rest of Europe................ After the Alps the next stop
would be the Canadian Rockies I would think.
Similarly, after the Grand Canyon, not much else in the US can compare,
except perhaps the Collegiate Peaks Wilderness Area of Colorado.
--
wf.
Juliana L Holm wrote:
>
> New York and the Grand Canyon at least, are two of the highlights of this
> country, although judging the United States by that would be like judging
> Europe by Paris and the Alps. Think of how much you would miss.
> Julie
> --
> Julie
> **********
> Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
> http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
--
wf.
Wayne Flowers
Randee Greenwald
[email protected]
Mar 11th 2004, 5:35 am
#70
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
Not many other MOUNTAINS can compare, but surely there are other lovely
and interesting thing. Zion and Bryce Canyon in the west, the beautiful
Appalachian Trail; historic Boston and Philadelphia, Exciting New Orleans,
the mighty Mississippi River, the ST. Lawrence Seaway, the costal Drive up
California's coast. Lots of fascinating stuff in the US
The Bay of Naples, the exquisite landscape of Tuscany, the incredible ancient
Cathedrals in France and Germany, the Renaissance ARt of Italy, the canals
of Amsterdam (and Venice of course) the Keukenhof Gardens at Lisse, the
medieval towns in Germany, the splendor of the WAvel Castle, and the Tower
of London, and Burg Eltz; the taste of fine sparkling champagne in Epernay,
prosecco in Italy, Sekt in Germany.
Yes, the Grand Canyon and the Alps are special places, and a visitor to the
US/Europe should certainly consider them, BUT there is so much more richness
in these places that can be experienced! And most travellers don't think
beyond the big ticket places.
randee <[email protected]> wrote:
> IF you are going to the Alps, arguably there isn't much else to compare
> in the rest of Europe................ After the Alps the next stop
> would be the Canadian Rockies I would think.
> Similarly, after the Grand Canyon, not much else in the US can compare,
> except perhaps the Collegiate Peaks Wilderness Area of Colorado.
> --
> wf.
> Juliana L Holm wrote:
>>
>> New York and the Grand Canyon at least, are two of the highlights of this
>> country, although judging the United States by that would be like judging
>> Europe by Paris and the Alps. Think of how much you would miss.
>> Julie
>> --
>> Julie
>> **********
>> Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
>> http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
> --
> wf.
> Wayne Flowers
> Randee Greenwald
> [email protected]
--
Julie
**********
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
and interesting thing. Zion and Bryce Canyon in the west, the beautiful
Appalachian Trail; historic Boston and Philadelphia, Exciting New Orleans,
the mighty Mississippi River, the ST. Lawrence Seaway, the costal Drive up
California's coast. Lots of fascinating stuff in the US
The Bay of Naples, the exquisite landscape of Tuscany, the incredible ancient
Cathedrals in France and Germany, the Renaissance ARt of Italy, the canals
of Amsterdam (and Venice of course) the Keukenhof Gardens at Lisse, the
medieval towns in Germany, the splendor of the WAvel Castle, and the Tower
of London, and Burg Eltz; the taste of fine sparkling champagne in Epernay,
prosecco in Italy, Sekt in Germany.
Yes, the Grand Canyon and the Alps are special places, and a visitor to the
US/Europe should certainly consider them, BUT there is so much more richness
in these places that can be experienced! And most travellers don't think
beyond the big ticket places.
randee <[email protected]> wrote:
> IF you are going to the Alps, arguably there isn't much else to compare
> in the rest of Europe................ After the Alps the next stop
> would be the Canadian Rockies I would think.
> Similarly, after the Grand Canyon, not much else in the US can compare,
> except perhaps the Collegiate Peaks Wilderness Area of Colorado.
> --
> wf.
> Juliana L Holm wrote:
>>
>> New York and the Grand Canyon at least, are two of the highlights of this
>> country, although judging the United States by that would be like judging
>> Europe by Paris and the Alps. Think of how much you would miss.
>> Julie
>> --
>> Julie
>> **********
>> Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
>> http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
> --
> wf.
> Wayne Flowers
> Randee Greenwald
> [email protected]
--
Julie
**********
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
Mar 11th 2004, 5:41 am
#71
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Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:48:37 GMT, in rec.travel.europe, devil <[email protected]>
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :
... On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:09:36 +0100, Magda wrote:
...
... > On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:24:50 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Mxsmanic <[email protected]>
... > arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :
... >
... > ... Juliana L Holm writes:
... > ...
... > ... > It is considered a very romantic city in the US.
... > ...
... > ... Paris is considered a very romantic city by most of the world.
... >
... > By those who have chosen to live there ! :-)
...
... I suppose it depends upon one's nose?
If you know a capital that smell like roses, I would like to know where it is.
arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :
... On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:09:36 +0100, Magda wrote:
...
... > On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:24:50 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Mxsmanic <[email protected]>
... > arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :
... >
... > ... Juliana L Holm writes:
... > ...
... > ... > It is considered a very romantic city in the US.
... > ...
... > ... Paris is considered a very romantic city by most of the world.
... >
... > By those who have chosen to live there ! :-)
...
... I suppose it depends upon one's nose?
If you know a capital that smell like roses, I would like to know where it is.
Mar 11th 2004, 8:44 am
#72
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:03:42 GMT, Tim Challenger
<"timothy(dot)challenger(at)apk(dot)at"> wrote:
>On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:04:24 +0000, Keith Anderson wrote:
>> On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:34:21 GMT, devil <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:28:05 +0000, Juliana L Holm wrote:
>>>> Mxsmanic <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>> Juliana L Holm writes:
>>>>
>>>>>> And for Americans who view any European Television at all, Europe is England.
>>>>
>>>>> I don't think that Americans perceive England as part of Europe (neither
>>>>> do many people in England, for that matter). "Europe" means the other
>>>>> countries where English is not spoken. England is a special case.
>>>>
>>>> Hmm. I disagree.
>>>>
>>>> I think many people think of England as being in Europe.
>>>Including even many Brits, I would think.
>>
>> As to those Brits who don't, I often wonder where they think they
>> originate - outer space perhaps?
Hmm - dodn't put that very well, did I - I meant that if one looks at
linguistic, historical and cultural heritage, to say that the British
are not European is a bit daft.
>In Britain. Obviously.
<"timothy(dot)challenger(at)apk(dot)at"> wrote:
>On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:04:24 +0000, Keith Anderson wrote:
>> On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:34:21 GMT, devil <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:28:05 +0000, Juliana L Holm wrote:
>>>> Mxsmanic <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>> Juliana L Holm writes:
>>>>
>>>>>> And for Americans who view any European Television at all, Europe is England.
>>>>
>>>>> I don't think that Americans perceive England as part of Europe (neither
>>>>> do many people in England, for that matter). "Europe" means the other
>>>>> countries where English is not spoken. England is a special case.
>>>>
>>>> Hmm. I disagree.
>>>>
>>>> I think many people think of England as being in Europe.
>>>Including even many Brits, I would think.
>>
>> As to those Brits who don't, I often wonder where they think they
>> originate - outer space perhaps?
Hmm - dodn't put that very well, did I - I meant that if one looks at
linguistic, historical and cultural heritage, to say that the British
are not European is a bit daft.
>In Britain. Obviously.
Mar 11th 2004, 9:22 am
#73
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 21:44:57 +0000, Keith Anderson
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Hmm - dodn't put that very well, did I - I meant that if one looks at
>linguistic, historical and cultural heritage, to say that the British
>are not European is a bit daft.
Oh, well, looked at in light of "linguistic, historical and
cultural heritage", the United States and Canada are European.
And Australia. And New Zealand.
************* DAVE HATUNEN ([email protected]) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Hmm - dodn't put that very well, did I - I meant that if one looks at
>linguistic, historical and cultural heritage, to say that the British
>are not European is a bit daft.
Oh, well, looked at in light of "linguistic, historical and
cultural heritage", the United States and Canada are European.
And Australia. And New Zealand.
************* DAVE HATUNEN ([email protected]) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
Mar 11th 2004, 9:48 am
#74
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
Hatunen <[email protected]> wrote:
>On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 21:44:57 +0000, Keith Anderson
><[email protected]> wrote:
>>Hmm - dodn't put that very well, did I - I meant that if one looks at
>>linguistic, historical and cultural heritage, to say that the British
>>are not European is a bit daft.
>Oh, well, looked at in light of "linguistic, historical and
>cultural heritage", the United States and Canada are European.
>And Australia. And New Zealand.
That is considered a problem by the descendants of those who inhabited
those places before the European invasion.
--
PB
The return address has been MUNGED
>On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 21:44:57 +0000, Keith Anderson
><[email protected]> wrote:
>>Hmm - dodn't put that very well, did I - I meant that if one looks at
>>linguistic, historical and cultural heritage, to say that the British
>>are not European is a bit daft.
>Oh, well, looked at in light of "linguistic, historical and
>cultural heritage", the United States and Canada are European.
>And Australia. And New Zealand.
That is considered a problem by the descendants of those who inhabited
those places before the European invasion.
--
PB
The return address has been MUNGED
Mar 11th 2004, 10:52 am
#75
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Americans in Europe
randee writes:
> Similarly, after the Grand Canyon, not much else in the US can compare,
> except perhaps the Collegiate Peaks Wilderness Area of Colorado.
The Grand Canyon in person looked just like the Grand Canyon in
postcards to me, except that it was in three dimensions, and it was
expensive and time-consuming to reach, and a single company had a
monopoly on all lodging and services in the area, for which it charged a
king's ransom. Postcards are more practical.
--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.
> Similarly, after the Grand Canyon, not much else in the US can compare,
> except perhaps the Collegiate Peaks Wilderness Area of Colorado.
The Grand Canyon in person looked just like the Grand Canyon in
postcards to me, except that it was in three dimensions, and it was
expensive and time-consuming to reach, and a single company had a
monopoly on all lodging and services in the area, for which it charged a
king's ransom. Postcards are more practical.
--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.
