Revolted.

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Old Jun 5th 2014, 11:10 pm
  #286  
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Default Re: Revolted.

There is a massive chasm between something having unique properties and "defying physical laws"
Water's unique properties are as a direct result of " physical laws"

I'm not disputing anyone's right to whatever spiritual beliefs they may have but there is no excuse for inaccurately ascribing documented scientific phenomena as " defying natural law"
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Old Jun 5th 2014, 11:11 pm
  #287  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by Novocastrian
The problem here is that this universe plopped into random existence just the way it is. As you say, others are no doubt plopping "here and there", " now and again" all over the "place".

Except all those terms have no meaning, apart from here.
Even this planet didnt pop into existence "just the way it is". 2 billion years ago you would not have been able to breathe the atmosphere and all the continents were one land mass.

The universe is constantly changing, all be it in a way that follows prescribed rules that we are slowly figuring out. Maybe not so slowly given the progress we have made in the last 500 years of our 200000 year existence as modern man.

Many things have fallen into place in order for us to be here discussing this.

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Old Jun 5th 2014, 11:13 pm
  #288  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by Zoe Bell
There is a massive chasm between something having unique properties and "defying physical laws"
Water's unique properties are as a direct result of " physical laws"

I'm not disputing anyone's right to whatever spiritual beliefs they may have but there is no excuse for inaccurately ascribing documented scientific phenomena as " defying natural law"
So why does nothing else follow waters particular set of laws?
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Old Jun 5th 2014, 11:18 pm
  #289  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by Alan2005
I get what you are saying, but you are straying into new age mysticism of the kind that hippies who've discovered (but don't understand) quantum mechanics come up with.
I have no truck with new age mysticism, pyramid power, holistic medicine or any of that, I am mearly struck with wonder at how we come to be here, stardust, thrown together by unfathomable good fortune over incredible periods of time, aware of our place in the universe, and able to look into the future to see the extinction of all life on our own planet, sooner or later.

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Old Jun 5th 2014, 11:20 pm
  #290  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Because water is quite an interesting molecule in such that it is quite polar. Thus allowing quite strong hydrogen bonding between adjacent molecules.

I've given you a clue as to what to research.

In the same vein mercury is unique because it is a metal but liquid.
Carbon is unique because its electron structure allows for very stable compounds.

Water has interesting properties. They affect us for sure but it is hardly unique in having "unique properties"
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Old Jun 5th 2014, 11:23 pm
  #291  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by Zoe Bell
It doesn't ignore it.
Google hydrogen bonding.

A well known " physical law" to use your own phrase.
Well documented
Well understood.

No mystery.
I have a degree in this stuff, no need to google.
Still waiting for an example of one other compound out of all the near infinate possible combinations of atoms that happens to behave in a way that makes it float and hold in the heat of the water underneath. If that didnt happen then all the water on the planet would long since have frozen. No atmosphere, no protection from solar radiation. No life. For us anyway.

Jolly good luck for us. One of many bits of good luck for us. like our planet being the right distance from the sun so we are not too hot or cold, and having a satellite moon that stirs up the oceans contents rather than letting them stagnate.

A lot of things came right for us.

Last edited by iaink; Jun 5th 2014 at 11:28 pm.
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Old Jun 5th 2014, 11:30 pm
  #292  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by iaink
Even this planet didnt pop into existence "just the way it is". 2 billion years ago you would not have been able to breathe the atmosphere and all the continents were one land mass.

The universe is constantly changing, all be it in a way that follows prescribed rules that we are slowly figuring out. Maybe not so slowly given the progress we have made in the last 500 years of our 200000 year existence as modern man.

Many things have fallen into place in order for us to be here discussing this.
Grandma, eggs, suck.

Universes plop into existence, once that happens planets and elephants are inevitable.
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Old Jun 5th 2014, 11:32 pm
  #293  
 
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by iaink
I have a degree in this stuff, no need to google.
Still waiting for an example of one other compound out of all the near infinate possible combinations of atoms that happens to behave in a way that makes it float and hold in the heat of the water underneath. If that didnt happen then all the water on the planet would long since have frozen. No atmosphere, no protection from solar radiation. No life. For us anyway.

Jolly good luck for us. One of many bits of good luck for us. like our planet being the right distance from the sun so we are not too hot or cold, and having a satellite moon that stirs up the oceans contents rather than letting them stagnate.

A lot of things came right for us.
This is the banana argument isn't it?
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Old Jun 6th 2014, 12:08 am
  #294  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by Alan2005
This is the banana argument isn't it?
It's painful.
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Old Jun 6th 2014, 12:50 am
  #295  
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Default Re: Revolted.

If you guys are so jaded and cynical that you have no wonder at the fact that our existence is far more amazing and unlikely than simply being fashioned by some bearded supernatural body and left unfettered by his reappearance for thousands of years, then I actually feel a little sorry for you.
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Old Jun 6th 2014, 1:22 am
  #296  
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Default Re: Revolted.

And again you make an incorrect assumption.
Just because you strive to understand things does not make them any less wondrous to me.

I never said that the universe wasn't incredible, beautiful , fantastic. I just take exception to you assigning near supernatural properties to well documented scientific phenomena.

Understanding the underlying principles behind things adds beauty not detrac s from it.

I personally feel sorry for people who are willing to dismiss the wonders of science as gods will. They are missing out on so much beauty
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Old Jun 6th 2014, 2:05 am
  #297  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by Zoe Bell
And again you make an incorrect assumption.
Just because you strive to understand things does not make them any less wondrous to me.

I never said that the universe wasn't incredible, beautiful , fantastic. I just take exception to you assigning near supernatural properties to well documented scientific phenomena.

Understanding the underlying principles behind things adds beauty not detrac s from it.

I personally feel sorry for people who are willing to dismiss the wonders of science as gods will. They are missing out on so much beauty
I was simply hypothesizing about why some people might see within this information room for god to have figured. I am as agnostic as the next man, but my sense of wonder at the circumstances of our existence is undiminished.
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Old Jun 6th 2014, 2:49 am
  #298  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by Zoe Bell
And again you make an incorrect assumption.
Just because you strive to understand things does not make them any less wondrous to me.

I never said that the universe wasn't incredible, beautiful , fantastic. I just take exception to you assigning near supernatural properties to well documented scientific phenomena.

Understanding the underlying principles behind things adds beauty not detrac s from it.

I personally feel sorry for people who are willing to dismiss the wonders of science as gods will. They are missing out on so much beauty
Exactly how I feel. It's so amazing.
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Old Jun 6th 2014, 9:35 am
  #299  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by iaink
So why does nothing else follow waters particular set of laws?
Because of the spacing of the two protons in the orbits around the oxygen atom, lots of this has to do with the proximity and the filling of the electron orbits

Way beyond the understanding of engineers, but basic high school (‘o’ level) chemistry
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Old Jun 6th 2014, 12:49 pm
  #300  
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Default Re: Revolted.

Originally Posted by MikeUK
Because of the spacing of the two protons in the orbits around the oxygen atom, lots of this has to do with the proximity and the filling of the electron orbits

Way beyond the understanding of engineers, but basic high school (‘o’ level) chemistry
so why not Li2O, or Na2O and so on.
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