PCness gone MAD?!!
 

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

I blame the teachers ;)

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Yes and it would have been good if the writer of the book actually had a brain!

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OMG where do they get things like that. they say that a toddler hasnt the developmental capability to share but can be racist. whats it coming to.

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

My three year old will say 'yuck' to almost all food put in front of her...

Enlightened in knowledge that I have probably bred a racist another failing of my parenting skills comes to light!

Lorraine G

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Me to then :blink:

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I blame the last tory govt.:p

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Ha this is NOT news to me -
I can give 2 examples of incidents that I know of - one was a a friend of mines son who is now 7, was 5 atthe time in Reception class - His mum got called into school for her son making Racist comments ( she is far from racist) she was informed that her son had called another child a Paki and that as a result his name would be placed on a 'racist' register throughout his school time - yes right up to leaving at 16 / 18 - the school board and eduction board were involved and she felt awful. When she got home she spoke to her 5 yr old and he was adamant all he had said was " are you from Pakistani" ( yes the work pakistani was used not Pakistan - not my error) - she went back to the school and played hell - wanted to know who had heard him use the work Paki - the evidence had come from another 5 yr old who had gone to the teacher and said along the lines of " awwww Tom called ' name unknown' a paki" THAT was the evidence the Teachers had acted on and this childs name had been placed on a RAcist register at 5 years old!!!! - needless to say she contested it and they removed his name - with a very stern warning about if there were other incidents it would go on and stay on - obviously there havent been but she says that she hates going to the school for anything now as she feels they look at her like SHE is a racist.

The other is another friend of mine ( opposite story now) her daughter is half Turkish, born and raised in UK now aged 11. Yas is a stunning girl with olive skin and very long black hair. She has never seen herself a being any different to anyone else. About 3 weeks ago her Mum called me quite stunned - she had been called into school by the staff - She was sat down by the headmaster and appologised to over and over - he explained that Yas had been called a 'Paki' by two girls in her class during an argument. he went on to explain that they had called the Education Board immediately and that both girls parents were being interviewd as they spoke. He asked if this was ok with her, and had they acted quick enough - she sort of sat there a bit blank and said 'yes'. The following day they informed her that both girls had been put on the 'racist register' and asked again if she was happy with the outcome.
My friend wasnt sure what to make of it all - her daughter was fine, far to street wise and secure in herself to give a hoot about what they had said - she just said they were stupid coz she wasn't pakistani, she was English. Tracey felt that this register was a bit much.

Dont get me wrong I know they have to do something to stop racism - but to put a 5 yr old on a racist register is a bit much!!!!!!!!

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My goodness that is insanse! I wouldn't be a teacher for all the money in the world though - they must have to walk such a fine line nowadays with all this PC rubbish.

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A racist utterance from a toddler suggests a racist home environment, that's all, nothing there to get in a tizzy about.

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

Its quite obviously true though, if a 3 year old wont eat Brussels sprouts they are racist toward Belgium people, and Swedes, well they are so blond and beautiful we all hate them.

I started our on Vindaloos (extra hot) at age 6 months, just because I didn't want them to be racist.

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I wouldn't agree there......

Children are exactly that; children, and they repeat things. I can remember saying the same kind of thing to a black kid in my primary school class when I was about 5 or 6 and I most certainly wasn't brought up in a rascist household.

The UK is in dire straights at the minute and the race issue is a card that is played far too easily these days.

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That would just get you noisy and smelly evacuations. Teaching the child not to eat curry because it's the food of a lesser race would be more likely to produce the kind of comments and behaviour mentioned in the, admittedly trivial, article.

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Please god tell me you're joking :D

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

I don't think it does necessarily suggest a racist home environment, and it's that kind of assumption that can lead (as Tanah relates) to children being placed unnecessarily on a "racist register" to follow them all through their schooling. It's just as likely that either a comment was misheard, or that the child has picked up a word without understanding its meaning, or connotation, as part of the process of learning language.

Kids call each other all sorts of things without understanding the meaning of the words themselves. Take another form of insult as an example. Every successive euphemism for physical or mental handicap has been adopted as a schoolyard insult almost before it has been dreamed up by politicians. When I was a kid the insult of choice was "spazz" or occasionally "flid;" my younger sister's peers had adopted "special;" my Canadian nephews insulted each other by suggesting they travelled on the "short school bus;" I humbly suggest that kids of 5 or 6 don't really understand the nature of the insult they're using, they're just using it because they've heard it elsewhere (as likely in the playground or on TV as from a parent or older sibling).

I agree, though, that there's "nothing there to get in a tizzy about."

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Sorry mate...what utter (left wing, PC) bollocks|!:frown:

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

Thank you for your considered (and refined) argument.

I think my, then very young, children's attitude that everyone who is not Swiss is an inferior class of being was a direct consequence of their home environment. I can well see that the sort of expressions they used to refer to the great unwashed would indicate the attitudes they heard daily at home. Similarly, I would think that a child raised in the sort of home where the cross of St George or the Confederate flag flies might give away the attitudes of its parents by expressing views on foreign foods or cultures. Where else would very small children learn such things?

Oakvillian finds "suggests" too strong, I can't think of a weaker synonym, the point though is that one utterance from a child should not be enough to have the parents pillioried, a pattern of such utterances might.

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

This is exactly right - in any situation, not just racism. If clues and pointers lead to certain conclusions then they should be listened for.

How do you think a lot of cases of abuse are hilighted? Not from one child saying mummy didn,t give me any dinner, more from a build up of such events.

However a tricky thing to do at such a young age is for a teacher to recondition a childs way of thinking should they be in a situation where they can blatantly see that a child is being taught "certain" things.

You will not get a 4 or 5 year old to go against their parents for fear of punishment if they are that way inclined

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

:eek:
You honestly believe it is right for a teacher to 'recondition' a childs way of thinking????
For gods sake that is tantamount to suggesting brainwashing.
Are you telling me there are NO racist teachers\homophobic teachers\teachers with paedophilic tendencies? Should these teachers be allowed to 'recondition' a childs way of thinking? Surely a teacher is there to educate? In the earlier years to encourage a child to explore, then to impart basic building blocks of knowledge (mathematical\grammatical\scientific 'rules') and finally to encourage students to question.

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No teachers are there to be blamed for all of society's problems!!;)

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No teachers are there to be blamed for all of society's problems!

or

No, teachers are there to be blamed for all of society's problems!

:confused:

More PC bollocks from the UK then. Quell Surprise. The road to hell is truly paved with good intentions.

I wouldn't take anything a five year old says too seriously. To react to a single utterance is clearly lunacy, and to judge any kid of by what they will and wont eat doubly so. God knows, I try and get mine to eat indian food, they like Naan, but curry itself is still yucky. They love chinese though...so does that make them racist or not I wonder.

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Whilst a student is at school a teachers job is to teach - be it lessons, life, right or wrong.

If a child comes to school and calls a chinese kid yellow zipper head (as an example just something I heard the other day so no offence meant) does this mean that the teacher should say nothing then:confused:

No I think not, the teacher (or whichever responsible adult is around at the time is morally I would think obliged to point out that that is wrong and will cause offence to the recipient.

In other words reconditioning their way of talking to or about other people (ok reconditioning is probably the wrong word however re-educating would be better).

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the latter :)

Also for the amazingly poor literacy standards today !!

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Our Nanny state strikes again! :(

While I don't condone racism I'm fed up with the way that this Government keeps meddling. You peeps who escaped to Canada are the lucky ones. At least you have space, we're crammed onto this ******' island :eek:

The all knowing Brown told us yesterday that he thinks we waste too much food :zzz: I think not with the rapidly rising food prices. I can barely afford to drive to the supermarket because of the high cost of fuel. We've been told to also start growing our own veg, which I've done. Mind you we will have runner beans galore because that's all I've managed to grow with our rotten summer so far :blink:

There was guzzleguts (Brown) at the summit gorging with the other leaders on an 8 course meal (I'm lead to believe). Who in their right mind can honestly eat 8 courses? :eek:

We have more CUTV (CCTV) cameras than everyone else, it's absolutely crazy. It's turned into nationwide BB over here.

Sorry, I went on a bit there didn't I :o

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

Er, me.

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There's always one :rofl:

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(not of varying types of ale)

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Ha! I was wondering how I'd cope with having a unique beverage per course.

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

and me! Probably not any more these days, but when I was younger and fitter and taking lots and lots of exercise I once attended a Victorian banquet, with recipes mostly taken from Mrs Beeton, I think. If memory serves, the courses went something like:

Soup (mulligatawny)
fish (poached cod)
poultry (fricassee of chicken)
meat (leg of mutton)
game (pheasant)
pudding (cabinet pudding)
dessert (fresh fruit)
ices and coffee

each course had potatoes, vegetables, thick sauces, etc to go with. It was hard work but most of us struggled manfully through to the end!

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I don't care for exercise but would have no trouble with that lot. I think I'll suggest they put on something like that as a museum fundraiser whenever they finish recreating the 1860 house.

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Mulligatawny and fricassee? Yuk! I wouldn't let my children eat any of that foreign filth.

;)

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David Cameron made a speech yesterday in Glasgow East, the jist of it was that 'society' was nowadays afraid to use terms like Bad, Right, Wrong... basically it was a rail against PC-ness.

I am certainly no Tory, but this is what constantly annoys me about the liberal left - good and decent intentions are flogged to death and end up being abused (a la Viz character Millie Tant) which simply eventually alienates ordinary people.

Now, if David Cameron starts to sound almost plausible when he talks against PC, then that tells you it's gone waaaay too far.

I've got to go on a "Respectful Workplace" course shortly. <shudders>. In my NSH opinion, people here spend more energy trying not to offend people when in fact they would be better off poking them repeatedly in the chest and telling them that they are f***ing clueless and a complete waste of oxygen.

PS. When I was at primary school we used to bring in 2p for the "Black Babies." We thought we were being nice and kind children. Turns out we were just being racist monsters perpetuating imperial stereotypes. I bet all the poor kids who are still starving in Africa today are happy that we show a bit more respect and don't collect for the Black Babies any more.

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Oak - at school we all called each other JOey - as in Joey Deacon, the mentally disabled (oh god can you say that now?) who was given a new house, from Blue Peter.

MMC - yellow zipper head?? ok I can see the yellow connotations - but zipper head???

did you see the news headline last week that local Uk Councils are not aloowed to say "brain storming" any more as it is offensive to epilieptics.

National Epiliepsy society said - "No its not!"

tis a mad mad world!

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It was 'flid' and 'mong' at my school. What charming children we were.

Re: PCness gone MAD?!!
 

Was just having a 5 min break and thinking about this whole thread (god i'm sad) but i'll explain why.

My ex husband was a racist - born on a council estate and will stay on a council estate. Goes to work goes down the pub pays the bills watches the footie and goes to Spain on his holidays (get the picture)

Not a bad person but he was bought up to believe (in his words) Swallows and Blackbirds don't mix. Whenever the kids were at school and would mention a friends name that was not John Andrew or Fred he would say things like "bloody ******** (insert racist name of differing origin here), what you talking to them for"

The kids would always say "because they're my friends" and he would mutter something under his breath.

Now they really look up to him and he would do absolutely anything for them as any dad would - but how can you change the mind of someone like this who believes to the core that he is right.

The kids would never do anything to upset him and my oldest daughter saw a coloured lad last year and she said to me oooooh he's nice mum, so I said well go on then go for it!!! She said "oh my god dad would go mad, couldn't do that"

I suppose I wasn't strong enough when we were together - or just didn't want to upset him really - to argue the case about his prejudices (its why we eventually split as he caused a scene at a work do when I was talking to a colleague (male) who was studying for a degree or other - anyway

Like I say - how can you change kids perception when they look up to a parent. If the child is put on a racist register, someone like my ex would see it as being something to brag to his mates about. How stupid is that - but people like this exist and I think it would just go a way to making the devide stronger between kids / parents or kids / classmates.

I think it would be great if kids could do mini "exchanges" - stay with a family of different backgrounds to their own to show that we are not so different.

Sorry to waffle just had to get that off my chest :o

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It would be a sad sad world if no one believed in rehabilitation.

I'm a sad soft pinko lefty, and honestly believe that it is possible with patience and persistence to change inbred attitudes, otherwise we would all grow up believing in the same things as our parents, and there would be no hope of a better future for our own kids.


So having said that its a nice idea to try and identify and educate schoolyard racists, but if (and the media does like to exaggerate things) they are picking kids based solely on not liking curry, or mimicking a few words they dont really understand, then thats overreaching to put it mildly.

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I know how you feel abut it - however imo attitudes that run so deep could only be changed by experience.

Heres a story for you and its a true one - and goes a little way to showing that people can change attitudes.

An acquaintence (loosely used) was a member of one of those horrible gangs (ala combat 18 / bnp type thingys ) in Leicester and was getting a bit miffed at the extent some of the extreme members were taking their beliefs.

Whilst drinking with these guys in a well known haunt in town he'd said he'd had enough and wanted out. Apparently they just all attacked him - it spilled out onto the street (this guy is a huge skinhead bouncer type person) and they just carried on laying into him. They left him unconcious / bleeding and went back into the pub.

The only people that stopped by, stayed with him, called an ambulance were 2 asian guys (who knew who the "victim" on the floor was).

Til the day I left Leicester they were still good friends although the original bloke had to move out of his home because of violence from his ex buddies.

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Its nuts isnt it. Isn't that where the authorities should be concentrating their attention, at the hard core nutters, as well as preventing kids getting to that stage? Just seems wrong no one got sent down for that kind of violence, but I guess it would take an insane amount of courage to press charges / give evidence under the circumstances.

I agree though that sometimes the answer is just experience...people fear and loathe what they dont know or understand. Get them alone and put a face and a name to it, and attitudes soften, eventually.

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They did but eith adults not kids- i saw a programme where they took people who were classed as 'racist' and put them with families of that race for a week. I can't remember if it was an American thing or a UK - but I think possibly it was a UK thing.

I do remember particularly one guy going into a 'black' household. This guy had criminal offenses for crimes against Black people. The atmosphere when they all first met kinda made you peep through your fingers and thing oh my God. BUT in this instance it went really well. The host family were fantastic and 100% credit to them for doing what they did. The guy at the end hugged the family goodbye and openly admitted he had never thought he could ever " feel that way" about 'blacks' , i doubt it was a 100% turn around BUT, every little helps and if they managed to help him think twice about commiting crimes against Blacks then surely thats a success. If I remember correctly the father or eldest son of the family had been a victim of race crime - though obviously not from this man.

There were two other cases of people staying with host families - but they werent quite as successful with one guy leaving within a day - ignorance is bliss i suppose.

I think if children are regualry making comments regaring race issues - teachers can pick up on this. One comment should not be acted upon. I mean it doesnt have to come from the parents as was suggested, kids do hear it from other sources too - like kids who swear dont always get it from home. We do have alot of US television over here and I have cringed on many occasions at what we deem to be 'racist comments' made on some of their programmes - so u just don't know for sure.

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this about sums it up pretty neatly

DBKP wondered, just who will be making the determination that a toddler’s “words” are racist? Will the U.K. build Toddler Re-Education Camps with sugar-free ice cream given out as treats? Will they go into the child’s home and seek out the source of where the toddler picked up his “racist” rant? Or will the British people begin to realize that their tax dollars are funding a bureaucracy gone amok?

http://deathby1000papercuts.com/2008...cist-toddlers/