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Rodi's thread about the haze issue.

Rodi's thread about the haze issue.

Old Oct 3rd 2015, 7:42 am
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Default Rodi's thread about the haze issue.

So here it is: the first week in October and I am trapped inside my air conditioned living room like a prisoner. Of course I could open the windows and inhale the brunt of an out of control inferno filled with toxins that hurt my eyes and lungs. From the 9th floor it looks like an evacuation zone that I used to see on TV in small towns that go up in flames during Canadian fires season. You know, the places they don't even let the media go to due to the unsafe air conditions.

Hilarious how everyone keeps insisting that nature can somehow dissipate millions of acres of burning ash affecting 80 million in three countries because September is over. Lack of rain continues in epic proportions around the globe and will only get worse as climate change intensifies. Clearly this will drag on the rest of the year albeit a few breaks after a brief wind shift. And I can't wait until the"dry season". Yet they spend 840 Million RM to "upgrade the equipment" that monitors the putrid stench. Soon they'll just add a line in the official weather websites under the average number of precipitation days and title it "average number of breathable livable days". How come the tourism books don't mention "haze season" since everyone refers to it as a perfectly natural seasonal occurrence?
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Old Oct 4th 2015, 1:31 am
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Exclamation Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Fascinating

Flights disrupted due to poor visibility - Nation | The Star Online

If anyone is following, all relevant meteorological agencies predicted (correctly) that a tropical storm in the Philippines was going to blanket Penang for days on end with smoke thanks to unusual wind patterns that prevent the poison air from dissipating. Ok fine. Now let's refer to the article above that makes one very important point. I will cite the most obvious and relevant sentence

"The haze is predicted to make a comeback if fires in Sumatra and Kalimantan are not extinguished on Oct 10 on the heels of another tropical storm in the eastern Philippines."

Um
PUT THE FIRES OUT !!

In developed nations, the current situation would warrant what's called a state of emergency which frees up federal funds set aside for public emergencies. Out of control raging wildfires that threatens the health of all citizens for weeks on end is a national emergency.

It's so painfully obvious that the haze is not the problem. It's the refusal three nations to stop talking, take some funds away from the overdevelopment and put the fires out.

Obviously nobody understands this and the people simply accept shortened life spans and lives spent indoors just like Americans accept massacres of innocent kids as the price for "second amendment rights" that allow everyone to own guns. Meanwhile, the predictions are that El Niño will continue to poison three nations for the rest of the year if fires are allowed to rage. Key point: THE FIRES ARE SET INTENTIONALLY FOR PROFIT: put them out intentionally for the sake of 80 million citizens and stop calling it "the haze season". That is totally ludicrous

Once again, it's worth reiterating the obvious solution that everyone seems to miss "UNLESS THE FIRES ARE EXTINGUSHED"! This means the haze IS CONTROLABLE with human intervention.

The first and foremost responsibility of sovereign nations is to protect the safety and well being of their citizens. I am not a citizen so I have no say but 89 million others alledgedly do. Demand better

Last edited by Rodi; Oct 4th 2015 at 1:34 am.
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Old Oct 4th 2015, 3:11 am
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Originally Posted by Rodi
Once again, it's worth reiterating the obvious solution that everyone seems to miss "UNLESS THE FIRES ARE EXTINGUSHED"! This means the haze IS CONTROLABLE with human intervention.
I fear it is far more difficult to extinguish these fires than you suggest, certainly without international assistance in terms of firefighters, military troops, water bombing planes and helicopters. Even then it can be impossible to get close enough to the fire because of the heat and smoke.

Put aside the problems of economics, profit, intentional fire-starting, spread into accidental forest fires and patronage for a moment. And consider that putting the raging fires out is in some cases impossible without unlimited water supplies nearby (of which there are not).

Peat fires spread quickly underground, and like those magic candles on a birthday cake, that re-ignite when you blow them out, re-kindle themselves. And surface water in small volume can’t put them out.

According to a lecturer specialising in the politics of transboundary haze in the region, the root of haze stems largely from bad peatland management.
“Peat should never be touched as they are valuable for their carbon storage. When cleared for agricultural purposes like oil palm plantations, the peat dries up quickly and oxides, becoming fire-prone, and the stored carbon is released,” says Dr Helena Varkkey, a senior lecturer at Universiti Malaya’s international and strategic studies department.

“Indonesia has the world’s largest peatland ecosystem at 5%. A 2008 research showed that 27% of all Indonesian oil palm are planted on peatlands. Hence, when we talk about transboundary haze, the reference is specifically upon Indonesia. If the burning happens during the drought months, the fires are bigger and harder to put out.”

She says intentional fires are started by farmers who burn the land for subsistence crops. This accounts for about 20% of all fires but are usually not on peat. Accidental fires occur when dried-out land becomes fire-prone.

“Peatland fires can burn on the surface and also underground. It can spread far and wide when underneath. When this happens, the fire can only be put out by flooding the peat entirely, though this may prove difficult when fire-fighting services are located far away. Sometimes, just when you think the fire is out, it kindles elsewhere underground and starts again,” says Varkkey.

Varkkey says non-peat forest fires can generate haze too, though to a smaller extent. Regular forest fires spread more slowly among the vegetation above ground, compared to the quick spread of peat fires underground. These fires are also more visible and thus easier to put out.

We need rain, and a hell of a lot of it.

JC3

Last edited by JC3; Oct 4th 2015 at 3:25 am.
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Old Oct 4th 2015, 4:09 am
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

JC3

Extremely useful and well crafted post. Thanks for the information.

I understand that forest fires above ground are much easier to put out and burn slower. And obviously you can't compare this region to the vast resources available to North America. Often there are firefighters from 20 states battling one fire.

However, your explanation is all the more reason why it's up to the leaders to clamp down on the 20% that create the fires that are the problems. Realistically speaking, climate change wil undoubtably bring more drought and less rain as evidenced by California the last four years where we had about 10 days of rain in a 180 day rainy season.

According to your stats, I see 73% of the land still available for planting Palm that is less likely to result in firestorms that affect 80 million people for months on end. It's been 17 years since this started. That is long enough. Only enforcement and legislation can prevent them from using peatland. I also believe resources can and should be diverted from other places in a national budget in cases of emergency. The problem is nobody sees this as anything more than a "season". Actions speak louder than words.

My point is that addressing the problem by wasting millions to keep up with Singapore's reporting standards is deflecting the problem and besides the point. How about spending all that money and mobilizing an international firefighting effort? Perhaps if more westerners saw the issue, environmentalists could exert real political pressure through threats of economic sanctions etc.

Then again perhaps not
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Old Oct 4th 2015, 7:51 am
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Default re: Debate. Causes, intent & solutions ref. haze & fires. - split from Lazy Hazy thread

One thing I can say with certainty:

This is day two of barricading ourselves in the air conditioned living room from the time we wake up til bedtime. From our normally beautiful condo on the 9th floor, the stench is a nauseating both of us and gives us headaches if we try to open the window. The normally crowded weekend streets of Batu Ferrnghi are deserted sans a few lunatics in the pool at Sri Sayang. This is no way to enjoy retirement and with the current forecasts it seems pretty clear this was a poor choice for two people that enjoy the outdoors or at least the poolside for reading (not possible right now)

I still can't believe human beings accept this for 17 years without significant protest and shows me I have so much to learn about how lucky we've been to be stuck in the rat race where we can at least breathe the air every day without being sickened.

I would almost rather go back to work than live life stuck indoors all day for months at a time. I believe there are probably third world nations much lower on the economic scale that enjoy more freedom than Malaysia at least when it comes to demanding something better than toxic fumes that only firemen should inhale in a daily basis. My bad
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Old Oct 4th 2015, 9:51 pm
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Default re: Debate. Causes, intent & solutions ref. haze & fires. - split from Lazy Hazy thread

These posts split from the Lazy Hazy thread which is for general comments on the haze , weather and season.
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 1:50 am
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

The small amount of rain changed the stench here in Batu Ferrenghi from "hot burning out of control wildfire" to "day after they extinguish a major blaze and allow people back to smell the smoldering remains of what used to be their house." Not sure which is worse. Either way another day spent barricaded with a book indoors.

But it did make the visibility improve from apocalyptic to horrible and I can almost make out the water and the buildings

Yesterday the API was almost 200. I'm willing to bet that may be one of the highest ever recorded here in Penang and the prospects for extinguishing 2,700 out of control peat land fires before the next expected tropical storm in the Philippines that will keep the ash blowing right in our windows is about zero to none
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 2:26 am
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Originally Posted by bakedbean
Morning BEVS. Was awoken to a tappety tap on the windows. Wow....rain. Forecast looks to be all week but...who knows.

Are we Summer, or are we Autumn? Do we get Autumn? I'm not sure. Anyway...enjoy. Life is too short.
Pleased you've had a little rain & agree. Make the most as you never know what is around the corner in life.


Originally Posted by Rodi
Either way another day spent barricaded with a book indoors.
Oh dear. You're not enjoying things by a long chalk are you. Perhaps a change of scene is called for. As BB states, life is too short.
Hopefully you will enjoy your book.
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 10:14 am
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Originally Posted by Rodi
The small amount of rain changed the stench here in Batu Ferrenghi from "hot burning out of control wildfire" to "day after they extinguish a major blaze and allow people back to smell the smoldering remains of what used to be their house." Not sure which is worse. Either way another day spent barricaded with a book indoors.

But it did make the visibility improve from apocalyptic to horrible and I can almost make out the water and the buildings

Yesterday the API was almost 200. I'm willing to bet that may be one of the highest ever recorded here in Penang and the prospects for extinguishing 2,700 out of control peat land fires before the next expected tropical storm in the Philippines that will keep the ash blowing right in our windows is about zero to none
Rodi, instead of sitting inside smouldering (pun intended) why don't you use this as an opportunity to visit some other places? It's an ideal moment to see if the haze is affecting other cities/countries. I can confirm it has not reached the Kennebunks yet
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 11:13 am
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

We just got here and are going to Thailand in November but if this stays around much longer or returns worse that will be exactly what we'll do. Convincing my wife to go is a tough sell. We are young and just started retirement which should last 40 years or more so spur of the moment plane trips are not part of the plan. But Indonesia obviously ruined that idea. We are writing to Workaway.info and trying to get some volunteer assignments in the winter also so I'd rather stay but kudos to all of you that just write it off as nothing
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 1:16 pm
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Originally Posted by Rodi
but kudos to all of you that just write it off as nothing
And what exactly is that supposed to mean? You have no idea what folks here are thinking. I thank God that we don't have crazies here with guns shooting off. Haze or guns? I'll have the haze thanks.

Last edited by bakedbean; Oct 5th 2015 at 2:47 pm. Reason: .
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 2:14 pm
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Better check out the weather in Thailand...my wife's galpal is visiting us in Bali and every time she calls her husband in Bangkok he said it's pouring with rain.
I remember the floods in Thailand a few years ago when the Honda car plant had brand new cars floating around the countryside.
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 2:58 pm
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Originally Posted by bakedbean
And what exactly is that supposed to mean? You have no idea what folks here are thinking. I thank God that we don't have crazies here with guns shooting off. Haze or guns? I'll have the haze thanks.
I am extremely anti gun and don't condone America's biggest problem. No offense was meant. From what I've heard in this forum and around town most folks do accept it the haze as unsolvable so they just accept it. Nobody likes it yet it gets worse every year so obviously everyone is powerless against whoever us responsible
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 3:01 pm
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Originally Posted by Davita
Better check out the weather in Thailand...my wife's galpal is visiting us in Bali and every time she calls her husband in Bangkok he said it's pouring with rain.
I remember the floods in Thailand a few years ago when the Honda car plant had brand new cars floating around the countryside.
I can breathe and my eyes don't burn in the rain. Human beings are not meant to inhale firestorms on a daily basis however. I'll take something natural in nature any day over irresponsible arson for profit at the expense of millions
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Old Oct 5th 2015, 3:06 pm
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Default Re: Those lazy, hazy days of Summer

Originally Posted by Rodi
I can breathe and my eyes don't burn in the rain. Human beings are not meant to inhale firestorms on a daily basis however. I'll take something natural in nature any day over irresponsible arson for profit at the expense of millions
I'm sure there are many folks currently in South Carolina that would gladly swop places with you. I'm not saying that I condone the haze but you, as others have pointed out, have options.
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