Crime rates

Old Sep 10th 2008, 10:51 pm
  #181  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by elfman View Post
I get it - you not only fell for all the tripe in the UK gutter press, but you also think Hollywood/TV is all real too. The Sopranos was not a documentary, y'know.

Ever been to New Jersey?
Don`t read the gutter press because it is full of lies and garbage. As for the Sopranos well, I have never even seen one episode but know it is something to do with east coast mafia. Never watched it becuase the whole concept of the series seemed outdated (american/italian mafia) As it had all been done before in the cinema in the 70`s and 80's. But I do hear its meant to be quite good. Tell me do you watch it? If you do how accurate is it? When I was in New York, I briefly travelled through NJ and from what I know of New York well New York is a great city with great people, love to live there. If New jersey is an extension of this then I am sure I would like it as well.

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Old Sep 10th 2008, 10:56 pm
  #182  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Grayling View Post
You must win the bullshit prize of the year.

I doubt if you have ever lived in any of the places that you are claiming are so safe and so much better than the UK.

You are, indeed, an armchair adventurer.
Lived 10 years in the UK and a couple of years in South America and extended periods of time in both Australia and Russia. Travelled to a large amount of other countries mostly North America and rest of Europe but admittedly never lived in any of these but have friends and contacts in all these places. By the way where do you spring from never spoken to you before? You certainly did pop up, good on you
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Old Sep 10th 2008, 11:02 pm
  #183  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Jules Europe View Post
Travelled to a large amount of other countries mostly North America and rest of Europe but admittedly never lived in any of these but have friends and contacts in all these places.
So you have never lived in canada or US.

.....but somehow you are qualified to pontificate, to people who do live there, about about relative crime rates, immigration etc.etc.

An armchair adventurer (and expert ) indeed.
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Old Sep 10th 2008, 11:08 pm
  #184  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Jules Europe View Post
The equity from their house gives them the chance to go to a safer country with attractive house prices, where they can live hopefully mortgage free and have a safer environment for their families, Canada in general is ideal for this. If safety wasn`t so much an issue as you are saying, then they would probably go to somewhere for example like South Africa. No language issues in general, cheap property prices, great climate etc. The reason they don`t go there is for one big reason. The rampant crime levels and the high murder rate each day. Why do you think FIFA is so concerned about holding a world cup there. Therefore if they want a warm climate they go to Aus if not then Canada because in most cases they are getting a safer environment with all the things they look for and cheaper housing especially in Canada (Vancouver excluded) As stated these two reasons go hand in hand and is fairly easy to see. There are other issues as well but these are the main two.
Sorry Jules but you are entirely wrong here - the equity from their house has enabled them to move to a safer area in a new country that has the same overall crime issues as the UK. The country they moved to is not safer but they have moved upscale. For the individual this is a real safety/crime improvement, however to suggest that Canada, Aus, NZ, Spain, France, US etc have significantly less crime than the UK is incorrect.

SA is not a direct comparison as it is not really a developed western country and does have significant safety concerns well above the norms for developed countries.
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Old Sep 10th 2008, 11:24 pm
  #185  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by seanyg View Post
I thought 9 out of 10 statistics were wrong, anyway...?
to quote myself

The world hates stats and refuses to believe them
Which is why 75% of the population believes its in the top 50%
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Old Sep 10th 2008, 11:25 pm
  #186  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Grayling View Post
So you have never lived in canada or US.

.....but somehow you are qualified to pontificate, to people who do live there, about about relative crime rates, immigration etc.etc.

An armchair adventurer (and expert ) indeed.
As I have said, I have travelled to North America but most of my knowledge or verification about these countries comes from numerous friends or work collegues over the years from North America, Australia and NZ etc. They themselves have expressed their opinions some sensibly and others not so sensibly. Based on your logic, for somebody to be suitably qualified to make this analasis, they would have to have lived for a reasonable amount of time in all these countries. Sadly that luxury is not available to all of us, which is why stats for example are produced for the so called benefit of the general population. Its very much a case Grayling, of many things in this life, you have to read between the lines becuase no politician, reporter etc is going to give you the truth. In this case you are much better asking the average man or woman on the street becuase they are likely to give it to you straight and neat.

By the way an expert is a drip under pressure, for your sake don`t become one on this tedious subject. Its just not worth it.

You seem to have a fascination of sitting in armchairs because you have mentioned this to me in both responses??? Maybe this is where you yourself feel most comfortable. This is not a criticism just an observation becuase you are free to sit wherever you want.
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Old Sep 10th 2008, 11:33 pm
  #187  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Jules Europe View Post
As I have said, I have travelled to North America but most of my knowledge or verification about these countries comes from numerous friends or work collegues over the years from North America, Australia and NZ etc. They themselves have expressed their opinions some sensibly and others not so sensibly. Based on your logic, for somebody to be suitably qualified to make this analasis, they would have to have lived for a reasonable amount of time in all these countries. Sadly that luxury is not available to all of us, which is why stats for example are produced for the so called benefit of the general population. Its very much a case Grayling, of many things in this life, you have to read between the lines becuase no politician, reporter etc is going to give you the truth. In this case you are much better asking the average man or woman on the street becuase they are likely to give it to you straight and neat.
That's another load of bullshit.

A friend and work colleague told me so it must be true

You are the one who is trying to be an expert on this subject, and you are right, it is tedious listening to someone who really does not have clue what they are on about.

Have a nice day now!
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Old Sep 10th 2008, 11:38 pm
  #188  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
Sorry Jules but you are entirely wrong here - the equity from their house has enabled them to move to a safer area in a new country that has the same overall crime issues as the UK. The country they moved to is not safer but they have moved upscale. For the individual this is a real safety/crime improvement, however to suggest that Canada, Aus, NZ, Spain, France, US etc have significantly less crime than the UK is incorrect.

SA is not a direct comparison as it is not really a developed western country and does have significant safety concerns well above the norms for developed countries.
Well you have mentioned some good points here. I will go with you on the South African example, should have known better given the amount of Brits that live in Spain after having initially moved to SA from the UK. By selling their property in the UK they can in most cases move to to a better area in their new chosen country and obviously by doing this you live in a better area as there is less crime in general a fairly straightforward assumption. The real point being, that this whole debate that started yesterday, was just not about the fact that these countries were safer than the UK, but more to do with the fact of the serious and growing trends of certain crimes in the UK and why they happen. All countries have their own unique crimes and trends Take a look at some of the earlier threads on this first point.
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Old Sep 10th 2008, 11:46 pm
  #189  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Grayling View Post
That's another load of bullshit.

A friend and work colleague told me so it must be true

You are the one who is trying to be an expert on this subject, and you are right, it is tedious listening to someone who really does not have clue what they are on about.

Have a nice day now!
Before you go, it wasn`t a friend but friends in plural meaning MANY people not ONE. If it is tedious as you say, better to go off and do some work somewhere or sit a read a mad comic becuase its the only thing you are going to have a clue on.

By the way we did agree on something as you say the tediousness of it all. So something was achieved unlike the application queues at CIC................................. That never seem to go anywhere.

uuuuuuuum This is where I am supposed to say have a nice day. Well have a nice day.

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Old Sep 11th 2008, 12:12 am
  #190  
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Default Re: Crime rates

This is unbelievable but totally forgot to mention that I have family (aunts, uncles and cousins in the USA) They live in the states of New York, Ohio and Texas. Unfortunately not close enough to help me with a visa, but in all the excitement of writing threads totally forgot to mention them. Reason I am putting this in, because somebody in one of the many threads asked me what do I know about North America.
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Old Sep 11th 2008, 12:14 am
  #191  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by seanyg View Post
I thought 9 out of 10 statistics were wrong, anyway...?
I don't believe that. 67% of statistics are made up on the spot.
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Old Sep 11th 2008, 12:18 am
  #192  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by southlondon View Post
I don't believe that. 67% of statistics are made up on the spot.
You live in South London? I lived there for many years in Streatham and Crystal Palace, most people I knew there criticized it but i really liked it and everytime I go to the UK I look em up.
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Old Sep 11th 2008, 12:25 am
  #193  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Jules Europe View Post
You live in South London? I lived there for many years in Streatham and Crystal Palace, most people I knew there criticized it but i really liked it and everytime I go to the UK I look em up.
Ahh St Reatham - a fine place indeed
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Old Sep 11th 2008, 12:29 am
  #194  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
Ahh St Reatham - a fine place indeed
Plenty of great Indian and Italian restaurants and 2 cinemas but not sure if both are still there, think one closed down???
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Old Sep 11th 2008, 12:26 pm
  #195  
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Default Re: Crime rates

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
Actually, my experience from living and working abroad is that many people in the UK have no clue what it is like and expect it to be some sort of nirvana, when actually the issues are pretty much the same in all developed western countries when it comes down to crime, taxes, immigrants etc. It partly stems from the parochial UK tabloids telling them that issues are bad in the UK without placing them in an international perspective.

Clearly the one-off rise in living status due to the higher prices of UK property tend to allow people to live in larger properties in better areas in their new country, but apart from that the stats tend to indicate that most of these countries are pretty similar in most ways - the US tends to be a little further away from the others with its large religiosity, gun issues, lack of socialized health care etc, but still has a lot more in common with the rest of the west than it does the east or developing countries.

The idea that the UK is going down the pan/to hell in a handbasket/to the dogs (and on) seems quite laughable really.
Spot on!
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