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Let's talk about cars

Let's talk about cars

Old Mar 1st 2019, 5:21 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by Mr Weeze
I have always looked to agree a price before talking about modifiers - trading my car in, finance etc. Have a common point of reference to start from. Something like truecar can help guide to what a “good” price is. Know your negotiating position and stick to it. Remember, you are the one with the power here - you choose whether the deal is acceptable, or you walk. I have used that tactic before, and got as far as the door before they caved. There is always another dealer.

The most pleasurable car buying experience I have had before was when doing it all by e-mail. I have told them exactly what I want, what was important to me, and that I am asking multiple dealers (living in Houston means lots of choice). In order to have a bid I would consider they had 1 go at giving me a price. Telling me they would beat someone else’s price would disqualify them (some still chose to do this). I was looking at a straight cash purchase here, so I didn’t need to consider financing etc.
Last couple of new cars I bought / tried to buy (gave up last time and went with a used option), I used Costco's service. They have a pre-arranged price with a local dealer, and all research suggested it was a great price so I accepted that without further ado and bought the car. The second attempt to use that service, though, went well until we discussed trade-in. Their trade-in offer on my existing car was pitiful so I walked, even though the new car price was competitive. They wouldn't budge on the trade in (I was trading in a used 2013 CRV for a new CRV).
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Old Mar 1st 2019, 5:50 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by Steerpike
Last couple of new cars I bought / tried to buy (gave up last time and went with a used option), I used Costco's service. They have a pre-arranged price with a local dealer, and all research suggested it was a great price so I accepted that without further ado and bought the car. The second attempt to use that service, though, went well until we discussed trade-in. Their trade-in offer on my existing car was pitiful so I walked, even though the new car price was competitive. They wouldn't budge on the trade in (I was trading in a used 2013 CRV for a new CRV).
If you have the funds available, take the new car and sell the old one privately. I did this several years ago and got about $3,000 more privately than was offered for trade. $7,000 vs $4,000.

Trade-in is great if you don't have the funds or just can't be bothered with the hassle of selling privately.
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Old Mar 1st 2019, 12:30 pm
  #7308  
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by Steerpike

I'm not sure how transparent credit score evaluation is; I've heard many stories about what's good and what's bad for your score. I paid off my mortgage last year and I dropped from, say, 840 to 820 ... not that I cared much, but I was told I should run up a few credit card bills (don't pay them off for a few months) to get my score back. One thing I haven't done is tell anyone officially that I'm no longer earning big bucks. When I was working full-time I was making 'good money'. I've since gone over to part-time/semi-retirement but I haven't publicized that to the credit card companies. I remember being asked to 'confirm' some numbers and I just clicked through leaving the 'big numbers' in place. I'm assuming this isn't 'fraud' ... I presume the rating agencies don't have access to tax returns, so they have no way of knowing what my income is?
You need to have debt to have a good credit score, if you can afford to live without debt it doesn't matter what your score is!
I noticed mine dip by a couple of points this month and saw that they have added 'not enough revolving balances' to the factors affecting my score. 30 years on this planet gaming credit card companies and I had to Google 'revolving balances'. It would appear that my penchant for settling my card in full every month knocks my credit score, companies don't make any money off me and they'd prefer to give higher score and therefore better rates to someone less able to manage their finances well!
The credit companies might not have access to your tax returns but they wouldn't need to when they monitor your finances - not just your spending but your accounts, ie bank. Unless you live in a heavy cash environment they know more about your finances than you do! ...And people get the hump with Facebook....
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Old Mar 2nd 2019, 7:53 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by zzrmark
..... The credit companies might not have access to your tax returns but they wouldn't need to when they monitor your finances - not just your spending but your accounts, ie bank. Unless you live in a heavy cash environment they know more about your finances than you do! ....
Finance companies can access your credit report, but that only gives them credit data - loans, consumer finance, mortgages, and other debts, plus any history of non/late payment.

​​​​​Credit reports do not list deposit balances, savings, investments, brokers accounts, pension accounts, 401ks etc, nor, as Steerpike alluded to above, any data whatsoever on your income.
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Old Mar 2nd 2019, 11:41 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by Pulaski
Finance companies can access your credit report, but that only gives them credit data - loans, consumer finance, mortgages, and other debts, plus any history of non/late payment.

​​​​​Credit reports do not list deposit balances, savings, investments, brokers accounts, pension accounts, 401ks etc, nor, as Steerpike alluded to above, any data whatsoever on your income.
My last paragraph was a dig at the big three credit reporting agencies, I should have been a little clearer when I said 'credit companies', I didn't mean finance institutions.
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Old Mar 2nd 2019, 12:45 pm
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by zzrmark
My last paragraph was a dig at the big three credit reporting agencies, I should have been a little clearer when I said 'credit companies', I didn't mean finance institutions.
OK, but they (those three) definitely don't have access to deposit balances, savings, investments, brokers accounts, pension accounts, 401ks etc, nor any data whatsoever on your income.
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Old Mar 3rd 2019, 10:29 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Anyone ever driven a european Ford Ranger?
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Old Mar 3rd 2019, 1:41 pm
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by civilservant
Anyone ever driven a european Ford Ranger?

B series Mazda count? It was quite a while back, bench seats, nasty gear stick arrangement, after the Renault 4 it was the most basic vehicle I've ever driven, reliable enough though. Back then the Ford Rangies in Europe were built by Mazda, possibly not any more.
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Old Mar 3rd 2019, 3:40 pm
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by Pulaski
OK, but they (those three) definitely don't have access to deposit balances, savings, investments, brokers accounts, pension accounts, 401ks etc, nor any data whatsoever on your income.
So a credit report is based entirely on your debt / payment profile and has nothing to do with your income? That does seem counter-intuitive!
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Old Mar 3rd 2019, 11:02 pm
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by Steerpike
So a credit report is based entirely on your debt / payment profile and has nothing to do with your income? That does seem counter-intuitive!
Correct. I don't find it counter intuitive at all. Your credit report is based on how you have managed credit. Surprise!

If a lender wants to verify your income before extending credit, they can of course the way they do with mortgages, but they can't see it as a matter of course.

Last edited by civilservant; Mar 4th 2019 at 12:25 am. Reason: Typo
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Old Mar 4th 2019, 12:11 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by Steerpike
So a credit report is based entirely on your debt / payment profile and has nothing to do with your income? ….
Yes, that is why it is called a "credit report", not a "credit and income" report.

Of course that is why the "low doc" mortgages prior to 2008 were a joke and widely open to abuse fraud - you had a credit score then "self certified" income and Bob's your uncle! That said, I have found that not much has changed and most credit is still provided without us needing to provide pay statements and evidence of other income - application for car finance and other loans have been approved purely on our self-disclosed figures. Which appears to mean that as long as you have a history of paying your debts, not much emphasis is placed on proving your income.
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Old Mar 4th 2019, 12:26 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Which appears to mean that as long as you have a history of paying your debts, not much emphasis is placed on proving your income.
Which, in the case of auto loans (and other secured loans except mortgages), is because if you default they can come and get the car, sell it and get most of their money back, then sue you for the difference.
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Old Mar 4th 2019, 12:49 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by civilservant
Which, in the case of auto loans (and other secured loans except mortgages), is because if you default they can come and get the car, sell it and get most of their money back, then sue you for the difference.
Right, so in a sense the risk is with me - but so long as I keep paying I get to keep the car. ….. But why do you say "except mortgages"? A mortgage is the actually the security document (not the loan) that entitles the lender to seize the asset.
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Old Mar 4th 2019, 12:54 am
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Because a mortgage lender (in my experience) does in fact verify income - so it didn't really tally with my overall point about secured loans getting by with self reported income because they can seize the underlying asset
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Old Mar 4th 2019, 12:41 pm
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Default Re: Let's talk about cars

Originally Posted by civilservant
Anyone ever driven a european Ford Ranger?
I assume your talking about the latest model? The ops vehicles we drove at Heathrow were older rangers. They were good solid machines. Way better than the L200’s that replaced them.
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