instead of insults give us some logic and reasoning.

It's too late at night in my part of the world, sorry.

then good night to you.

Well there are both atheists and deists doing that. I had rather hoped you would turn your considerable reasoning skills to the point in hand rather than to the posters. Oh, well...

Thank you, I'm going to give it a bit longer because the TV is rubbish, and maybe a longer post will come along that I can reply to.

I dunno about that. Particle physicists and cosmologists seem to depend on 'proving' that something doesn't exist on a regular basis.

My Bonnie lies over the ocean . . .

That one kept me awake all night. Maybe my statement was a little broad-brush. I'll get back to you...

ETA However you still can't prove God doesn't exist, that evolution isn't guided by a hidden hand nor even that prayer doesn't work.

Hope nobody's offended...

Haven't got the particular research in front of me at present but I do know of a randomised-controlled study done on the power/value of prayer. Results showed that there was no difference between the control group (no prayers said for these patients) & those patients who were being prayed for (but didn't know it). The group with the worst outcome, were those that knew they were being prayed for.

Frankly, if god does exist, then he's done a very poor job.

I can't prove Atlantis doesn't/didn't exist.

See post 61

Yup - oversimplification by me.

It is considered possible to prove as near as dammit the non-existence of something provided you have a confident method of detecting it if it did exist.

So for instance if the hypothesis was that there was an elephant in a field you could go and have a look and prove there wasn't one. A Mouse would be a different matter - you probably could never prove there wasn't a mouse anywhere in the field.

So in answer to Domino - "can anyone here prove that evolution isnt guided by a hidden hand ?" The answer is no, unless you have a confident method of detecting it if there is one.

I ended up discussing this issue about religion with my husband last night. He's a logical, unemotional thinker. His opinion of religion/god is that humans need to have a father figure, they need to feel there is some control and some way of communicating with the larger forces of nature (ancient civilisations worshipped the sun for example). There is a need to have an explanation of their reason for being here and above all else their so called leaders need to rules to keep everyone in check. An ancient police force, but also a guiding conscience and the rules for humanity to live beside each other. The biblical stories are just that - stories. they gave explanations that fitted the circumstances and limited knowledge of the time, but dont answer with any accuracy our questions, nor do they prove or disprove???!!!

Jo xxx

The 'stories' in the Bible (or AFAIK any other religious writing), will not answer any science questions with accuracy, because that is not their purpose. The Bible is not a science book, it is about God's dealings with mankind and our relationship with him. If I wanted to find out how to mend my car from reading a book, I would not read a book about Confucianism, I would read the Haynes Manual.

The Bible tells us what we need to know for our spiritual health and well-being. It does not, and never intended to, tell us how to split the atom or cure cancer.