moving to marbella
 

Hi everyone. Just wondering if anyone can give me any advice.

My parents are selling their property in UK and buying in marbella area. Should be over there looking in a few months. My partner and I are going to move with them too. My parents will be retiring however my partner and I want to work.
He is 28 and a structural engineer/piling operative/house foundations by trade. I work as a veterinary receptionist but have many years of admin, receptions and working in the travel industry. I am 29yrs. My partner is keen on poss starting our own business over there, small bar possibly.
Does anyone have any websites or info on getting started over there? for basic things like doctors, dentists, tax, work etc?
any info would be much appreciated :-)

Many Thanks

Re: moving to marbella
 

Hi and Welcome to the forum,

There are many many threads on this forum about starting a business / running a bar.

Please do yourself a favour and research these topics

Davexf

Re: moving to marbella
 

......and most of them negative. I'm afraid.
Pete

Re: moving to marbella
 

Why negative pete? My parents have lived in marbella before around 6yrs ago but i have never.

Natalia

Re: moving to marbella
 

They are negative because there are no jobs and running a bar is a recipe for losing money.

Unemployment in that area is over 35% and even worse for young people.

As for jobs in the construction industry - there is almost no construction work going on at all. There are two million finished properties for sale in Spain.

Re: moving to marbella
 

Not the place, the job prospects. But I still wish you good luck though.
Pete

Re: moving to marbella
 

Fred, let me if you dont mind inject a little positive energy into this!
firstly, a bar is NOT a recipe to loose money, it depends entirely on you making sure you have done the right business deal! I have been here since 1986,I started working in a beach bar and in discos, eventually i was able to put a deposit down on a FREEHOLD local, then, after a few years when I had finished paying for it I built my own pub, no rent to pay, no landlord, MINE!! Sure, i had monthly payments to the bank to meet, but these were about 50% less than any monthly rentals in local bars!! The people who have had their fingers burnt are the ones who came in when everything was going well, paid to much for the dreaded TRESPASO and ended up with a ball and chain on their ankle and landlords who just increased rents, it also meant they could never shut for holidays as they would be coming back with rent to pay, a recipe for disaster!! My advice to anyone would be to buy FREEHOLD, do not even consider Trespaso, a freehold gives you a chance to live the dream, have a great lifestyle (a pub can be fantastic fun if that is what you want to do)....if you cant afford a freehold then a straight rent may be another option!!

Re: moving to marbella
 

Hey thanks so much for your advice :-) sounds amazing what you have done for yourself :-) we already have about 40,000 saved up (most due to a comp claim my partner had with work) so we are looking to see what we could afford.

Tha ks again for ur help :-))

X

Re: moving to marbella
 

The great news is that you will love living in the Marbella area but take it easy on your plans for work and what to do when you get there. Give yourself time to settle in but be very very flexible about what work you would like to do and DO NOT take anyones advice about buying a bar or any other business. Give yourself time and talk to the locals, learn basic Spanish and get to know the area. Good luck...

Re: moving to marbella
 

As Concierge for the Spanish section of BE I would like to say hello and welcome.

BE is a very large expat website, so if you have problems finding your way around we have concierges who will try to direct you. The moderators for the Spanish forums are Mitzyboy and Fred James, moderators are there to ensure that the site runs smoothly within the rules of BE. Problems and complaints should always be addressed to a moderador who will look into the matter and deal with it efficiently and fairly. Our members who post in the Spain Forums are friendly and helpful with a wealth of knowledge of the issues of living in Spain. At the top of the page you will find a quirkily named thread called Free Beer which is full of important and useful information. Hope you enjoy your time participating in the forums.

Please let me know if you need any further help.

Rosemary

Re: moving to marbella
 

3 deletes ????

Re: moving to marbella
 

Natalia, you have a Russian name, do you speak Russian? If so you might be onto a good thing ...

MARBELLA, the most popular destination for Russian tourists

Re: moving to marbella
 

Pablo
I’m new to the forum but not to Spain. I enjoy reading views and comments here but I cannot believe that anyone could give such bad advice as to buy a bar freehold in Spain at this moment in time. When you tell us what you did from 1986, you are talking about another era. Good luck to you for what you have done but remember you started at a good time. Those days are a world away from where we now find ourselves. I, too, remember Spain in 1986. Those were the days when you could open a business and thrive. Nowadays I would advise anyone coming to Spain not to open a business unless they are prepared to lose their outlay. Sorry to be a bit negative but I’m trying to save you from making a big mistake. There are so many bars for sale and rent all along the coast. Why do you think this is?

Re: moving to marbella
 

As Concierge for the Spanish section of BE I would like to say hello and welcome.

BE is a very large expat website, so if you have problems finding your way around we have concierges who will try to direct you. The moderators for the Spanish forums are Mitzyboy and Fred James, moderators are there to ensure that the site runs smoothly within the rules of BE. Problems and complaints should always be addressed to a moderador who will look into the matter and deal with it efficiently and fairly. Our members who post in the Spain Forums are friendly and helpful with a wealth of knowledge of the issues of living in Spain. At the top of the page you will find a quirkily named thread called Free Beer which is full of important and useful information. Hope you enjoy your time participating in the forums.

He has to sound positive as he is selling his business so will not want to put buyers off. Totally agree with everyhting that you have said.

Please let me know if you need any further help.

Rosemary

Re: moving to marbella
 

Some useful reading.

And bear in mind this was 2008. Before the $hit really hit the fan.;)
March http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=519269
May http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=538406
June http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=545645
November http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=576010

Re: moving to marbella
 

Pocaloca
I am not russian. Nor is my name! Hopefully
I will find it good in spain. Thanks for ur comment x

Re: moving to marbella
 

Where does that information come from??

The meaning of the name Natalia is Born On Christmas Day
The origin of the name Natalia is Italian

So does that theory now apply to Italian tourists..maybe she speaks Italian!

Re: moving to marbella
 

Sorry for any confusion, I've got a Russian friend called Natalia and it is apparently the most common girl's name in Russia (often shortened to Natasha).

The bit about Russian tourists is real though! :D

Re: moving to marbella
 

:rofl::rofl::rofl:
Priceless, how is Natasha short for Natalia???:rofl:


Both have got 7 letters.

NAT, now that is shorter.

Re: moving to marbella
 

Jeez, have you nothing better to do? :unsure:

It is a diminutive in the same way that Juanito is a diminutive of Juan.

Re: moving to marbella
 

So you shorten a word by lengthening it. No wonder i am finding Spanish difficult to learn!!!!:confused:

Re: moving to marbella
 

Many Russian diminutives are actually longer than the full version of the name, they are really better called 'pet names' and it nothing to do with animals.

Re: moving to marbella
 

Hi La Mancha,
there are oporopportunities in any market if you look for them, FREEHOLDS 6 & 7 years ago were virtually imossible to get hold of, why?? Well, landlords had them rented out on trespaso, plus, if you were able to get a FREEHOLD the price was through the roof!! My point is the following DO NOT try to buy a lease or a trespaso & then be dragged into paying rent on that agreement, due to the current market some FREEHOLDS have become available on the market at sensible prices for the 1st time that I can remember, this means, if you have funds, you can get your own place to own outright with NO MONTHLY RENT to pay EVER!! I dont understand how you can say anyone buying a FREEHOLD bar in Spain would loose thier money, how?? If you own the freehold?? No rent & you are able to rent it out if you decide to use it as an investment return property?? How would you loose your property if you own the deeds??I have no doubt that someone setting up a trespaso in Spain with monthly rent on top of the lease purchase is going to have a terrible struggle, BUT, if you own the property and have NO RENT, you really cant go far wrong and if its a lifestyle you are after, then its a great time now to be able to take advantage of the current market climate & get yourself a FREEHOLD property to own yourself! Think about it, lets say someone pays 30,000 for a trespaso then 950 per month rent (ive just seen one available on line at this price on the costa del sol)....If you can get a freehold within your budget you are straight away 950 euros per month better off than the guy stuck in the lease, thats 11,400 PA as an example, plus, the freehold gives you flexibility to do as you please, if you want a months holiday every year you dont have to pay that 950.......plus, if after 5 years you decide to move back home, you are able to rent your property out, I know one poor couple who are desperate to leave but cant sell the lease & cant shut as they still have to pay the rent, a no win situation, so, they continue to lower the asking price of the trespaso!! FREEHOLDS are available, not widely, but they are there & at prices that we have never seen before.......all I am saying is that if the spain lifestyle is on your list & you would like to get your own business here, you can take advantage of the market climate to get a FREEHOLD! one mans recision is another mans paradise!!;) Depends if you are a half full or half empty pint man really! regards, Pablo!

Re: moving to marbella
 

You don't give up do you...why not advertise on your radio shows:sneaky:

Re: moving to marbella
 

Hello Pablo
You certainly have a good sales pitch but unfortunately you are in the wrong place at the wrong time. Keep it up though because they say there is one born every minute, but I think they were referring to better economic times than these. Again I say if you seriously think that to buy a freehold bar in Spain today is an opportunity then I do not give any credibility to your other comments.
And I did not say anyone buying a freehold bar in Spain would lose their money. I said ‘prepare to lose your outlay’.

Re: moving to marbella
 

Hmmm, going of some of the posts on here it would mean that EVERY bar restaurant in Spain will go out of business this year :eek:, simply not true! I know bar restaurants that have been run well by the same people year after year, have things changed, yes.....eg...there used to be people waiting for tables at EVERY restaurant in Marbella in the hight of the summer, now there are people waiting....but not at EVERY bar or restaurant, the success circle is smaller.........but going back to my original point, why on earth should you ¨prepare to loose your outlay¨ if you own the FREEHOLD outwrite??? Its yours, you own it, even if its empty if you decided to move on and rent it out you would only have comunidad, etc to pay, no rent!!! I agree fully with anyone who suggests a trespaso is not a good idea, but to take advatage of the market and get yourself a FREEHOLD that will return you more rented out than if you had that money in the bank.....or run it yourself RENT FREE, how on earth can that be bad business????? Even in the world we live in today there are business opportunities just a question of doing the sums!! I cant for the life of me understand all the negativity?? Ive never thought like that, would anyone get out of bed in the morning if they did??? Spain is not what it was 5 years ago, where is, but many prices reflect that in todays market............I have a little smile on my face everyday when i remember that we own a FREEHOLD & have done for 21 years, but thats a story for another thread ;).

Re: moving to marbella
 

Maybe you should do a comparison on how much a freehold cost 21 years ago, and how much one would cost now

I think there you would find an answer to your reason why everyone is so sceptical. Even with the reductions is recent years they still will be very pricey

Plus now we are in a shrinking market, 21 years ago the market was growing fast

People still can make a profit of course, but those with an excellent knowledge of the local market, the industry and with the best connections within Spain will be the best placed to do so.

Re: moving to marbella
 

If freeholds are so great for rental income, why are people trying to off load them.

Why not hang onto them and rent them out for a steady income?

I did notice that you were willing to swap your "valuable" freehold that brings in a good yearly yield, for a boat that would only depreciate in value.

Why not keep you money spinning freehold and buy a boat with a 5 year marine mortgage paid for out of the incoming rent?

Then when the boat is paid for, you will still have your freehold and an assured income from the rent.

Surely that would make more business sense.

Re: moving to marbella
 

well done Criketman, a fair and sensible post! I could not compare with 21 years ago thats difficult, but I will compare with 5 or 6 years ago, I know freeholds that are up to 50% less now than 6 years ago, its the 1st time I have ever seen a freehold business in a decent location available for a similar price as say a 3 bedroom apartment!! Its is true, local knowledge can be a big help! I met a couple last nite (Brits) who have just bought a 14 year lease RENT FREE, ie, paid the figure for the 14 years and now can run the business rent free for that time and even sell the remaining 7 years half way through if they wish....this is new to me, ive not seen that sort of deal done before.....things may be different now to years gone by, but if you are careful with the deal you do you can still enjoy a wonderful life in this great country!!:D

Re: moving to marbella
 

Goodness me, do I have to go through my complete private life???? I own 3 properties in Spain plus 2 in london, 3 are rented out at the moment and a 4th will be once we move onto the boat, I wish to travel due to passing my sailing exams, so, I wish to off load one property in Spain to finance my boat purchase with a cash purchase (not mortgage)......thats it, we do have a solid business plan re our sailing adventure!!

Re: moving to marbella
 

Pablo, I am happy for you that you have a little smile on your face every day when you remember that you own a freehold. I have a bigger smile on my face knowing I don’t own one.

Re: moving to marbella
 

er...great, thats good news for you...I think???:eek:

Re: moving to marbella
 

:rofl::rofl: Good post

Re: moving to marbella
 

Dont forget to declare the rental income and your assets to hacienda by the end of April.:rofl:

Re: moving to marbella
 

More important is how much will it be worth in another 5 / 10 or 20 years.

Impossible to know but at present I would guess a lot less if you could ever off load it

Re: moving to marbella
 

crikey, its a bit doom and gloomy here is it not? ;)

Re: moving to marbella
 

the biggest problem will be the language.
most vets here only speak Spanish, but then it is Spain.
we are lucky to have one that speaks reasonable English, having been to Cambridge Vet College for a year or so, although his partner is Spanish only. The receptionist speaks her native Swedish, Spanish and English.
Very few Spaniards in the Andalusia region speak English, although they do like to throw in their couple of words occasionally. This is the long term legacy of Franco and generations have only the one language - like most of the UK.

I know a Spaniard architect who cannot find work and is pumping petrol at weekends whilst improving his English and studying to get more certificates that may prove useless.

the biggest problem is that Spain has something not seen too much in the UK - the temporary contract. A bit like the UK's trial period but there is a tendency now to use that as a way of getting staff and then ditching them before the requirement to start them permanent.

Marbella is a high price area, pandering to those who have oodles of money. Perhaps once you are out there you can find a niche that isnt taken and make a good living out of it. But Andalusia has the highest unemployed of Spain, especially in your age group, and is seen as a drag on the rest of Spain in turning themselves round.

So, perhaps both of you for a time at least, could consider living somewhere like Madrid, Barcelona, where there may be more need for your current skills.
Suggest you look at Google for jobs and see how many agencies there are, but few jobs are down south and as most companies are owned by Spaniards then they will employ a Spaniard before you.

Sorry if it is bad news, but if you & partner and your parents can live for a while to enable you to see how things are then you will stand a good chance of making some go of it - but don't expect to walk into a job.

rgds

`

Re: moving to marbella
 

Spain can be quite complex with social security, etc....many ex pats working here do so as self employed,this means you have to pay your own monthly social security! Its not easy for an ex pat to get a job in a bank, a supermarket or petrol station, thats why so many end up working ¨autonomo¨! As mentioned earlier in the thread, there are oportunities to make a go of it here, but you need to take your time,be careful, speak to as many people as possible (here on this forum is a start) find out how long those people have been in business and have in fact lived in Spain, then make up your own mind.......but dont be put off by all the doom and gloom merchants :thumbsup:...in fact, has the OP been frightened off already? :eek:

Re: moving to marbella
 

have you been doing the hornpipe again ??
:eek:

Re: moving to marbella
 

Not me,my glass has always been half full ;)