How long is a piece of string...
 

hi all, I realise that this is an open question with no real definitive answer. We are looking to purchase a Static park home down south. We will be early retirees, as previously mentioned, and will have a monthly income of around 1800 euros. Would this be classed as a livable income ?

Al and Lin

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Obviously depends on lifestyle (drinking/eating out etc) and I have no idea of those park type overheads but I would say yes 1800€ is enough as it is above national average income.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

It goes to show how different we all are - thankfully- as the thought of living in a trailer park , Spain or otherwise- for me would require living costs of the price of a decent rope as after about two nights I would top myself

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

You might think that, but we have a couple of friends who have a static mobile home on a site just off the N340 near Cabo Pino on the CDS (between Málaga and Marbella) and they love it there. They have all the facilities they need, WiFi and Satellite TV, shops nearby and a relatively low cost of living well within €1800 a month on which they also run a decent car.

Horses for courses.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

I don't doubt it.
As I did state- we are all different ( thankfully) , each to their own

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

A lot of people spend their money foolishly. And there are a few who live very well on less than that.

First, don't presume you can only live in a British expat community. It's not only significantly more expensive all 'round, but many eventually find it's not any different than living in Manchester, except for the weather. Same shit, different location.

Next, you need not buy name-brand everything. That's something people care about in the north. Here, nobody gives a damn if you have a Bosch kitchen or a new range rover (unless you live in a British or German expat community). You can save a fortune by buying a used golf, and some no-name kitchen appliances (or used ones being sold off by those who were unrealistic about their new life in Spain). It's a lot more practical anyway. The new range rover will eventually get all bashed up anyway. And the Bosch kitchen is manufactured by the very same factory that manufactures the cheap Chinese stuff. It just says Bosch on it. And don't even think about buying your stuff in the UK and having it shipped here. Anything you can buy in the UK, you can also buy here, at a lower price, with local support, and without ridiculous shipping charges.

Learn Spanish. It will save you a fortune.

And kiss goodbye the HP sauce and embrace a new cuisine. You'll only find British kitchen in British expat areas, and it will cost as much or more than it does in the UK. A jar of Pataks curry sauce is just under €5 here. At Morrison's, 95p. But that's because it's an "import". There are plenty of lovely foods that are fresher and a fraction of the cost of typical British foods. You just have to get used to the local cuisine.

With the money you save by not wasting your money on " british stuff" or impressing others, you can afford a much bigger house, a pool, and some land which facilitates a buffer zone between you and your next neighbour. But you will have to come to grips with the fact that you're not in Manchester anymore. And be happy with it. But your money will go a lot further...

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Exactly Amideislas

There are many money saving tips you can use-

Rubber bands soaked in toothpaste make an ideal long lasting and cheap alternative to chewing gum.

As cat food can be expensive, save money by simply not owning a cat- and scratching your furniture yourself using a large nail or Stanley knife

Drop a couple of teabags into your hot water tank- hey presto!, cuppas on tap

Another handy shopping tip is bring your wheeley bin with you to the supermarket- it's then easy and handy to check the exact items you have run out of.

And a good tip for saving time is - when counting to 10 start at 4, or if you are in a real hurry commence your count at 8.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Thanks to you all for your replies,, I think we are probably worrying over nothing to be honest. Dondurma, I will give the rubber band tip a miss if that's ok :unsure:

We will be back with loads more questions soon..
Take care
Al and Lin

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Ohh please...

You can live quite well on €1800 per month. If you spend it wisely. When we first moved here, we made all the mistakes. €1600/ mo for a flat in a British expat community, brought the Audi and the range rover, paid all the premiums to be surrounded with "Britishness"...

Against all warnings from those who warned us about moving outside of "civilisation", we bought in the campo. And I can say with confidence... Triple the space, triple the peace, and quadruple the happiness, at about 2/3 the price... But Manchester in the sun it isn't (thank God).

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

What, pray tell, is wrong with Manchester ?

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Nothing really. Just tiring of answering how we can live a "third world" lifestyle "out there". Until of course, they eventually show up for dinner, and then feel uncomfortable because we're obviously "rich". Although probably have less than any of them... It's not what you have, its what you do with it...


You may not like my tone, but you should listen to what I have to say. Been there, done that...

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

This week after 9 years living here I tasted my first meal of "putxero" which is an extremely popular Valencian meal. None of my friends have thought to serve it to me because they know that I love paella so they make sure that this is what they give to me. I bought the putxero from a lady who has opened a homemade food place, at the unbelievable cost of 3 euros it is an amazingly filling meal at a wonderful price.

So I would agree with you totally about embracing the local cuisine, I always have and have never regretted it.

Rosemary

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

I wasn't asking if we could afford more than a third world existence, just that we are looking at finances and trying to get things straight in our heads. Also, when I said ` down south` I meant in southern Spain. We do not come from Manchester...south east actually. But then if my question is going to generate negative responses, then I wont ask anymore.....thanks

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Don't be put off aw73, no one meant any harm and your query was a valid one.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Hey AW,

I live in an apartment with community charges, run a car, eat, drink, etc. and can easily get by on 1800 a month. Apart from all the obvious expenses, i.e. those you have in the UK, like power, etc. do remember that you need to take care of health cover here if you are an early retiree.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

It was Lancashire!

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Hi it would for me be liveable but I suppose you may get a more accurate answer if you outline the type of lifestyle you would like. I would ignor3 comments re statics your choice and as Fred says Horses for Courses. You say you will buy the static so no rent but as has been said factor in health costs if not state pension age also site fees which I believe vary quite a bit and can certainly higher than what I pay for IBI etc. Have you considered maybe a longish rental in the area you fancy to help assess how you would manage within your lifestyle?

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Well I found it funny :thumbsup:

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Thanks Keith- maybe it's cos we were both born in same year

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Age is humorous in itself ;-)

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

1800 euros a month would be considered a fortune to almost anyone i know. the average wage is 800-1000 a month.

you could live like kings on that money.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Very true.

Yet I know a few who have much more than that and struggle to make ends meet. Of course, it's a lifestyle choice. You can choose to live well on little, or be incessantly unhappy for a lot more... Damn, it's so expensive here... In Britain in the sun... Whilst others look on from a distance, with a smile...

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Again, I repeat. 800-1000 euros per month is not the average wage in Spain

The average wage is around 2,100 euros per month

If a family earns just 1,000 euros per month then they are very poor indeed, among the bottom 25% of the country

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Hi all,

Thanks for all the replies and comments.
I will explain my question . As mentioned, we will be early retirees. I have around 9 years till state pension. Our income , from a fire service pension and an NHS pension gives us around the 1800 euros per month figure. We will be paying around 300 euros per month ground rent. we also have to add in insurances etc. Whilst I like a beer or two of an evening, we are not really into eating out /golf etc. The biggest bill that I can see to start with is the first years medical which we will take from our savings so really doesn`t impact on the monthly figure. We run a diesel car (new). Does this make it a bit clearer....hope so.

Al

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

well i dont know where your figures come from, but i dont earn anything like 2100 a month, thats 525 a week ... i wish. even our manager doesnt earn that.


im talking individually .. not per household?


i dont know anyone (normal / non specialised) at the airport that earns more than 1400 a month. im talking parking / car hire / cleaners / maintainance men etc etc.

If you know where i can get 500 a week, please let me know :thumbsup::thumbsup:

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Much as I loved Spain and much as I adapted to the cuisine (as far as it's possible for a vegetarian to do so) I loved being able to buy HP sauce for the occasional eggy bread breakfast.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

As a maths teacher I could point out that the 'average' salary depends on whether you're talking mean, median or mode.

Instead I'll just post this link which claims the average salary in spain in 2014 was 1.634€ and express my surprise that the recovery has added around another 500€ to that this year.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Nothing wrong with that. I'm not a fan, but if you like it, have it.

I do find it amusing that so many around here spend a fortune on fighting Spain's "third world" inaccessibility to "British stuff". One couple we know refuses to shop at mercadona or eroski, because they can't stand the "poor quality of Spanish goods", preferring of course, to pay a hefty premium to only buy their goods from the British import shop, and amusingly, order household appliances from the UK (usually via Amazon, because they dont speak a word of Spanish). Of course, you can buy any of that stuff here, for a lot less money, but OK, I guess I can accept the comfort level - and the premium that goes with it.

These of course, are the very same ilk that refuse to live in "isolation" in some "third world" village full of "foreigners", paying a fortune for a tiny 2 bed flat in a distinctly British expat community with noisy neighbours on both sides, yet whinge endlessly about how expensive it is here.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Let's face it, €1800 is not a lot for two people in a 1st World country, but salaries in Spain are more like 2nd World and people manage. Overall Spain is not a cheap place to live and if you could manage in the UK, you will manage in Spain.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Was that the mean, the median, or the mode? :sneaky:

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

I was using this website that says that the average salary in Spain is 26k euros per year

Salario Medio 2015 | datosmacro.com

The data you linked to is the average amount on the wageslips labelled as "salario ordinario bruto"

5-6 years ago when I was earning 70k+ in Barcelona my "salario ordinario bruto" was 1,200 euros per month despite my contract showing that my base salary was 60k plus bonuses

The accountants try and put as little money as possible as "salario ordinario bruto" so to minimise monthly social security payments

Does that make sense maths teacher? :p

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Salaries in Spain are actually pretty good given that accommodation is so cheap

Sure, cleaners get maybe 1k euros per month, but in very few countries do cleaners get paid well

Most middling professionals earn 30k plus euros which is pretty comfortable

There is a reason why one in three children in Spain are sent to fee paying schools - their parents are pretty well off!

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

;) Nae idea mate.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Unless the article was written by statician, it was almost certainly the mean, as few people seem aware that the mode and the median exist. ...... And if it was written by a statician, shame on them for not specifying that it was the mode or the median!

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Aha! So the spaniards are just as well off as the rest of europe, it's just that must of it comes under the table?

Sadly my experience doesn't tally with yours, although I wish it did. I know a fair number of 'young' (ie 30s and 40s) well educated people struggling to get by on 1000-1200 per month and some on temp contracts that pay less than that.

When I first arrived in Spain 11 years ago, being a mileurista was something to be pitied. For many it's become something to aspire to.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Not really, as on average Spanish have to spend around 39% of their salary on rent, if they are lucky enough to have a job.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

I did look at the difference in that table there, They quote the mean for europe (rather than for spain, which is what we're arguing about) as 2062. The median would be between spain and malta, so 1415 and the mode, if we go in ranges of 0-99, 100-199 etc would be in the 2600-2699 bracket.

So the spanish salary is a long way behind the european mean, even further behind the mode but above of the median. Figures don't lie. Liars use figures.

But of course, we don't know how much black money the bulgarians and the danes get paid so it's all meanlingless anyway :)

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

Speaking as both a proper scientist by training and a social scientist by profession (note for Rachael ;))...

The accepted use of average in these kinds of reports is the mean. Which "means" that salaries at the top pull the mean forward somewhat, but of course this is true in all countries

The best data would be to compare all three measures across countries as well as the variance, as this would show how egalitarian societies are and what the likelihood of jumping from an average to a high salary may be

It would also be good to look at salaries by level of education

By my experience, those without a degree in Spain almost never earn more than 2k per month. While those with a degree and aged over 35 almost always earn over 1.5k per month and usually over 2k and salaries of 3k-6k per month are not at all unusual. Very very few earn over 8k per month though

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

You know cricketman has got me thinking. My old job there is vacant again and maybe I should try to persuade my former employer that one of those not at all unusual 3-6k salaries would be appropriate for someone of my immense talent and experience (and over 35)

I don't think they'd go for it.

Re: How long is a piece of string...
 

I agree. I only commented to obliquely point out that Rachael criticised someone for using "average", then immediately did the same thing herself. :unsure: