Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

How? Excuse me, but who did expel to the French were the spanish people, do you understand? With the help of the british, I don't deny it, but they were the Spaniards practically. Because it suited the british to help the Spaniards, and if not, there you have Waterloo, that if it is not for the prussian army, the british had never conquered. Never. In the same way that Trafalgar, that for your information, the Hispanic-French fleet was not directed by the Spaniards, was directed by an incompetent french of lastname Villeneuve, that ignoring the warnings and the recommendations of the Spanish admirals Churruca and Gravina, it took out the whole fleet to shot of Nelson. Yes, admiral Nelson, captured in Tenerife, cured of his injuries and returned by Spain to UK

In his exile in Santa Elena, Napoleon always complained of having invaded Spain, that was his biggest headache. The Spaniards are not an easy nor submissive nation to invade, but to conquer. In this, Spaniards and British we are very similar. I also remember to you that many of Wellington's troops were Spanish soldiers

Napoleon invaded Spain taking advantage because everything or great part of our army was in America fighting against our colonies, that wanted the independence. He requested permission for to cross Spain and to arrive to Portugal. Is of this way like invaded Spain. At the end of the war, we pay to thousands of french soldiers some vacations in Cabrera's island. Inform you, they didn't pass it very well

So thanks, but the necessary, because Napoleón in Spain was practically defeated when Wellington entered. UK should give thanks to other people, because of not being this way, now German would be spoken in the UK, in spite of the effort of those british aviators

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

does this alter the fact that the Guardia are fascist bully boys who throw their toys out of their pram every time Gibraltar protects their sovereign waters from Spanish maritime rapists.

There is no excuse for these imbeciles to slow down the border queue with no aims other than to cause disruption on the rock.

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

To be honest, if a foreign power (whether it be Germany or Greece) occupied the Isle of Wight, and then tried to stop UK fishermen physically from fishing nearby, I'm sure we'd be up in arms.
Of course part of the Spanish resentment may be partly down to the fact they realise they will never have control of Gib. But as Gib earns most of its money from shipping, tourism and financial services, why are they trying to enforce fishing restrictions? Surely the EU can adjudicate?

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

Come out with me on my kayak one day and observe these fishermen in action if you cannot imagine why they should protect as much of an area as they can. Especially from the boat in the above picture which looks very much like one that sets sail from Estepona every day scraping the bottom of the seabed outside my front door...aside from the 4 days this year the Junta de Andalucia got off their ass to patrol these waters back in May.

I am sure there would be few objections to allowing fishing in Gib's waters if they agreed to do so in a manner that would be less disruptive to the ecosystem in which they operate. They have no respect for nature therefore should have no right to fish in the waters of any state that is able to protect themselves...I believe the world's navies should be used further to protect the seas of states unable to do so on their own..ie Somalia and other war torn African states where Spanish and other European fishermen routinely take advantage of the confusion to plunder the sea life off these shores

As for the Isle of Wight...If Britain would have been as stupid or weak to have lost the island in the first place it would know that there would have been three options to getting it back. Firstly by war, then by political means (ie making concessions to make it an attractive proposition to the inhabitants) or financially (buy them out)...alas Spain was not strong enough to take Gib by war, smart enough to take Gib politically (99%-1% in a vote against Spanish rule says all that anyone who really respects democratic rights needs to know) and now as the current crisis demonstrates not rich enough to buy the place out

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

I hate the wars, but answering to your question, you don't know until point we are strong, or not. I know that the Malvinas war (for you, Falklands) for example, you won this war thanks to the help of United States, Chile and France (this last country stopped to sell missiles and airplanes to Argentina because Margaret Thatcher requested it to Miterrand). Also, you had a extra army, the gurkas

However, Argentina was alone
But do you believe that the gibraltarians are British because yes? People of Gibraltar are considered british because UK allows its status of fiscal and financial paradise. Simply. Otherwise, if it had been the other way around, if United Kingdom didn't allow this situation, and Spain if it allowed it, people of Gibraltar would be considered Spanish. This knows it anyone. So you don't say foolishness, this is not a situation of nationalist pride, is a situation of economic status, and if not, make the test: that UK removes the status that at the moment has Gibraltar, and that however, Spain allows it. Tomorrow, Gibraltar people wants to be Spanish

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

all extremely relevant..perhaps the Guardia on the border will lend you their toys and let you sit in their pram

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

If Spain wants the people of Gibraltar to become Spanish citizens the solution is simple.
Treat the people of Gibraltar as human beings, be friendly towards them and not antagonistic.
Then in a few hundred years they may consider being Spanish.

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

*cough* Ceuta *cough* Melilla *Cough*

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

Occupy is a strong word stevie, far different from the Gib. issue as you well know. Your love affair with all things Spanish is clouding your judgement.

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

Something of an understatement methinks.

I reckon Francos boys are doing all they can to provoke an incident so they can run off and bellyache to what few friends they have left.
Maybe they'll get some sympathy from the EU who have been content to sit idly by and watch them rape the oceans.
I would have thought they'd be more concerned about the Argies walking off with their oil business, but it seems they've chickened out of that one.
I wonder why ?

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

Just a tad! If we had ceded the IOW to another foreign power, then we would have no redress, no complaint whatsoever. As has been said before, Spain has pretty much emptied their seas of anything capable of swimming or crawling in it and they are desperate to do the same elsewhere.
This is from my area of UK, 12 years ago, they were doing it then, they are still doing it now.

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

EU Ballcocks

Spanish press was yesterday claiming that the report confirmed Spain’s competence to protect the environment in the designated waters.

http://www.chronicle.gi/headlines_details.php?id=25799

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

A Spanish captain whose vessel was seen fishing on numerous occasions in Gibraltar waters in recent months was yesterday served with a summons to appear before the Magistrates Court.

http://www.chronicle.gi/headlines_details.php?id=25801

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

The Spanish were making all sorts of threats against Argentina last April, not heard anything since. Spain is already losing power in the Americas, I can't see them doing anything much at all, it's all talk. Argentina holds the whip hand, if Spain get arsey, Argentina have threatened to do the same with the other investments that Spain has there.

Re: Gibralar v Spain yet again
 

Quite aside from the fishing/colony issue (and I would have thought you had plenty of arguments to utilise on that) I'm bemused by you (and others) constant attempts to bring Franco into this.
He may not have been Spain's finest peacemaker of the 20th century. But just remember that the UK also did a lot of things in 20C that are hardly praise-worthy (inventing the concentration camp, institigating the chemical bombing of civilians etc). Jeering at Spain's past to bolster your argument here, may just rebound and bite you on the derriere.