Re: British standards ???
 

Can I just ask you to read that sentence again?

What you have said is that 99.99% of the Muslim population of the UK is "getting on with activities that are against the law", but then gone on to say "not all, obviously". So only 0.01% of Muslims in the UK are law-abiding? Sorry, but I don't agree.

Yes, there are too many cases of forced marriage and other abominable practices like FGM going on in the UK. There are several organisations, all set up by brave Muslim women themselves who are willing to challenge the cultural practices ingrained amongst some in their community, not an easy thing to do, and they should have our full support.

There is a lot more that could be done to help them, such as schools reporting cases where young people (girls especially but sometimes boys as well) are taken out of school for long periods and taken back to their parents' country of origin for the purposes of marriage, often unwillingly.

However (and I am sorry if this is going to be seen as criticising the UK unduly, but I'm going to say it anyway), the UK can and does have many laws, regulations and policies in place designed to combat this and other things that should never happen like children being starved and beaten to death. But just how many more times do we have to read that clear signs were missed, various agencies involved like social services, schools, hospitals, doctors and police failed to join up the dots and actually do something about what should have been staring them in the face. All we get, time after time is "lessons have been learned". Those lessons came too late for Maria Colwell, Victoria Climbie, Khyra Ishaq, Baby P, Daniel Pelka and Hamzah Khan, and others too. Some of the perpetrators were Muslim, some were not. It is the crime which matters, not the ethnicity of the people committing it.

Other European countries, France and Spain particularly, have been much more robust in taking action to stamp out practices which are illegal but still persist within some communities. I wrote on another thread a while ago about a case in Spain where a couple (I think they were from the Gambia originally) had been jailed for 12 years in Spain for having their daughter "cut" as they call it. FGM has been illegal in Britain for longer than it has in Spain, but to date there has not been one single prosecution. Why can't they get their act together?

I have worked with quite a few Muslim women, and they don't all fit the stereotype of the cowed, veiled, uneducated creatures you and others like to portray. On the contrary, they were university educated, certainly not afraid to speak their minds, the ones who were married had had arranged marriages but were perfectly happy with that (as Jackytoo said, many in the communities who normally enter into arranged marriages point to the fact that "love" marriages in our own community are not always a blueprint for happiness and family security, and that's hard to argue with). Most of them didn't even wear the hijab, let alone the niquab.

Re: British standards ???
 

I copied the numbers from EMRs post.

I am not saying all muslm women fall into the cowed creatures, but there must be something going on when a programme was made and 18 out of 58 or so imans agreed to marry an underage girl against her will (all undercover of course), explain that away.

I am not talking about arranged marriage, if you can show me where I am I would be grateful.
I AM TALKING ABOUT FORCED MARRIAGE IN MANY CASES INVOLING UNDERAGE GIRLS. what part of that do you not understand?

You miss the whole point, the tragic cases you talk about where children have died, is in some way to blame because people in a position of trust, social services etc, were not doing their job properly.

In the case of forced, underage marriages, the imans are DOING THEIR JOB PROPERLY UNDER ISLAMIC LAW, but at the same time breaking British law.

Re: British standards ???
 

So you would do nothing to discourage, educate or change the extreme views of those in the immigrant communities or yours.
All you would do is to increase the division between communities that extremists on both sides are fermenting.
I call that real progress ( not ).
There is only one way forward and that is education and assimilation

Of course this is much easier said than done but all that is happening at the moment is that atitudes on both sides are hardening.
Moderate and informed parts ( the majority ) of the muslim community see headlines in the Mail and express suggesting that they are all bearded, wife /child abusing potential bombers.
The same simplistic media and TV stories just reinforce the predjudices held by you and like minded.
What really saddens me is that you seem to have a blinkered approach to the questions of abuse.
Abuse within the white UK population is considerably higher ( in cases ) why do you just focus on one part of the population.

Re: British standards ???
 

Education and such has done nothing to improve the situation of those girls, in fact the numbers are increasing, more and more girls are suffering.

So the time for trying to educate is long gone, jail those involved, parents imans, arrangers.

I nice ten year term in jail will deter others, or let them move to a county where that sort of practice is allowed or even encoraged.

LynneR is very fond of telling people to move elsewhere, where the regime is more suitable to one circumstances, so it can´t be all that wrong can it?

Re: British standards ???
 

ME ME yet again you have got it wrong, I said that 99.99% of the global Muslim population was just getting on with their lives.
That you intepret that as meaning that 99.99% in the UK is breaking the law and only 0.1% is lawabiding sadly says an awfull lot about you and you bigoted views.
With views like that there is no hope for you and for anyone else who shares your views,
I really do feel sorry for you.

Re: British standards ???
 

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Re: British standards ???
 

in Britain there are now 85 Sharia councils implementing Sharia law on the streets of London, Birmingham, Bradford and elsewhere.

Says it all really:thumbdown:

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Have you been reading the Express again or has cocktail hour started already.

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Came from an Asian woman who leads a womens aid project in her report.

Re: British standards ???
 

Do you even know what Sharia law is, just google it and come up with a simple explanation because from what I could read muslims scholars have been debating it in just about every country where islam is practised for the last 1200 years.

Re: British standards ???
 

Read the post about children.. http://www.secularism.org.uk/blog/20...n-or-elsewhere

Re: British standards ???
 

Me Me, here's the part of my response that you conveniently ignored. What part of that don't YOU understand?

Here are just a few examples of the work being done from amongst the members of the Muslim community to combat forced marriage and so-called honour crimes:-

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/28/wo...anted=all&_r=0

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/real-li...scaped-1327180

http://www.wewillinspire.com/index.p...ons/who-we-are

http://www.southallblacksisters.org.uk/abuse/

These aren't the only ones, by any means. But you won't want to know about them, will you, because they don't fit your stereotypical view that all Muslims support such practices.

It's almost incredible to think that it is only this year that the age of consent in Spain was raised from 13 to 16, it having stayed so low for years because it was an accepted practice within the gypsy community for girls to be married off so young. Good for Spain that they had the courage and the will to take a step that no longer pandered to the cultural practices of a minority.

Re: British standards ???
 

Please explain to me what "YKWYA" means?

Re: British standards ???
 

Why do we need to know what it is ? do 99.99% of Muslims abide by this law ??

I don't know about Spain but Sharia law has no jurisdiction under the law of England and Wales and the courts do not recognise it. There is no parallel court system in this country, and we have no intention of changing the position in any part of England and Wales

Based on this I don't need / want to Google it cos it means does not affect me unless I step foot in a muslim country which frankly aint gonna happen.................ever

Re: British standards ???
 

Do you actually know what "Sharia law" means Mr Griffin?

Re: British standards ???
 

[QUOTE=andyrich666
There is no parallel court system in this country, and we have no intention of changing the position in any part of England and Wales

[/QUOTE]

Well, as a matter of fact, there is:-


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...s-1765888.html


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...al-ruling.html

Read the second link in particular, because this acceptance by the British High Court of a decision of a rabbinical court is thought to bring the eventual acceptance of sharia law (at least in part) becoming recognised in Britain somewhat closer.

Re: British standards ???
 

I dont need to know, dont want to know, Does one of the things say that A Muslim who leaves Islam must be killed immediately.

lovely people

Re: British standards ???
 

Question:

Why are rape victims often punished by Islamic courts as adulterers?


Summary Answer:
Under Islamic law, rape can only be proven if the rapist confesses or if there are four male witnesses. Women who allege rape without the benefit of the act having been witnessed by four men who subsequently develop a conscience are actually confessing to having sex. If they or the accused happens to be married, then it is considered to be adultery.

Re: British standards ???
 

If they bring it in then let them have their own prisons

Re: British standards ???
 

I have a flat in East London which I bought donks ago. It is now in an almost totally Muslim area, and they have, understandably, brought their culture with them, and have built mosques for places to worship and schools for their children and everything else to make them feel at home.

The original British population have mostly moved out when their lives became too uncomfortable for them.

What sensible comment can you make? I couldn't move back there and if I returned to the UK would sell my place to live somewhere else, because I would feel too uncomfortable to live there now.

That's the reality and that's how it is - my former local pub is now a very nice looking mosque. I believe Sharia law is administered from a house a hundred yards or so from where my flat is situated.

I believe in live and let live and I have no problem with the Muslim population who live there, but I couldn't live that way because I'm not a Muslim.

Re: British standards ???
 

All this crap has no place in the UK.

It is difficult enough under British law to get a conviction for rape, (that is why so many do not bother to prosecute) and usually it is the word of one man against of one woman.

If there has to be 4 male witnesses then there is no chance for justice for the woman.

If find the whole thing disgusting.:thumbdown::thumbdown:

A rapist would not have to be a genius to work out that you can get off scott free if you only rape infront of 3 witnesses. (sick)

Re: British standards ???
 

So all men are complicit in the rape of women? That is what you appear to be saying.
By the way what does "YKWYA" mean?

Re: British standards ???
 

No wonder they gang rape, they have all the witnesses

Re: British standards ???
 

You Know Who You Are.

Rosemary

Re: British standards ???
 

I don't think you know what you are saying!

Re: British standards ???
 

Thank you for that Rosemary but in the context of the original post, it is nonsensical perhaps me me can enlighten us?

Re: British standards ???
 

I read it all now, but its family law and not criminal law, re their divorces, tbf who gives a shit ?

The criminal matters is much different and warrant no place in our society

Re: British standards ???
 

I agree, disgusting in the extreme, as to my mind are any apologists who try to feebly excuse such obscenities occuring in what should by now be an equal rights civilised society.

Re: British standards ???
 

No, that is not what I am saying, read the post again.

Re: British standards ???
 

I agree DD, and when those apologists and the ones that keep their gobs shut are women, even worse.

And TKWTA. :thumbdown::thumbdown:

Because no matter what islam is not an equal rights for both sexes religion, and it is always the woman that gets the mucky end of the stick.

It may be a good idea for those apologists to read the followin article about sharia in the UK, it makes grim reading.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...ia-courts.html

There is no place for any of this, if people want to live by sharia law, they should go to a country where it is the norm.

Nobody should have any law above the law of the land, if not is a bad road to go down.

The UK has enough problems without the extra ones that sharia brings.

It comes to something when the tails wags the dog, manda huevos!!!

Re: British standards ???
 

It's a good thing that there are no such apologists here then isn't it?

Re: British standards ???
 

Talking of the mucky end of the stick, it's not a good place for a bloke to be gay either.

Re: British standards ???
 

I've gotta say... that was absolutely brilliant. It was brilliant how you guys turned the whole discussion into an almost impossible one where now, if anyone says anything they have been twisted into looking like someone who endorses rape.... absolutely brilliant. I mean lets be clear, it's blatant trolling but brilliant all the same....


Now, what was I saying? Oh yeah, that's right....


So... Christians.... they rape too right? White Britons molest kids right? The vast majority of child rapists are white right?..... No, you guys are right, it's all down to the Muslims....

Re: British standards ???
 

You noticed as well...

Re: British standards ???
 

Fun here innit?

Re: British standards ???
 

Yes Christians rape, white Britons molest kids, and lets say for argument sake that the vast majority of child rapists are white, Happy now?

But we have a terrible situation in the UK (lthought I don´t suppose you watched the programme about forced marriages, whereas I did) where one group of men who have sex with underage girls, find themselves in court for having sex with underage girls (abuse).

Then there is another group (muslims that were shown in the TV prog) that are marrying underage girls, and telling their parents that it is OK for them to live as wifes as under Sharia law they are lawfully married because they have reached puberty.

So although both groups of men are doing the same abuse, one group ends up shamed in court, sentenced, put on the sex register, and the other group (muslims) are seen as saviours of girls honour, and sought after to perform marriages by he families of the girls in question.

The famlies of the victims of Stuart Hall, Jimmy Saville and such are horrified at what happened to thier children at the hands of these monsters, but in some communities marrying a 14 year old (even against her will) is seen as doing the right thing and applauded by the community.

Same country (UK) but different rules for some, surely that is not right.

Re: British standards ???
 

wonder if the same people who defend the muslims also defend gays in other threads on BE.

Because I don´t think that is possible, the muslim defenders obvioulsly must be against gays.

So there can be no sitting on the fence for this question

Re: British standards ???
 

Better that you stay in Spain then and pay your taxes there if you do not want to live in the UK as it is now,
Surely its price worth paying with your views.

Re: British standards ???
 

Think you'll find they do. ;)

Re: British standards ???
 

I bet you dropped to your knees with a clenched fist held into the air as you finished typing that, screaming "Whhhhhy??????????! Whhhhhhyyyyyyy!!!??????"