help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
May 16th 2013, 10:18 am
#46
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Posts: 782
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
What A&F do though is just a brand building exercise. They’ve created themselves as an exclusive, aspirational clothing brand for young, fit, good looking, preppy American college kids.
In lots of instances when people shop, they shop a brand up from their actually social positioning, as they perceive that by doing so the brand attributes they associate with the up level product will transfer to them and by associated with them by others – I have an A&F t-shirt on therefore I’m in the A&F ‘gang’, therefore I’m good young/thin/good looking. A&F know this and they know that the brand they’ve created has an exclusive cache amongst those who aspire to be or to associate with types who are like the models they use in their ads and stores.
In 2006 A&F CEO Mike Jeffries said, “In every school there are the cool and popular kids, and then there are the not-so-cool kids,” he told the site. “Candidly, we go after the cool kids. We go after the attractive all-American kid with a great attitude and a lot of friends. A lot of people don’t belong [in our clothes], and they can’t belong. Are we exclusionary? Absolutely. Those companies that are in trouble are trying to target everybody: young, old, fat, skinny. But then you become totally vanilla. You don’t alienate anybody, but you don’t excite anybody, either,”
On the face of it a fairly horrible statement, but completely in tone with their brand image and associations and reinforcing the perception that if you wear A&F you are in the cool and popular gang. Let’s be honest, if they only sold their clothes to those who fit the model good looks and body that they portray as being their target market they’d sell a lot fewer skinny t-shirts. However, kids are stupid, parents are stupid, people are stupid so they buy this stuff because of the way it’s been marketed to them/their kids.
In lots of instances when people shop, they shop a brand up from their actually social positioning, as they perceive that by doing so the brand attributes they associate with the up level product will transfer to them and by associated with them by others – I have an A&F t-shirt on therefore I’m in the A&F ‘gang’, therefore I’m good young/thin/good looking. A&F know this and they know that the brand they’ve created has an exclusive cache amongst those who aspire to be or to associate with types who are like the models they use in their ads and stores.
In 2006 A&F CEO Mike Jeffries said, “In every school there are the cool and popular kids, and then there are the not-so-cool kids,” he told the site. “Candidly, we go after the cool kids. We go after the attractive all-American kid with a great attitude and a lot of friends. A lot of people don’t belong [in our clothes], and they can’t belong. Are we exclusionary? Absolutely. Those companies that are in trouble are trying to target everybody: young, old, fat, skinny. But then you become totally vanilla. You don’t alienate anybody, but you don’t excite anybody, either,”
On the face of it a fairly horrible statement, but completely in tone with their brand image and associations and reinforcing the perception that if you wear A&F you are in the cool and popular gang. Let’s be honest, if they only sold their clothes to those who fit the model good looks and body that they portray as being their target market they’d sell a lot fewer skinny t-shirts. However, kids are stupid, parents are stupid, people are stupid so they buy this stuff because of the way it’s been marketed to them/their kids.
May 16th 2013, 10:19 am
#47
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Posts: 2,502
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
How fat are you?
I have a 31' waist. It's a right pain as most trousers and shorts are either 30' or 32' whereas 31' is perfect.
I would much rather be skinny than fat. The health problems that come with being overweight are significant, you're likely to live a much shorter life and suffer from more illnesses.
I have a 31' waist. It's a right pain as most trousers and shorts are either 30' or 32' whereas 31' is perfect.
I would much rather be skinny than fat. The health problems that come with being overweight are significant, you're likely to live a much shorter life and suffer from more illnesses.
I'd much rather be my size and build than skinny. No shadow of doubt in that.
If A&F didn't fit, I wouldn't wear it.
Don't get me wrong, it's annoying going into River Island or somewhere for a cheap pair of chinos / shorts and realising they only go up to a 36 waist....well, it's annoying until you remember that nice shops go higher
If A&F didn't fit, I wouldn't wear it.
Don't get me wrong, it's annoying going into River Island or somewhere for a cheap pair of chinos / shorts and realising they only go up to a 36 waist....well, it's annoying until you remember that nice shops go higher
May 16th 2013, 10:20 am
#48
Shark Fisherman
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Doha
Posts: 4,568
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
How fat are you?
I have a 31' waist. It's a right pain as most trousers and shorts are either 30' or 32' whereas 31' is perfect.
I would much rather be skinny than fat. The health problems that come with being overweight are significant, you're likely to live a much shorter life and suffer from more illnesses.
I have a 31' waist. It's a right pain as most trousers and shorts are either 30' or 32' whereas 31' is perfect.
I would much rather be skinny than fat. The health problems that come with being overweight are significant, you're likely to live a much shorter life and suffer from more illnesses.
Unless you are 4'6"and a jockey.
Last edited by britexpat76; May 16th 2013 at 10:21 am. Reason: Jockeys.
May 16th 2013, 10:21 am
#49
Hit 16's
Joined: Mar 2010
Location: Of all the gin joints, in all the towns, in all the world, she walks into mine
Posts: 13,112
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
I am going to have to respecfully disagree.
If we want to live in a democractic society one of the principles we must accept is the prohibition of discrimination in the public sphere. In democratic societies that includes no discrimination against customers who can afford the product.
If we want to live in a democractic society one of the principles we must accept is the prohibition of discrimination in the public sphere. In democratic societies that includes no discrimination against customers who can afford the product.
Refusing to make clothes in a certain size is not A&F's problem nor is it discriminatory.
A&F, as with any business, is offering a product. It doesn't matter who wants to buy the product, A&F can't prevent the sale of that product to the customer as long as the customer has the money to pay for the sale. Bahtboy was implying that A&F has the right to deliberately not sell to a certain customer (discrimination), not that A&F has the right to not make something in a certain size (not discrimination).
It's not A&F's problem if someone buys something way too small.
A&F, as with any business, is offering a product. It doesn't matter who wants to buy the product, A&F can't prevent the sale of that product to the customer as long as the customer has the money to pay for the sale. Bahtboy was implying that A&F has the right to deliberately not sell to a certain customer (discrimination), not that A&F has the right to not make something in a certain size (not discrimination).
It's not A&F's problem if someone buys something way too small.
I really like Paul Smith stuff. They don't make suits that accommodate my Ray Winston-sized chest. That's for me to do something about, not them.
May 16th 2013, 10:26 am
#50
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Posts: 0
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
How fat are you?
I have a 31' waist. It's a right pain as most trousers and shorts are either 30' or 32' whereas 31' is perfect.
I would much rather be skinny than fat. The health problems that come with being overweight are significant, you're likely to live a much shorter life and suffer from more illnesses.
I have a 31' waist. It's a right pain as most trousers and shorts are either 30' or 32' whereas 31' is perfect.
I would much rather be skinny than fat. The health problems that come with being overweight are significant, you're likely to live a much shorter life and suffer from more illnesses.
Because of my height I don't look too lardy, which is great. But I do look a bit like a sausage. Broad shoulders and just a solid width all the way down. Like a sausage, but human.
It means I have a big waist - 38 generally works well, but I needn't have the cock / arse area the size of a tent like a lot of 38 waisters need.
This is hard to explain.
I'm fat, but not. Trousers and shorts are a ****ing nightmare.
May 16th 2013, 10:27 am
#51
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2008
Location: Dubai, United Arab Emirates
Posts: 930
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
How fat are you?
I have a 31' waist. It's a right pain as most trousers and shorts are either 30' or 32' whereas 31' is perfect.
I would much rather be skinny than fat. The health problems that come with being overweight are significant, you're likely to live a much shorter life and suffer from more illnesses.
I have a 31' waist. It's a right pain as most trousers and shorts are either 30' or 32' whereas 31' is perfect.
I would much rather be skinny than fat. The health problems that come with being overweight are significant, you're likely to live a much shorter life and suffer from more illnesses.
May 16th 2013, 10:29 am
#52
Hit 16's
Joined: Mar 2010
Location: Of all the gin joints, in all the towns, in all the world, she walks into mine
Posts: 13,112
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
I don't know what works unfortunately, but i think it starts with acceptance, a non-judgemental stance and the knowledge that there isnt much you can do to help other than let them come to their own conclusions and decide to do something about it on their own. Do you think for one second a fat person doesn't realise they are fat? or, for that matter, the basic rules of how not to be fat?
Trying to help someone else by controlling or heavily influencing their behaviour and/or getting pissed off when they don't listen or rtake your advice is called codependancy.
Trying to help someone else by controlling or heavily influencing their behaviour and/or getting pissed off when they don't listen or rtake your advice is called codependancy.
May 16th 2013, 10:31 am
#53
Shark Fisherman
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Doha
Posts: 4,568
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
I don't, coz I am one and I know it. And I, too, don't know what works--so far constant reminders from Bahtatgirl (which I encourage) haven't worked, self-realisation (which I've always had) doesn't work, kind words don't work, knowledge of what to eat doesn't work, half-getting there didn't work, not being able to wear half my wardrobe doesn't work.
May 16th 2013, 10:32 am
#54
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 0
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
I don't, coz I am one and I know it. And I, too, don't know what works--so far constant reminders from Bahtatgirl (which I encourage) haven't worked, self-realisation (which I've always had) doesn't work, kind words don't work, knowledge of what to eat doesn't work, half-getting there didn't work, not being able to wear half my wardrobe doesn't work.
May 16th 2013, 10:34 am
#57
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Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Downtown, Dubai
Posts: 782
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
If we want to live in a democractic society one of the principles we must accept is the prohibition of discrimination in the public sphere. When you operate a for-profit business you are operating in the public sphere and as such you cannot discriminate against customers for reasons other than the price of the good being sold (which represents the cost of your goods/services). The only exception to this would be if the business has a genuine fear that the sale of the product to a certain client can lead to ill-harm against the public elswhere, but the business would have to demonstrably justify their concerns.
A&F have simply chosen a desired target demographic for their product, and produced and marketed to fit. That in itself is not unusual, they are just on the fringes of what is normal for such a practice.
May 16th 2013, 10:35 am
#59
Bored liberal
Joined: Feb 2007
Location: Over there ----->
Posts: 13,713
May 16th 2013, 10:36 am
#60
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Posts: 2,502
Re: help to change Abercrombie & Fitch's brand message
You know, Scamp.
You've made it clear you smoke a lot. You eat junk food. You're a right solid boozer. You don't exercise. You're heavy. You seem rather proud of it.
That's what I find curious about people with similar mindsets - they know what they do isn't healthy and that it will have detrimental consequences at some point but they somehow take pleasure in it. Is it their way of thumbing their noses at convention?
Of course it's people like me who'll end up being stuck with the NHS bills due to your early and painful deaths.
You've made it clear you smoke a lot. You eat junk food. You're a right solid boozer. You don't exercise. You're heavy. You seem rather proud of it.
That's what I find curious about people with similar mindsets - they know what they do isn't healthy and that it will have detrimental consequences at some point but they somehow take pleasure in it. Is it their way of thumbing their noses at convention?
Of course it's people like me who'll end up being stuck with the NHS bills due to your early and painful deaths.