"Jim Ley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:08:13 -0800, "PTravel" <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    > >I don't buy travel insurance.
    > So maybe that is something to do instead of recommending people take
    > excessive precuations with their passport.

What "excessive precautions"? I suggested leaving the passport in the hotel
room (I leave it in my locked carryon) and carrying a photocopy of the first
page.

Do you think that is excessive, compared to the inconvenience of replacing a
lost or stolen passport?


Why buy travel insurance when it is entirely unnecessary for many people?

    > >And, yes, you're still on holiday and, possibly, paying extortionate
hotel
    > >rates because you had to extend your stay at the last minute, not seeing
the
    > >other locations you had planned to visit,
    > Why does not having your passport do anything to stop you visiting
    > places in the same country?

Nothing. What if your plans were to visit another country? Or return home?

    > >wasting endless time either
    > >calling or visiting the consulate asking, "is it soup yet?"
    > Why would you bother doing this? if they've told you it'll take a
    > week, it'll take a week, you don't need to call them until then.

You're obviously very unfamiliar with American bureaucracy.

    > >I am, constantly, both fascinated and appalled by people who think the
way
    > >they live their lives is the only way anyone should live their lives.
    > I don't quite see how that follows from my suggestion to not stress
    > about not having your passport so as it ruins your holiday, but to
    > just carry on enjoying your holiday.

Your suggestion was to not stress about missing connections, having to
extend stays, missing meetings, etc.

    > >I've just returned from two weeks in China, split more-or-less evenly
    > >between Beijing and Shanghai. If I had lost my passport towards the end
of
    > >my stay in Beijing, I would have missed an important business meeting in
    > >Shanghai which could not be re-scheduled,
    > I didn't realise you required a passport to travel from Beijing to
    > Shanghai?

You don't, but you do require one to return to the US from Shanghai.

    > Jim.

"Jim Ley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

<snip>

    > I didn't realise you required a passport to travel from Beijing to
    > Shanghai?

Actually, now that I think about it, as an American citizen you most
certainly DO need a passport to travel from Beijing to Shanghai.

    > Jim.

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:01:24 -0800, "PTravel" <[email protected]>
wrote:

    |
    |"Kato" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    |news:[email protected]. com...
    |> Lately, I've been hearing that most people now only carry a copy of their
    |> passports while walking around on vacation. While leaving the original
    |> in the hotel safe or hidden well in the suitcase. Is this wise?
    |>
    |> Am I missing something by carrying the original around?
    |
    |You're running the risk of losing it or having it stolen. Having to replace
    |a passport is a sure way to ruin at least part of a vacation.
    |
    |>
    |>
    |

I use a "secret wallet" inside my pants. I consider that a far more
secure location than a hotel safe - particularly when the great
majority of hotels I stayed in around Europe only had a central safe
for the hotel, not individual room safes. That's when a safe was
actually available to customers - the only "stars" for some were those
you could see out of the window at night.

I'd have to drop my pants and remove the belt to lose my passport or
have it stolen. If I'm in a situation where that is required, I'm in
much more trouble than just losing my passport:-)


Cheers, Alan, Australia

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 18:05:12 GMT, [email protected] (Jim Ley) wrote:

    |
    |How does it "ruin" a holiday - you visit your embassy or consulate,
    |you chat to the nice people in there, they sort you out.
    |
    |Okay it takes some time, it's inconvenient, but does it really "ruin"
    |the entire holiday?
    |
    |Jim.

It sure won't add to the enjoyment if you're in a little town far from
the embassy, in a foreign land where you don't speak the language and
they don't speak yours, and your money disappeared with the passport.


Cheers, Alan, Australia

In the "carry passport or copy" thread

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:08:13 -0800, "PTravel" <[email protected]>
wrote:
<snip>
    |
    |I've just returned from two weeks in China, split more-or-less evenly
    |between Beijing and Shanghai.
<snip>

I'd appreciate some advice. I'm planning a rtw trip for next year. The
trans-pacific leg after Narita can be via Shanghai or Hong-Kong for a
two or three night stop-over.

Of the two, which would you recommend for a non-business
first-time-in-China tourist. We're not there to shop - we'll probably
do that in Singapore or Bangkok. Also, do you know whether an
Australian will need a visa in HK or Shanghai (yes, I'll also check
dfat:-)?

TIA


Cheers, Alan, Australia

"I'd appreciate some advice. I'm planning a rtw trip for next year. The
trans-pacific leg after Narita can be via Shanghai or Hong-Kong for a
two or three night stop-over. Of the two, which would you recommend
for a non-business first-time-in-China tourist."

I'd recommend Hong Kong. Spend half a day seeing the skyscraper area
and the Peak, then go to Tsim Sha Tsui at night, spend the next day
seeing the temples and markets and traditional craft areas, and then
the next day take a day trip to Macau.

"We're not there to shop - we'll probably do that in Singapore or
Bangkok. Also, do you know whether an Australian will need a visa in HK
or Shanghai (yes, I'll also check dfat:-)?"

Check with the Chinese embassy or consulate in your city.

EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) wrote:

    > chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn wrote:
    >> In cases where you have to prove age or nationality (for example, you
    >> get reduced rates to certain museums in some countries depending on age
    >> or, say, EU nationality) it might be useful.
    > On the other hand, it depends upon one's age - I may not look quite as
    > old as I really am, but no one questions my "senior citizen" status!
I'm guessing 74-75. Close???

"Alan S" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:01:24 -0800, "PTravel" <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    > |
    > |"Kato" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > |news:[email protected]. com...
    > |> Lately, I've been hearing that most people now only carry a copy of
their
    > |> passports while walking around on vacation. While leaving the original
    > |> in the hotel safe or hidden well in the suitcase. Is this wise?
    > |>
    > |> Am I missing something by carrying the original around?
    > |
    > |You're running the risk of losing it or having it stolen. Having to
replace
    > |a passport is a sure way to ruin at least part of a vacation.
    > |
    > |>
    > |>
    > |
    > I use a "secret wallet" inside my pants.

I use one of those as well.

    > I consider that a far more
    > secure location than a hotel safe - particularly when the great
    > majority of hotels I stayed in around Europe only had a central safe
    > for the hotel, not individual room safes.

My stays have almost always been hotels with individual room safes.
However, I consider my locked carryon "safer" than an individual room safe.

    > That's when a safe was
    > actually available to customers - the only "stars" for some were those
    > you could see out of the window at night.
    > I'd have to drop my pants and remove the belt to lose my passport or
    > have it stolen. If I'm in a situation where that is required, I'm in
    > much more trouble than just losing my passport:-)

I have two concerns with the hidden wallets (I use one that loops around my
belt and lies inside my pants along my leg): when I take it out (I don't
have to strip to access it), it's in view of anyone who might wish to steal
it but, primarily, I am often caught in the rain and I, the wallet, and what
ever is in it, winds up getting soaked.

    > Cheers, Alan, Australia

"Alan S" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > In the "carry passport or copy" thread
    > On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:08:13 -0800, "PTravel" <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    > <snip>
    > |
    > |I've just returned from two weeks in China, split more-or-less evenly
    > |between Beijing and Shanghai.
    > <snip>
    > I'd appreciate some advice. I'm planning a rtw trip for next year. The
    > trans-pacific leg after Narita can be via Shanghai or Hong-Kong for a
    > two or three night stop-over.
    > Of the two, which would you recommend for a non-business
    > first-time-in-China tourist. We're not there to shop - we'll probably
    > do that in Singapore or Bangkok. Also, do you know whether an
    > Australian will need a visa in HK or Shanghai (yes, I'll also check
    > dfat:-)?

I'd probably lean more towards Hong Kong.

Shanghai is a spectacular city -- ultra- modern, though with some of
revolutionary China still present. There are interesting historic towns
within an hour and a half drive from the city that are preserved, more or
less, as they have been for the last 300 years. However, the primary focus
of Shanghai is modernity -- it is, frankly, one of the most impressive
cities I've seen anywhere in the world. Still, skyscrapers are skyscrapers
and, personally, I don't care for Shanghainese cooking -- it's a little
bland. Shanghai can also be a little difficult to get around. It's a very,
very big city. Taxis in China are inexpensive (most trips will cost $1-2
US), but can be hard to find in Shanghai during rush hour or when it's
raining. For a big city, traffic moves surprisingly well, but it can still
take 30-40 minutes to get from Pudong (the newest and most modern section)
to the Bund (the older treaty-port section).

Hong Kong is unique in the world -- an amazing, sometimes schizophrenic, mix
of Chinese and western culture. There is plenty of "old China" to be seen
in Hong Kong, as well as impressive architecture (the Hong Kong skyline as
seen from Kowloon is breath-taking). The British influence in Hong Kong is
unmistakable, and Hong Kongese enjoy a special status that distinguishes
them from other PRC citizens, so the "Chinese experience" will be more that
of pre-revolutionary China than you'll find in Shanghai. Hong Kong, being a
world port, has cuisine from all over the world and, of course, being in
south China, there's lots of Cantonese restaurants - I find Cantonese
cooking the most varied and the tastiest of the various styles.

Hong Kong is a much more expensive city than Shanghai. Hong Kong has a
superb subway system -- spotlessly clean, fast and efficient, and not very
expensive. A 20 minute subway ride will take you from Hong Kong island to
little fishing towns on the edge of the New Territories where you can select
your dinner from the live fish, lobsters and crabs set out in front of all
the waterfront restaurants.

It is very easy to go over to the PRC from Hong Kong. There are ferries
that can take you to Shenzhen in about 45 minutes (though I wouldn't
recommend Shenzhen unless you're interested in shopping -- it's a shiny,
new, but relatively generic, city). You can also take the ferry to Macau,
the former Portugese colony, for a different take on Chinese/western mix.
There are express trains that can take you Guangzhou in Canton province in
about an hour. Guangzhou is "old fashioned" revolutionary China, and also
has some very interesting pre-revolutionary sites, Budhist temples, etc.
Both Guangzhou and Macau are easy day trips from Hong Kong -- if you have
enough time, you'll get a much more varied experience by visiting all three.
Macau can easily be seen in one day, including a visit to the casinos.
Guangzhou can easily merit more time, but one day there will give you the
flavor of urban, post-revolutionary China (and Guangzhou has some wonderful
restaurants -- you can get great seafood and, if you're inclined, snake).

If this is your one trip to China, I'd suggest Hong Kong, but also strongly
urge that you take a couple of day trips to Macau and Guangzhou.



    > TIA
    > Cheers, Alan, Australia

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] oups.com...
    > "I'd appreciate some advice. I'm planning a rtw trip for next year. The
    > trans-pacific leg after Narita can be via Shanghai or Hong-Kong for a
    > two or three night stop-over. Of the two, which would you recommend
    > for a non-business first-time-in-China tourist."
    > I'd recommend Hong Kong. Spend half a day seeing the skyscraper area
    > and the Peak, then go to Tsim Sha Tsui at night, spend the next day
    > seeing the temples and markets and traditional craft areas, and then
    > the next day take a day trip to Macau.

That's a good plan. I'd suggest, though, visiting the Peak at night. The
view is impressive at any time, but most of the buildings on Hong Kong
island are beautifully illuminated with colored lights and the effect at
night is magical.

    > "We're not there to shop - we'll probably do that in Singapore or
    > Bangkok. Also, do you know whether an Australian will need a visa in HK
    > or Shanghai (yes, I'll also check dfat:-)?"
    > Check with the Chinese embassy or consulate in your city.

Oh, I forgot to mention about that.

China maintains comprehensive websites for each of its consulates and
embassies, so it's easy to look up the requirements. If they are the same
as for the US, Alan would not need a visa for Hong Kong, but would need a
visa for anywhere in the PRC, including, if I recall correctly, Macau. If
he does two day trips, one to Guangzhou and one to Macau, he would need a
multiple-entry visa, as each day trip would constitute an "entry" into the
PRC.

"If they are the same as for the US, Alan would not need a visa for
Hong Kong, but would need a visa for anywhere in the PRC, including, if
I recall correctly, Macau."

I'm a US citizen, and I didn't need a PRC visa to visit Macau. To
visit Shenzen, I went to the train station at the Hong Kong-mainland
border at Lo Wu and got a limited visa there that only covered Shenzen.
Guangzhou I think he would need a full PRC visa for.

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] oups.com...
    > "If they are the same as for the US, Alan would not need a visa for
    > Hong Kong, but would need a visa for anywhere in the PRC, including, if
    > I recall correctly, Macau."
    > I'm a US citizen, and I didn't need a PRC visa to visit Macau. To
    > visit Shenzen, I went to the train station at the Hong Kong-mainland
    > border at Lo Wu and got a limited visa there that only covered Shenzen.
    > Guangzhou I think he would need a full PRC visa for.

I couldn't remember whether I needed a visa for Macau or not. There are
limited visas available at Shenzhen, but I don't think there's a lot of
point in visiting the city, unless you're interested in shopping or golf.
Guangzhou does require a standard PRC visa.

    >

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 16:49:16 -0800, "PTravel" <[email protected]>
wrote:

    |
    |I have two concerns with the hidden wallets (I use one that loops around my
    |belt and lies inside my pants along my leg): when I take it out (I don't
    |have to strip to access it), it's in view of anyone who might wish to steal
    |it but, primarily, I am often caught in the rain and I, the wallet, and what
    |ever is in it, winds up getting soaked.

Never had either problem in 19 weeks through over 20 countries (some
three days, others 3 weeks) last time.

And it was a nice comforting feeling to always know exactly where
those critical items - passport, airline tickets, international
driver's licence, backup cc and backup cash - were at all times.

Taking it out was a simple pull on the loop, capable of being done
quite discreetly. But, unlike my normal wallet, it was still attached
to my belt. It never got wet, not even from my own perspiration on a
hot day in the Forum.

Why do you feel that a locked case can't be stolen from your room, or
an airline overhead locker - or anywhere? If it's a carry-on, even a
thief on a passing Vespa or Lambretti could nick it.


Cheers, Alan, Australia

"Alan S" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 16:49:16 -0800, "PTravel" <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    > |
    > |I have two concerns with the hidden wallets (I use one that loops around
    > my
    > |belt and lies inside my pants along my leg): when I take it out (I don't
    > |have to strip to access it), it's in view of anyone who might wish to
    > steal
    > |it but, primarily, I am often caught in the rain and I, the wallet, and
    > what
    > |ever is in it, winds up getting soaked.
    > Never had either problem in 19 weeks through over 20 countries (some
    > three days, others 3 weeks) last time.
    > And it was a nice comforting feeling to always know exactly where
    > those critical items - passport, airline tickets, international
    > driver's licence, backup cc and backup cash - were at all times.
    > Taking it out was a simple pull on the loop, capable of being done
    > quite discreetly. But, unlike my normal wallet, it was still attached
    > to my belt. It never got wet, not even from my own perspiration on a
    > hot day in the Forum.

I shoot lots of video when I travel, and often do it in the rain. My
belt-loop wallet (along with the rest of me) has gotten absolutely soaked,
to the point where I had to lay my cash out to dry. It's easy to take the
wallet out, but I'd also prefer that, if others can see I've got it, nothing
critical be in it.

    > Why do you feel that a locked case can't be stolen from your room,

On the contrary, it can. However, since I believe most hotel room theft is
committed by employees, the first place they'll look is the room safe -- if
it's in use, they'll assume there are valuables inside. My carryon is one
of those Tumi wheeled computer cases. It has little Tumi locks all over it.
Though it could easily be removed from the room, I think an employee/thief
would be unlikely to do so without some assurance that there are significant
valuables inside. I don't think they'd risk breaking the lock without
taking the bag, because the break-in would be easily noted, unlike opening
and reclosing a safe.

    > or
    > an airline overhead locker - or anywhere? If it's a carry-on, even a
    > thief on a passing Vespa or Lambretti could nick it.

Sure, but we're talking about leaving it in a hotel room. For what it's
worth, I've used room safes, as well, and have never had any problem
whatsoever in dozens and dozens of trips all over the world. As I noted in
another post, however, I have had at least two attempts made at picking my
pocket. I'd just as soon not have irreplaceable valuables on my person.

    > Cheers, Alan, Australia

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 22:17:32 +0100, [email protected]
(chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn) wrote:

    >irwell <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 17:11:50 +0100, [email protected]
    >> (chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn) wrote:
    >>
    >> >irwell <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> >
    >> >[]
    >> >> We have just finished booking two hotels in London
    >> >> on the internet. One because booking ahead is essential
    >> >> to ensure a room and (2) to get a decent rate.
    >> >> Both bookings require Credit Card confirmation and
    >> >> also require a photo ID at check-in.
    >> >
    >> >Which hotels? I've never once had to show a photo ID at a UK hotel. They
    >> >might need to see a passport for a foreign arrival, but even that is
    >> >rare.
    >> The same requirements are for the National/Imperial/Tavistock
    >> group of hotels, and the second is for the Royal Norfolk at Paddington.
    >> Do a 'dummy' booking and see for yourself, anyway that is what it
    >> states on the confimations from both groups.
    >If it did, it's a load of rubbish- you will not need to show a photo ID
    >at check-in. If you're from outside the UK, you'll be asked to fill in
    >your passport information. They will not look at your passport however.
    >> >> Same with the
    >> >> Eurostar reservation and booking, the tix are to be
    >> >> picked up at Waterloo and the Credit Card used for the
    >> >> booking and a phot ID will be required.
    >> >
    >> >Do you have a quote on that? I find it hard to believe as you can pick
    >> >up your tickets from _automated_ ticket machines. All you need is the
    >> >card you used for the booking.
    >> Here is the exact quote from the Eurostar confirmation, again try a
    >> 'dummy booking' if you don't believe it.
    >I don't need to. I've travelled Eurostar before, and I picked up the
    >tickets by using the self service ticket machine.
    >> Important
    >> Your ticket(s) will be available to collect from the Self Service
    >> Ticket machine or the Eurostar ticket desk at your departure station.
    >>
    >> On your day of travel:
    >> Please allow at least 45 minutes before your departure time to allow
    >> tickets to be issued.
    >> Be ready to show the credit/debit card used for payment, a form
    >> of ID
    >Which in the UK can be almost anything- not necessarily a photo ID.
    >Notice it doesn't say photo ID, which is what you claimed it did.

You are right on that, just ID, it is the hotel booking website
that states a photo ID will be required.
For what it is worth I have never had to show ID at UK
hotels, many times on the Continent though.